Would you want to owna product from a company that does buisness like this?

[BlueAbyss]

Hmm. All the same discussions as when I was in high school 13 years ago... back when 'Apple is about to die, blah blah blah...' Of course, in those days, Apple produced a far more stable and ostensibly superior product. I agree that in those days, the system overall was more stable than a comparable PC... I had nothing but headaches with Windows in those days. Even XP has given me problems, though I have had few (if any) issues that I've heard of others having with Vista. Even so, I'm planning on upgrading to 7, because it will speed things up (gotta love that 64 bit code).

Can anyone tell I'm sort of a tech-geek? Okay, back to Apple. They're still around, and indeed gaining market share (and profits are definitely up). My next computer purchase will be a 21 inch iMac, and I'll be loading W7 onto it. I like having that sort of access, and now Windows is almost Mac-like. Almost... and it will extend the life of my current Dell laptop. Not about to toss something that still works.

Note that there are still Macs in use from the 90's. How often do you see a PC from the 90's? Remember those $2K IBM Aptivas? Well, $2K PowerMacs from the time are still serviceable, I know of at least one person that has a 9600 from the late 90's that processes video.

Oh, and FYI, Apple did license out to 'clones'... some notable names that come to mind are Power Computing (who produced the fastest Mac of the day), and Motorola (shouldn't surprise anyone, they were producing the Mac processors of the day). In the end it hurt the bottom line pretty bad (hardware sales dropped precipitously) so it only lasted for about 3 or so years, from what I can remember.

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by BlueAbyss

Oh, and FYI, Apple did license out to 'clones'... some notable names that come to mind are Power Computing (who produced the fastest Mac of the day), and Motorola (shouldn't surprise anyone, they were producing the Mac processors of the day). In the end it hurt the bottom line pretty bad (hardware sales dropped precipitously) so it only lasted for about 3 or so years, from what I can remember.

Very true. In fact, I owned a Power Computing Powercenter Pro 180. Great computer for the money.

[lastlight]

Originally Posted by Ron99

Power Computing Powercenter Pro 180

Wow and I felt lame initially telling people I had a macBook Pro. That is a mouthful of silly!

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by lastlight

Wow and I felt lame initially telling people I had a macBook Pro. That is a mouthful of silly!

Yeah, that was the days when they used PowerPC processors and there was lots of "power" in the names

Cue yor best Jeremy Clarkson voice shouting "POOOWEERRRRR!!!!"

[BlueAbyss]

Originally Posted by Ron99

Very true. In fact, I owned a Power Computing Powercenter Pro 180. Great computer for the money.

Indeed... about half the price of the comparable Apple hardware, I believe.

And really, all computers have silly name... when people ask me what I have, I say I have a mid-range Dell laptop that works okay for games.

I should chime in on the Apple Google Xerox HTC thing also... Eventually, this is going to work itself out just like back in the day when Microsoft went for Apple's jugular, and Apple fought back. Stuff like this between tech companies happens, it's just the way it goes (and hopefully, we the consumer eventually benefit). Let's just all try to remember that we are the consumers... spend your cash wisely.

And we'll see if iPad doesn't go the way of Newton. Hope Apple has another use for those newly developed (really?) A4 processors.

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by BlueAbyss

And we'll see if iPad doesn't go the way of Newton. Hope Apple has another use for those newly developed (really?) A4 processors.

I suspect they will have another success on their hands. Did you ever use a Newton? I had one years ago. It was a great device but also a bit ahead of its time. If a slightly sleeker newton had debuted around the same time as the palm pilot Apple would probably have killed Palm.

Here's an interesting perspective on Apple vs. the critics:

http://www.theweek.com/article/index..._first_reviews

[Slick Fork]

For the Ipad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQnT0zp8Ya4

Apple's marketing is second to none, period. I think that's where Apple's true genius is. Even in the article you posted Ron, it's tough to disagree with some of the critics. I'll use the iPhone as an example. The first ones were a great idea but poorly implemented. My friend had an original iphone and my $50 LG had a camera while his multi-hundred dollar Iphone didn't his reception was terrible (mine still is). Apple lover's would call it an idea that came before it's time, I'd call it an unpolished product released before it was properly thought out. I've got the 3GS and absolutely love it, and while it's definately an improvement over the previous models, they are not revolutionary leaps forward every time.

Imac's are another good example. They are a nice computer, with a nice user interface. BUT they are no more reliable, or better performing then my PC running windows 7. Apple can charge a premium because
1) they focus their marketing against legacy windows systems like 98SE, 2000, NT, and XP.

and 2) Even I'll admit that the whole package LOOKS really sexy sitting on a desk.
Since the Ipad is featuring in this discussion, and I don't mean to pick on you exclusively Ron, but you like to talk about all the things that the Ipad COULD be and you paint a very pretty picture, it would be nice if the Ipad WAS all those things, but I'm still left with the fact that it ISN'T any of those things you think it MIGHT be one day.

And it's not really about hating Apple or their products, it's the constant rhetoric, negative and misleading advertising that I'm tired of.

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by Slick Fork

For the Ipad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQnT0zp8Ya4

Apple's marketing is second to none, period. I think that's where Apple's true genius is. Even in the article you posted Ron, it's tough to disagree with some of the critics. I'll use the iPhone as an example. The first ones were a great idea but poorly implemented. My friend had an original iphone and my $50 LG had a camera while his multi-hundred dollar Iphone didn't his reception was terrible (mine still is). Apple lover's would call it an idea that came before it's time, I'd call it an unpolished product released before it was properly thought out. I've got the 3GS and absolutely love it, and while it's definately an improvement over the previous models, they are not revolutionary leaps forward every time.

Imac's are another good example. They are a nice computer, with a nice user interface. BUT they are no more reliable, or better performing then my PC running windows 7. Apple can charge a premium because
1) they focus their marketing against legacy windows systems like 98SE, 2000, NT, and XP.

and 2) Even I'll admit that the whole package LOOKS really sexy sitting on a desk.
Since the Ipad is featuring in this discussion, and I don't mean to pick on you exclusively Ron, but you like to talk about all the things that the Ipad COULD be and you paint a very pretty picture, it would be nice if the Ipad WAS all those things, but I'm still left with the fact that it ISN'T any of those things you think it MIGHT be one day.

And it's not really about hating Apple or their products, it's the constant rhetoric, negative and misleading advertising that I'm tired of.

uuhhhhm, my 1st generation iPhone has a camera. Maybe your friend's is a bootleg chinese copy

The whole Mac vs. PC argument is kind of pointless as some will always prefer one over the other. But the reality is that for the average user wanting something they can pull out of the box, plug in and use Macs are better. And they are more stable and have less problems (maybe the margin has closed up now with Windows 7 but time will tell) and you don't have to worry about tons of viruses and malware. That's a fact. Here's another interesting article:

http://www.cio.com/article/569163/Ar...nomyId=3081%22

As for the iPad, my ideas are not flights of fantasy or wild conjetcture and I am sure you will see them shortly. Plenty of great apps that take advantage of the iPads speed and larger screen will come out to show off the potential. Let's talk again in a year and see what happens

BTW, those various Hitler videos are pretty funny. Here's another that shows how evil Apple is in its app approval process:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WB7p...eature=related

[mr.wilson]

My first generation iphone has a camera as well. I had to jailbreak it to use it in Canada, so it has a third party video AP as well. That's something my Iphone 3G doesn't have. Other than 3G and processing speed, I can't think of any changes with the iphone. I prefer the original aluminum case over the current black plastic.

As for operating systems, kudos to Microsoft for creating Windows 7, but it took them long enough The new Hyundai may be as good as a Honda, but it isn't going to have Honda owners changing their buying habits overnight. I'm sure Windows 7 is as good or better than Snow Leopard, but it's only been on the market for 4 months, so you have to understand that the "Apple rhetoric" you are referring to is based on Microsoft's body of work over the past 25 years. I'm not a computer expert by any stretch of the imagination, but I wouldn't dream of expounding the virtues of an aquarium product (pump etc.) that I have only used for a few months.

[Slick Fork]

Originally Posted by Ron99

uuhhhhm, my 1st generation iPhone has a camera. Maybe your friend's is a bootleg chinese copy

The whole Mac vs. PC argument is kind of pointless as some will always prefer one over the other. But the reality is that for the average user wanting something they can pull out of the box, plug in and use Macs are better. And they are more stable and have less problems (maybe the margin has closed up now with Windows 7 but time will tell) and you don't have to worry about tons of viruses and malware. That's a fact. Here's another interesting article:

http://www.cio.com/article/569163/Ar...nomyId=3081%22

As for the iPad, my ideas are not flights of fantasy or wild conjetcture and I am sure you will see them shortly. Plenty of great apps that take advantage of the iPads speed and larger screen will come out to show off the potential. Let's talk again in a year and see what happens

BTW, those various Hitler videos are pretty funny. Here's another that shows how evil Apple is in its app approval process:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WB7p...eature=related

If they have camera's that's my bad then. I could've sworn he complained about not having a camera.

Not really wanting to call your ideas "flights of fancy, but they are possibilities and not reality at this time. I will be curious in a year to see how they do with it. But for now all it is is an Ipod Touch that you can't fit in your pocket.

@Mr. Wilson, Vista was rock solid for me as well but I don't want to kick over that ant hill again. My point was that it's ridiculous and really misleading to compare the most recent Snow Leopard with a 10 year old Microsoft OS. It'd be like Chevrolet comparing the Corvette to a Model T and saying Ford relys on 100 year old technology.