Complex Setups: What gives?

[marie]

Originally Posted by Snappy

I think much depends on what kind of reef you want to keep. I find with my own setup the more equipment I add the better it seems to get, but I have a very crowded sps dominated reef. Now that said, I think one of my better additions lately was adding a refugium and it's very uncomplicated. However, in my limited experience softies & lps are a lot less demanding so require less equipment. So as mentioned it depends a lot on what kind of reef you want to maintain. Below is a photo of the top half of my tank and there is no way I can keep it healthy without a sump and skimmer.

Ok I'll bite . Sps aren't that demanding of fancy equipment. Here is an old pic of my 75g, sumpless, 2 175w metal halides, 3 maxijets and a Prism Pro Hob protien skimmer. This picture was taken just before I took it down.

[Chaotic Cricket]

I found the more equipment I have added over the years the more knowledgeable I've become about things and simply want to automate the process. I do not think the process should be automated that much for someone starting out, you need to learn somehow. That being said some people get off so to speak on having all that equipment, it strokes their egos a bit. Ever seen the people who take up golf or running or squash or biking and have the "pro gear" before they've even tried the sport? Those type of people are in everything its funny when you realize who they are Lastly don't forget that it does cost quite a bit of money to automate your system, and you must decide if the hobby/pets are worth that kind of money spent on them. Same as if someones cat gets sick some people would rush them to the 24hr emergency animal hospital, some will just buy another cat.

[albert_dao]

Originally Posted by Chaotic Cricket

I found the more equipment I have added over the years the more knowledgeable I've become about things and simply want to automate the process. I do not think the process should be automated that much for someone starting out, you need to learn somehow. That being said some people get off so to speak on having all that equipment, it strokes their egos a bit. Ever seen the people who take up golf or running or squash or biking and have the "pro gear" before they've even tried the sport? Those type of people are in everything its funny when you realize who they are Lastly don't forget that it does cost quite a bit of money to automate your system, and you must decide if the hobby/pets are worth that kind of money spent on them. Same as if someones cat gets sick some people would rush them to the 24hr emergency animal hospital, some will just buy another cat.

I always buy the best stuff...

I'll pay for quality.

[Chaotic Cricket]

I simply meant you can dose yourself without a dosing pump, you don't need a calc reactor you don't need a mixing station you don't need a controller. They are all optional, not needed for success only to automate it

[Der_Iron_Chef]

This has been something I've been thinking about for quite some time. It seems like, in general, you're legit as a saltwater aquarist *only* if you have certain lighting, certain skimmer(s), plumbing that would make Bob Villa's head spin, and a Starphire tank all-around. There's a certain amount of bravado and narcissism when it comes to equipment. Let's be honest: if you see words like Geisemann, Vortech, Tunze and/or Bubble King in someone's signature, you're probably more likely to listen to what they have to say (ie. take them more seriously). Fact of the matter is, it just takes lots of money to have these pieces.

Bottom line: you can have a brilliant reef aquarium with lower cost equipment. As Beverly said, it just takes a little (or a lot) more elbow grease. I think there are definite benefits to having sumps and refugiums and what-not, but to say that they're a "must" is inaccurate.

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by Der_Iron_Chef

This has been something I've been thinking about for quite some time. It seems like, in general, you're legit as a saltwater aquarist *only* if you have certain lighting, certain skimmer(s), plumbing that would make Bob Villa's head spin, and a Starphire tank all-around. There's a certain amount of bravado and narcissism when it comes to equipment. Let's be honest: if you see words like Geisemann, Vortech, Tunze and/or Bubble King in someone's signature, you're probably more likely to listen to what they have to say (ie. take them more seriously). Fact of the matter is, it just takes lots of money to have these pieces.

Bottom line: you can have a brilliant reef aquarium with lower cost equipment. As Beverly said, it just takes a little (or a lot) more elbow grease. I think there are definite benefits to having sumps and refugiums and what-not, but to say that they're a "must" is inaccurate.

OK this post has been bugging me all day long - I guess cause I don't agree with it. I don't think that anyone has said that you need all the fancy equipment with the big price tags to have a successful reef and I believe that the variety of people on this board that run aquariums ranging from the fully automated - all the bells and whistles - to the super getto are all respected and their opinions are welcome.
A common theme of peoples advise to others that are having problems or simply asking questions boils down to
- research, research research
- ensure that you have good, balanced water quality
- ensure that you are providing the optimum environment to the critters you are keeping.
I don't recall anyone ever suggesting that you need a Bubble King skimmer, calcium reactor, MH lights, Tunze powerhead etc etc etc. to have a successful reef tank.
What has been offered up in the past is a recommendation to ensure - proper and adequete water flow, pristine water quality (however you choose to ensure that with a skimmer, water changes etc), and adequete light.
Sure there are people who have toys and yes some of them are expensive. It doesn't make them more knowledgeable to better reef keepers but it is their CHOICE to have those particular pieces of equipment.
I think you will get the self righteous on both ends of the specturm - those that beat their chests because they have all the bells and whistles - and those that beat their chests because they run low tech systems and spurn those that have all or some of the pricey equipment.
There are many ways to run a successful salt water aquarium and as long as you do your research, ask questions, and are humble enought to admit when you have made a mistake and take actions to correct it you will do fine in this hobby - with or without the gadgets - it's your choice.

[Der_Iron_Chef]

Originally Posted by Ruth

OK this post has been bugging me all day long - I guess cause I don't agree with it. I don't think that anyone has said that you need all the fancy equipment with the big price tags to have a successful reef and I believe that the variety of people on this board that run aquariums ranging from the fully automated - all the bells and whistles - to the super getto are all respected and their opinions are welcome.
A common theme of peoples advise to others that are having problems or simply asking questions boils down to
- research, research research
- ensure that you have good, balanced water quality
- ensure that you are providing the optimum environment to the critters you are keeping.
I don't recall anyone ever suggesting that you need a Bubble King skimmer, calcium reactor, MH lights, Tunze powerhead etc etc etc. to have a successful reef tank.
What has been offered up in the past is a recommendation to ensure - proper and adequete water flow, pristine water quality (however you choose to ensure that with a skimmer, water changes etc), and adequete light.
Sure there are people who have toys and yes some of them are expensive. It doesn't make them more knowledgeable to better reef keepers but it is their CHOICE to have those particular pieces of equipment.
I think you will get the self righteous on both ends of the specturm - those that beat their chests because they have all the bells and whistles - and those that beat their chests because they run low tech systems and spurn those that have all or some of the pricey equipment.
There are many ways to run a successful salt water aquarium and as long as you do your research, ask questions, and are humble enought to admit when you have made a mistake and take actions to correct it you will do fine in this hobby - with or without the gadgets - it's your choice.

Ruth--

I'm sorry if my comment bothered you. It was not my intent to generalize, as my comment may have appeared to do. In my post, I said that there's a "certain amount" of bravado and narcissism. I hold true to this. Early into the hobby, I left a particular LFS in Calgary very discouraged and angry. The owner basically made me feel like an idiot because I didn't have two grand to spend on lighting and a skimmer. On the other end of the spectrum, the people on this forum have been encouraging and informative.

The point of my comment was to inform the newcomer (like myself) that the expensive gadgetry isn't necessary, even if someone will make you feel like an arse for the sake of a sale.

Again, I apologize if I've offended. I can admit to my mistakes, and perhaps I've made one here.