Go Ahead, Spend My Money!

[Beverly]

This starts off as a good story turned horror story....

Bought 5 angelfish for my 72 gal bowfront 2-3 weeks ago and we really enjoyed their colour, vitality, and the way they used the rockwork for swimming in and out of. They ate with gusto PE mysis soaked in lots of Zoe and a drop of Garlic Xtreme twice daily, gnoshed on macroalgae and picked stuff off the rockwork all day.

Then, one came down with velvet and I started treating it with in-tank with reef-safe Rally. Two of the fish were near death yesterday morning, so I euthanized them (not with the rock though ). This morning, two more were dead, leaving the original fish with velvet still alive. Expect it to die soon leaving me with an empty tank

Don't actually think velvet killed some of the fish, and have no idea what did them in. All I know is that they are deader than a doornail

Water params this morning: ammonia, nitrite and nitrate all 0 ppm, temp 77 F, pH 8.15.

80-some lbs LR, 3" sandbed, two Hagen 802s with Quickfilters filled with foam for crud/nitrate export, soft corals doing well, 3 x 55w pc for light. No skimmer, no sump. Tank had been set up, cycled and fed for 2 months prior to introducing fish.

Am going to leave the tank fallow for 6-8 weeks so any pathogens will hopefully die without hosts. Will continue to feed and do regular maintenance on the tank. After that, though, I want more angelfish

The angel that we liked the most was the Singapore angel (Chaetodontoplus mesoleucus), so I would like to restock the tank around this particular fish. Any suggestions of other angels to be housed with the Singapore would be much appreciated. Hope to have 4-5 angels and no other fish.

Now, go ahead and spend my money on angels

[Jason McK]

5 Angels seems to me to be a lot of fish for a 72G. Could this have been the reason for there deaths?

J

[Mak]

What kind Angels do you have in there?

[smokinreefer]

so there were no fish in the system prior to the angels? is that correct?

how large were the 5 angels that were added? and they were all added at the same time, right?

did you use a net? j/k.

[Beverly]

J, They were all introduced at the same time. There were no territorial issues between them that I ever noticed, and we watched them a lot because they were all so cool and beautiful

Mak, the fish were:
- coral beauty (Centropyge bispinosus)
- half black (Centropyge vroliki)
- keyhole (Centropyge tibicen)
- Lamarck's (Genicanthus lamarck) -poor choice because of its adult size
- Singapore angel (Chaetodontoplus mesoleucus) - the largest fish I think the tank could handle

Any more questions? If, not, help me spend some $$$$$

[smokinreefer]

well i can definetly help you spend the money, i love nagels too, but with my recent bad luck with angels, we should probably try to see if these deaths are preventable.

how large were the angels? the angles you mentioned are usually available 3-4" size.how big were the ones you introduced?

how were you prepping the tank to get it through the 2 month cycle? you mentioned you were feeding the tank? how much were you feeding?

it is possible that the 5 fish introduced posed too much of a bioload for the tank to handle properly. that would be my first inclination.

[Beverly]

shao,

Most of them were 3" and slightly under. The Lamarck's was about 4". You are correct that there were no fish in the tank previously, only astrea and margarita snails for a clean up crew.

The tank had cycled long before the 2 months had passed. I had it prepped for more seahorses that wouldn't become available for quite some time. During that time, we decided fish would be a better choice in a tank that large. The angels were actually a birthday present for my husband, so the loss hits a little harder

After the tank cycled, fed the tank chunks of frozen food placed in two small drinking glasses at either end of the tank. When one chunk had disintegrated, fed another chunk. Had macroalgae to soak up the nutrients, but there was a good amount of algae on the glass that I kept cleaning off. Also did water changes every 2-3 weeks.

Have a pH probe and used it to monitor pH change while slowly accclimatizing the fish to the tank's water. Took about 1.5 hours to acclimate them in a 5 gal pail with powerhead.

As I said, checked params this morning to determine if the increased bioload had anything to do with their deaths. Ammonia, nitrite and nitrate all were 0 ppm. After the fish were introduced, began to do weekly 15%water changes, filter cleaning, etc., so I was on top of maintenance issues.

Usually, I buy fish from the lfs that quarantines them for 2 weeks prior to sale to the public. Didn't do that this time. Almost never quarantine fish, either. Bad practice, I know, but over the years in a variety of reefs have only had a fish here and there die. Never had anything close to a complete wipeout like this until now Sh*t happens in all kinds of reefs for all kinds of reasons and this time it happened to us in this way, is the way I look at it. Still shaken up, though, but want to move forward when the time is right ...

What happened to your angels, and what kind were they? In how big a tank?

Would appreciate your stocking suggestions.

[smokinreefer]

well from your info the tank sounds like it was well prepared.
sorry for the losses, i know how it feels to loose fish unexpectedly and it is a downer.

as for mine, they were multibar angels. same as type as the one in my avatar. to make a long story short, they were new arrivals at the LFS, i didnt inspect hem for health close enough, idnt ask the store to hold them, i snatched them up and they died shortly thereafter, possibly a deep water acclimation issue, as well as overall health issue. oh yeah, they were in my 180.

anywho...i'm getting depressed again just thinking about it...

as for your restocking...i would be hesistant adding 5 angels, personally i dont think they will coexist very well in the long term, angels can be as demanding as tangs when it comes to conspecifics.

i would maybe try 3 and some other dither fish.

perhaps a singapore, flame, and lemonpeel (or bicolor). this combo would give a nice contrast of colors. or substitute one for a coral beauty.

maybe add a few small dither fish to the tank first, let them break in the tank and establish themselves before introducing the angels.

HTH, good luck with the restocking, and please do keep us updated.

[Beverly]

shao,

Sorry to hear about your loss. Sounds eerily similar to my own.

So you think only three angels would be a good choice for the long term. Respect that opinion and glad you offered suggestions of possible fish to choose from.

However, don't really want dither fish in the tank. Like to sit across the room from the tank and follow the movement of larger fish. Looked into possibly adding a tang, but all of them seem to get too large for a 72. Ah, well, several blue-green chromis can be a standby option, I suppose....

Any other suggestions for 4"-5" fish that are as mobile as angels and that will utilize the extensive rock structure would be appreciated.

TIA.

[Buccaneer]

A larger fairy wrasse would be nice and really colourfull too