Looking for opinions on using BioPellets

[whatcaneyedo]

The wet/dry trickle filter was meant to provide a surface area for aerobic bacteria to break down waste... the trouble with them was that in that environment the waste was broken down into nitrate. In a planted freshwater system that might have been fine but its exactly what you want to avoid in a reef tank. This is why we run skimmers on saltwater tanks, to remove the waste before it has a chance to breakdown into nitrate. Anaerobic bacteria is what we employ live rock and deep sand beds for. Its the bacteria that doesn't like oxygen but consumes nitrate.

[TimT]

Originally Posted by Ryan7

I would have to disagree that the bacteria is waterborne and feeding corals. Vodka/Vinegar is a carbon source that will feed the bacteria and aid in concentrating on a surface. Bio Pellets are a surface which is designed to promote habitat for the bacteria.

I have personally observed a waterborne bacterial overgrowth. I installed a UV sterilizer on the system and all the haze was gone in the morning. Redox was down around 80mv during the haze.

Forms of bacterial overgrowth were linked to the specific type of carbon source in a post on RC. There was waterborne, surface and then stringy mucous. I have seen all three in tanks.

I like the dosing methodology as it's easier to control and change dosage if necessary.

[albert_dao]

Gonna agree with Tim here. You will get bacterial aggregation in the water column of a vodka dosed system given everything is done correctly (properly skimming, flow, no preexisting "bad" bacterial overgrowth, etc). Bacterial guilds can exist in amazing diversity in reef tanks and will occupy all strata given the opportunity.

[Etaloche]

So then can you run pellets to reduce nitrates and dose vodka like once in a while compared to every day to still promote water borne bacteria?

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Originally Posted by brisco

It seems that is the idea with the Hydroton and biopellets just build on that idea but give the bacteria a food source as well.

Actually wet/dry is purely for aerobic bacteria (ammonia & nitrite consuming) whereas Hydroton also provides an anaerobic environment inside the porous clay balls for nitrate consuming anaerobic bacteria. Wet/dry systems worked for fish only tanks but were nitrate factories so bad for reef tanks.

[Bugger]

I ran a wet dri with a reef never had any issues. It's totally fine to use unless somehow dead fish or full pieces of shrimp somehow end up in it

[albert_dao]

Originally Posted by Etaloche

So then can you run pellets to reduce nitrates and dose vodka like once in a while compared to every day to still promote water borne bacteria?

They're both more or less doing the same thing. Bacteria are going to exist in equilibrium with the available food sources, so an overdose of carbon sources will cause cloudiness.

[brisco]

Originally Posted by SeaHorse_Fanatic

Actually wet/dry is purely for aerobic bacteria (ammonia & nitrite consuming) whereas Hydroton also provides an anaerobic environment inside the porous clay balls for nitrate consuming anaerobic bacteria. Wet/dry systems worked for fish only tanks but were nitrate factories so bad for reef tanks.

What I was getting at is that is Hyroton is similar in that it gives the beneficial bacteria a place to colonize, similar to a wet/dry, but I guess that it provides for both aerobic and anerobic. It does not provide a food source. It that all correct or I am missing something?

[Ryan7]

Originally Posted by TimT

I have personally observed a waterborne bacterial overgrowth. I installed a UV sterilizer on the system and all the haze was gone in the morning. Redox was down around 80mv during the haze.

Forms of bacterial overgrowth were linked to the specific type of carbon source in a post on RC. There was waterborne, surface and then stringy mucous. I have seen all three in tanks.

I like the dosing methodology as it's easier to control and change dosage if necessary.

I am not disagreeing that bacteria can be waterborne, however, I do not believe our corals consume it, save for sponges, dusters ect..

The methodology for dosing vinegar/vodka is not to promote the bacteria to become waterborne, and if you are able to see it in your water column, the dosage is too high and has caused a bacteria bloom. This can actually brown out your corals, thus, my belief in that the corals are not consuming it.

Furthermore, I believe vinegar/vodka dosing also feeds Cyanobacteria, however, some research suggests that Vinegar does not. My experience has been both do.

Here is a good article on dosing and an excerpt from it:

http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium

"Scientific research has found that cyanobacterial growth does not increase when dosing vinegar (acetate), where it was found that ethanol dosing will increase cyanobacterial growth. Cyanobacteria produce PHA to store energy when needed. PHA is an ingredient in some biopellets. So cyanobacteria can utilize some if not all of the biopellets. Hobbyists who have dosed vinegar have reported less cyanobacterial problems compared to dosing biopellets & ethanol. This was my experience as well"

As someone who has tried and tested, vinegar/vodka dosing, bio-pellets and nitraguard bio-cubes. Bio-cubes are the only way to go.

[TimT]

Originally Posted by Ryan7

I am not disagreeing that bacteria can be waterborne, however, I do not believe our corals consume it, save for sponges, dusters ect..

Here is a link discussing bacterial consumption by corals.
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-01/eb/index.htm

Originally Posted by Ryan7

Furthermore, I believe vinegar/vodka dosing also feeds Cyanobacteria, however, some research suggests that Vinegar does not. My experience has been both do.

I have experienced the opposite while dosing vodka/vinegar so I suspect there are other causative factors at work. I suspect that there must be several key ingredients to have a cyano bloom. Some of them being phosphate and high dissolved organics. I have noticed that certain times of year there are several complaints about cyano outbreaks so perhaps it's seasonal too? Just rambling here.