Garlic and phosphates

[tuck]

I was wondering if anyone out there has noticed phosphates going up when using garlic? I'm using Garlic Gaurd right now, have been for almost a month now. I normally only use it when introducing a new fish into my system. I added a Butterfly, finicky little eater, a couple weeks ago. I soak the frozen food for a couple hours before feeding, drain off the excess garlic then feed. Now I notice phosphates are high. The garlic is the only thing I'm doing different and phosphates have always been low. I'm now using Phosban Pro and changing water every 4 - 5 days but they just don't seem to be coming down. I've checked my freshly made salt water - no phosphates. So now what?

[naesco]

I use garlic extreme quite liberally with no increase

[fishytime]

not sure about the phosphate thing but.......just a heads up....Ive read that prolonged use of garlic may lead to liver damage in fish......so probably best used only when necessary

[i have crabs]

add a little to some water and test the phosphates, id be surprised if there was none

[paddyob]

Originally Posted by fishytime

not sure about the phosphate thing but.......just a heads up....Ive read that prolonged use of garlic may lead to liver damage in fish......so probably best used only when necessary

Just curious.... is this a study backed by scientific research? A lot of things are "suggested" in this hobby so not always sure if you know what I mean.

I use garlic guard each and every feeding and wonder if liver damage is really something I should worry about.... or if maybe its synthetic salts and additives that may be the actual cause?

[fishytime]

Originally Posted by paddyob

Just curious.... is this a study backed by scientific research? A lot of things are "suggested" in this hobby so not always sure if you know what I mean.

I use garlic guard each and every feeding and wonder if liver damage is really something I should worry about.... or if maybe its synthetic salts and additives that may be the actual cause?

the study I was referring to was linked in a thread over at RC.....Ive tried doing a search for it , but we all know what the search function is like there....garlic is not a natural part of a fish's diet so it would make sense to me if their livers wernt able to process it properly.....
just curious why people use it like it has some medicinal value????.....all garlic is to a fish is an appetite stimulant.....it smells good

[Madreefer]

Originally Posted by fishytime

just curious why people use it like it has some medicinal value????.....all garlic is to a fish is an appetite stimulant.....it smells good

Well next time you have lobster just use straight melted butter, it tastes good.

Supposedly the garlic somehow leaches in to the fish's skin. and ich do not like it so will not stay on the fish.

Any truth to this?

[paddyob]

Originally Posted by fishytime

the study I was referring to was linked in a thread over at RC.....Ive tried doing a search for it , but we all know what the search function is like there....garlic is not a natural part of a fish's diet so it would make sense to me if their livers wernt able to process it properly.....
just curious why people use it like it has some medicinal value????.....all garlic is to a fish is an appetite stimulant.....it smells good

From what I have always understood is that parasites do not like the garlic in the fishes system and it can prevent certain parasites from "bothering" the fish.


Anyone shed light on this or have all the LFS been feeding me garlic for no reason? (LFS - not a hit on you guys in any way)

[naesco]

A study was done some time ago showing that a 'natural chemical in garlic extract has anti-parasitic and anti-fungal properties.
In my own experience it has proven to be the case.
As a result whenever I add a new fish I assume it has ich and start feeding Garlic Extreme. I soak dry food in the garlic extract and feed. I feed heavily and only garlic extract soaked food as the idea is to get as much garlic in the fish as possible.
On another board a Phd guy posted that it was a anecdotal evidence only. When I challenged him as a scientist to do a experiment he ignored the challenge.

[Reef_kid]

yes phosphates will increase with any organic matter that you introduce to the tank.
all plant cells contain enzymes and DNA and other protien. remembering that all DNA has phosphate, and most enzymes utilize phosphate as ATP, AMP, etc.

by adding ANY plant or animal matter to your tank you are introduceing orthophosphate.
as the material decomposes and relases the single phosphate (this phosphate is free form. and is what you measure with test kits) this is the same for nitrates.

Every time you introduce any food, you introduce nitrates, and phosphate.

try ferric oxid to remove the phosphate. either in a filter bag, or a phosphate reactor.
and chaetomorpha (m macroalgae) for nitrates and phosphate.
if you dont have a sump i used a aquaclear 300, with a enegry saver lamp over . while i was breeding my bangaii cardnals.