palytoxin symptoms

[ALang]

^^well said, Fencer.

[blaster]

These articles will bump the cost of buying them.

[hillegom]

Originally Posted by blaster

These articles will bump the cost of buying them.

Goodie!! I have some

[wickedfrags]

How?

And everything is toxic - it really just depends on the dose.

Originally Posted by blaster

These articles will bump the cost of buying them.

[reef-keeper]

A newbie Like me and others specially with small children that when cleaning their tank that just a puff of toxin can seriously harm their 4 or 5year old that always wants to help daddy or mommy with the tank duties. I am glad that I read that article. As for the price they may drop to nothing because no one in their right mind with the helpful child would want them in the tank. That is just my opinion.

[daniella3d]

I am not saying that it does not exist, but that it is something rare, that's all. I am also trying to find any credible reference, names etc..of people who actualy died from it without any luck.

Why would we go eating this stuff? or any other coral in our aquarium that can be toxic? I mean...boiling liverock and breathing the water from it is probably enough (without paly on it) to make some people going into an allergic reaction.

I often work with paly and zoanthids with cuts and wounds on my fingers and never had a problem. I must be pretty lucky since I have been doing this for 2 years now.

What I meat is that there are MUCH higher risk in our aquariums than being poisoned by palytoxine. The vibrio bacterias can probably make you a lot more sick than handling zoanthids. According to the Coral magasine article, no palytoxin were ever found in zoanthids, only in some species of palythoas and propalythoas if I remember well.

Geeezzz..I know a lot of people whom like me are handling zoanthids and paly all the time without even a trace of side effects. Are we so lucky? I think there is a lot of hypocondriac people spreading fear about this.

I read the story of the poisoned dog before, not sure if it is true or not but the dog drank the water full of slime. A lot of thing can kill a dog if consumed...a lot of things can kill a human if consumed. It is plain good old common sense NOT to eat stuff that can be poison. Handling it is another story.

When an article refer to human "deaths" and I cannot even find one credible occurence of it, sorry but I am very skeptical about the whole thing.

Originally Posted by fishytime

yes but Danniella, your basically telling people that because you handle and frag your zoas all the time, so the problem(or potential for a problem) doesnt exist.....and this is irresponsible advice.....I feel that it is better to broad spectrum warm people about the potential for palytoxin poisoning and let them decide how they wanna handle their zoas and palys.....there have been plenty of cases of people getting sick from handling their palys.....now what would have happened if any of these people had an open cut on their hands???......I have been trying to find the thread where a gentleman's dog died after he was fragging palys, but I havnt been able to find it.....and I disagree with your claim that there are worse things then palytoxin in out aquariums.....palytoxin is the second most toxic naturally occurring substance known to man.....I dont think you can get much worse than that, in our aquariums.....(save maybe a blue-ringed octopus)

[Madreefer]

Give it up Daniella. Another debate that you started and have lost again. We all heard your opinion and the majority disagree with it. Just move on, if you want to keep doing what you are without any precautions than fly at it. This is a great thread and if it will prevent any fellow reefers from getting sick or death than thats a good thing. Now you want names? Wow.

[whatcaneyedo]

Originally Posted by daniella3d

According to the Coral magasine article, no palytoxin were ever found in zoanthids, only in some species of palythoas and propalythoas if I remember well.

"All species of Palythoa, and most related zoanthids including Protopalythoa species, produce a chemical called palytoxin in their mucus and gonads." p182 Aquarium Corals Selection, Husbandry, and Natural History by Eric H. Borneman 2004

What did they say exactly? Because what you are saying contradicts Calfo, Borneman, Shimek, Delbeek and Sprung.

EDIT: You're failing to use correct identification which makes your argument sound ridiculous. Zoanthidae is the Family that contains the Genera Zoanthus, Palythoa etc. So Palythoa ARE Zoanthids.

[chandigz]

Well I have to say that I have experienced near death palytoxin poisoning. It happened during a move and it happened fast. I was waiting for my buddy to show up to help (11:00am)and I had a ton of ugly slimy palys taking over on several rocks so I decided to pull them off while runnnig them under hot water to kill them. I thought "I should be wearing gloves" but they were already at the new place. Oh well I thought. I've handled lots of zoas before without gloves and I have no cuts on my hand and I'm running them under hot water washing away any toxin. Big mistake. I guess I gouged my finger in the process of ripping them off and was squishing them into into the open wound. Within minutes my lungs were really irritated and was constantly coughing. We got the tank moved and filled with water and my buddy had to go(1:00 PM) By this time I really really wasn't feeling well and my lungs felt like they were on fire. I sat down on the couch passed out and woke up a couple of hours later sicker then I had ever been; severe cold sweats, vertigo, nausia, shaking, respritory distress, racing heart and just about every symptom possible.(3:00pm) I was so messed up that I was dellusional. I remember thinking I should call someone to get my live stock into the tank but I was so incapacitated that I couldn't get off the couch to get to the phone or the tank. Around midnight I managed to crawl on my hands and knees to the tank and eventually dump in my two tupperwear totes of coral and a bucket of fish that had been sitting for over 12 hours. Some how I ended up in bed and was comepletely messed up till late afternoon the next day when symptoms started to disapear(4:00PM next day). I've never come remotely close to being that sick. I felt like I was dieing the whole time. Weard thing was at the time I never thought to call for help or that I might have had palytoxin poisoning. I slept it off and the next day thought of possible paly toxin poisoning and after resarching and talking to a doctor I discovered that I had had an extreme case of poisoning and should have been in the hospital because I could have easily died. I was that close. What were the chances that I had to have the highly toxic ones and just happen to try to remove them without gloves and cut my finger that that day. Just be carefull you never know. Worst part wasn't that I almost died but that I woke up to a completely wiped out tank.

[RuGlu6]

Look at this toxic critter...
tentacles are up to 15 meters ! kept me from swimming for sure !
.