New Pisces Location - Page 6

saltcreep · #51 03-24-2011, 04:52 PM

While the petition and current and proposed legislation in various constituencies are well intentioned, I feel it is misguided and it opens the door for further legislation on the retail stores. Of all the outlets available where dogs may be purchased, retail stores are the ones that are the easiest to regulate. An outright ban on sales is not the answer and will not have a large affect on the numbers of animals in shelters. I for one would highly encourage any retailer to participate in programs with shelters if they are wanting to offer dogs for sale.

A greater issue, especially for this hobby, is that local governments may not stop at dogs. The City of Richmond (BC), who enacted a ban on dogs in pet retail stores has indicated that they may investigate other animals for sale in stores. This is the slippery slope! The City of Vernon (BC) proposed legislation for the ban on "exotic animals" (I can't remember the exact term used) which included marine ornamental fish. That was subsequently voted down, but it is an example of where this could lead.

It is far too easy for local politicians, who feel they are doing the right thing, to go a step too far in what animals are banned. All it takes is one misinformed councellor to introduce a bylaw based on pure emotion rather than informed facts. This could easily happen if a city catches wind of how some fish or coral are collected for this hobby? The same ethics would apply to animals in this hobby as what are being used for an outright ban on the sale of dogs in pet retail stores.

Jamieh · #52 03-24-2011, 05:17 PM

Great post. If Cities want to be part of the solution in regards to health issues and shelter over-crowding why don't they inspect all places selling pets in their respective City. Put some guidelines in place. When you see a store or person not following your guidelines act against that person/store. Why should every store get tarred by same brush when all have not contributed to the issues at hand. Education is key to success in most things in life and puppy sales fit here as well. Mention Pet Store puppies now and people start to think "puppy mill" and that is just not true in the majority of cases.

Quote:

Originally Posted by saltcreep

While the petition and current and proposed legislation in various constituencies are well intentioned, I feel it is misguided and it opens the door for further legislation on the retail stores. Of all the outlets available where dogs may be purchased, retail stores are the ones that are the easiest to regulate. An outright ban on sales is not the answer and will not have a large affect on the numbers of animals in shelters. I for one would highly encourage any retailer to participate in programs with shelters if they are wanting to offer dogs for sale.

A greater issue, especially for this hobby, is that local governments may not stop at dogs. The City of Richmond (BC), who enacted a ban on dogs in pet retail stores has indicated that they may investigate other animals for sale in stores. This is the slippery slope! The City of Vernon (BC) proposed legislation for the ban on "exotic animals" (I can't remember the exact term used) which included marine ornamental fish. That was subsequently voted down, but it is an example of where this could lead.

It is far too easy for local politicians, who feel they are doing the right thing, to go a step too far in what animals are banned. All it takes is one misinformed councellor to introduce a bylaw based on pure emotion rather than informed facts. This could easily happen if a city catches wind of how some fish or coral are collected for this hobby? The same ethics would apply to animals in this hobby as what are being used for an outright ban on the sale of dogs in pet retail stores.

saltcreep · #53 03-24-2011, 05:24 PM

Just as aside. I looked in the online classified for the Vancouver Province newspaper...93 adds for dogs for sale.

globaldesigns · #54 03-24-2011, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lorenz0

Yes I read the whole petition and agree with it

BUT most people just don't give a **** and its sad. Honestly I can't even watch "I am Legend" cause he has to kill his dog. But back to reality of people not caring... To get this bylaw passed you have to hope that on city council you have a majority of animal lovers. Sure people like dogs but most just don't care where they came from as long at they are cute. Look at SMS (small dog syndrome) like you mentioned the young life of a dog is extremely important, now how many little dogs do you see that are properly trained and don't bark at leafs blowing in the wind every 5 min. Those dogs weren't properly trained and now they believe they own the world, my brother bought a yorkie from a rep breeder and never trained him. Even after years he still has a bunch of issues with not listening and doing as he pleases. Which than points at irresponsible owners and people who bought a dog cause they are cute. And there are alot of them out there. Now your looking at supply and demand. There is a huge supply for dogs and the more that are being sold (IMO) the more euthanasia will be present because no little girl wants a full grown dog. This brings us back to this petition, great idea but it seems like the only laws that get passed have to oppose keeping animals that could kill you. (BC and the reptile/ exotic pet thing that went on a few years back)

Plus I want to buy a boston terrier in 2 years once I have settled down a bit. Almost picked one up 7 years ago but decided against it.

Hey Lorenzo, just remember training a dog is more than that, it is really the training of the owner... I was a dog owner, and grew up with dogs... Dogs that don't behave, you are correct they weren't trained. But is more than that, the owner isn't trained. It is all about Alpha, who is the boss, the training is training both the owner and dog, and the owner has to take the alpha role, if the dog thinks its alpha (THE BOSS), then you can be in trouble.

I believe all dog owners, should go through a training program with their pet. Look at the number of pet owners that don't, training of the owner and dog can solve alot of behavior issues. Not all but alot. Some pets may be just plain CRAZY!!!

I agree with you 100%, alot of people buy any pet because of cuteness. Without any research... Any pet does require some thought and research, as many have stated prior, some dogs are put into shelters because the owners did not do this. That isn't fair to the animal!

Just my 2 cents.

lorenz0 · #55 03-24-2011, 06:13 PM

Oh totally. See my brother did nothing with the dog. walked it now and than, filled up the food and water dish and that was about it. My dad and I ended up spending over 30 hours replacing base boards that were destroyed due to dog **** and ripping up the carpet because the stains wouldn't come out. I mean text book example of a horrible owner. My previous description was a quick summery of the dog, and once they are older training becomes really hard. My dog on the other hand I trained him myself. Doesn't **** in the house unless he is left alone for WAY to long, doesn't rip anything up (used to love designer shoes), rarely barks, extremely friendly, but he has some selective hearing. Never got to train him for off leash.

But as everyone else has said and myself, your true problem is not in the store, but in the owner of the animal. If private sales were halted think of the influx into the SPCA and how much euthanasia would increase

Aquattro · #56 03-24-2011, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lorenz0

But as everyone else has said and myself, your true problem is not in the store, but in the owner of the animal.

This is the part I don't agree with. Once a puppy is isolated from either it's littermates or it's human's direction, and spends any extended length of time in this isolation, it misses out on critical cognitive and behavioural development, that may be impossible to fix. Which creates a dog that invariably ends up in a shelter, or PTS.
Early interaction is critical in canine development, and this isn't acheived in most pet store environments.

EmilyB · #57 03-24-2011, 07:10 PM

Nor are the animals of any quality.

First of all, no respectable breeder breeds crosses. Lhasopoos, Chidoodles, or whatever....

I've also known several puppies that came from pet stores. Everyone of them was nervy or just plain aggressive.

I don't know if Petland is still doing the rescue thing. I think they had a lot of problems. Robert is certainly speaking out against the bill, so I assume he stands to lose something.

Whether or not it is a go, I think it still serves to educate people who really think buying a puppy at a pet store is okay.

Oh, and to who it was above who mentioned getting a boston terrier, please do your research on the problems common in the breed, and find a good breeder who is working towards improving health and temperament, and not just letting two dogs of the opposite sex have at 'er.

saltcreep · #58 03-24-2011, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmilyB

Nor are the animals of any quality.

First of all, no respectable breeder breeds crosses. Lhasopoos, Chidoodles, or whatever....

And how does banning them in pet retail stores change this? See my post above...93 adds for dogs for sale in the online classifieds of the Vancouver Province alone.

Regulate the stores if that is the concern. Just don't outright ban them. It won't fix the problem.

Jamieh · #59 03-24-2011, 07:26 PM

I would bet that most puppies in Petland get more human interaction than most of the kijiji ad puppies. And again I will ask the question, if it's pet store puppies causing all the shelter problems why are almost all shelter dogs medium to large in size while pet stores sell almost exclussively small dogs?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquattro

This is the part I don't agree with. Once a puppy is isolated from either it's littermates or it's human's direction, and spends any extended length of time in this isolation, it misses out on critical cognitive and behavioural development, that may be impossible to fix. Which creates a dog that invariably ends up in a shelter, or PTS.
Early interaction is critical in canine development, and this isn't acheived in most pet store environments.

EmilyB · #60 03-24-2011, 07:33 PM

You would probably be surprised at how quickly people can become educated. Our problems up here are nothing compared to the US.

But thanks to dog forums, facebook, etc. the word is getting out. These BYB's simply contribute to pet overpopulation, and the animals pay in the end by dying in shelters. Some people are idiots, granted, and you can't fix stupid. But you can strive to show the average JoeQ why it is a bad decision.

A pet store just makes it easy to impulse buy. And return it after Christmas. Hopefully, not just dump it somewhere. I wonder what the pet stores do with those? Not only that, the simple act of the pet store buying puppies from these BYB's and/or mills, is just keeping them in business.

It's hard to turn away from a cute puppy, but remember, there will just be another created to take it's place if you succumb.