An observation about sand and fine sand

[Reef Pilot]

Sorry if it has been said already, but easiest way to keep your sand clean is with an orange spot sleeper goby. They are tireless workers, (and interesting to watch, too) and their constant sand sifting ensures that any detritus is taken away by the water column and out through your overflows.

I lost mine a few months ago (they will find the smallest hole in your tank top) and tried going without for now (I wanted to try some bottom LPS corals). So I got a tiger tail cuc instead. However, he spends most of his time in the rocks and has failed to keep the algae from starting up on my sand. I am planning to get another goby, as I have had about enough of this algae.

[Aquattro]

If you have an algae problem, and if it won't go away, and you may have had high PO4 levels and you have sand, it's then plausible that said sand is binding the suspected PO4 within it's porous structure AND therefore, removing and/or replacing said sand "could" alleviate or eliminate the original problem of algae in a tank.
That about it, Albert?

Gobies won't clean it, sifters won't sift it, chemicals may leach it back out, but a quick way to fix is to remove. As an option. If you wanted to fix it quickly. It may or may not appeal to your aesthetic sensibilities, but can and often does fix a particular problem.

Mental note, install breathalyser on Submit button

[Samw]

Originally Posted by Aquattro

If you have an algae problem, and if it won't go away, and you may have had high PO4 levels and you have sand, it's then plausible that said sand is binding the suspected PO4 within it's porous structure AND therefore, removing and/or replacing said sand "could" alleviate or eliminate the original problem of algae in a tank.
That about it, Albert?

Gobies won't clean it, sifters won't sift it, chemicals may leach it back out, but a quick way to fix is to remove. As an option. If you wanted to fix it quickly. It may or may not appeal to your aesthetic sensibilities, but can and often does fix a particular problem.

Mental note, install breathalyser on Submit button

Yup, sometimes replacing the sand can be quicker than spending endless time trying to figure out what the problem is and still not find it when the simplest cause is right there in the sand. If it works great, if not, move on. No need to start an argument whether or not the sand is causing the problem in someone else's tank.

Obviously, replacing the sand wouldn't be the first option until everything else has been looked at.

[Reef Pilot]

Well, for me it is pretty simple:
Goby = no algae on sand
No Goby = algae on sand

And my P04 is consistently zero or near zero (Hanna checker). But yes, am sure sand traps P04. That's what the Goby is for. He stirs it up and it is taken away by the water column. Like I said, that is the easiest solution (instead of changing or frequently vacuuming your sand).

[Aquattro]

I like sand...

[Samw]

Originally Posted by Aquattro

I like sand...

So do I. That's why I replaced mine with new sand. My old sand was turning black and had Hydrogen Sulfide. Is that bad?

The good news is that my hair algae is gone completely and I've had to feed my turbo snails nori ever since. Previously, there was enough algae for all of the herbivoires to eat and the algae would grow back to provide more food for them.

[albert_dao]

This is gonna get wordy:

Originally Posted by sumpfinfishe

I also wanted to mention Albert that I know there are benefits to going/starting BB, and there are many beautiful BB tanks in this hobby, so it simply boils down to personal preference. I do believe however that most algae problems can be avoided, whether it be closer monitoring, consistent water changes, getting overwhelmed with fancy chemicals or relying on too many technical products to list a few.

Sometimes you get old tank syndrome. Sometimes you started off the wrong foot and didn't have the best set up. The list goes on. I agree with you, these problems can be avoided, but it assumes you're going into your tank as an experienced hobbyist.

Originally Posted by sumpfinfishe

Taking two steps backward to figure out why something is wrong is better than taking one step forward in the wrong direction.

Old tank syndrome is easy to figure out - Buildup of organics bound to substrates. You can't exactly just ditch your rock structures, so sands up for the chopping block.

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Sorry if it has been said already, but easiest way to keep your sand clean is with an orange spot sleeper goby. They are tireless workers, (and interesting to watch, too) and their constant sand sifting ensures that any detritus is taken away by the water column and out through your overflows.

I don't agree with this. They will assist with sand they can get at. And that's it. They're industrious, not magic.

Originally Posted by Aquattro

If you have an algae problem, and if it won't go away, and you may have had high PO4 levels and you have sand, it's then plausible that said sand is binding the suspected PO4 within it's porous structure AND therefore, removing and/or replacing said sand "could" alleviate or eliminate the original problem of algae in a tank.
That about it, Albert?

Hey, someone addressed the topic without flaming me! *Awkward hug*

Originally Posted by Aquattro

Gobies won't clean it, sifters won't sift it, chemicals may leach it back out, but a quick way to fix is to remove. As an option. If you wanted to fix it quickly. It may or may not appeal to your aesthetic sensibilities, but can and often does fix a particular problem.

Bingo.

Originally Posted by Aquattro

Mental note, install breathalyser on Submit button

Do you find that your propensity for fun diminishes as you get older? -____-

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Well, for me it is pretty simple:
Goby = no algae on sand
No Goby = algae on sand

And my P04 is consistently zero or near zero (Hanna checker). But yes, am sure sand traps P04. That's what the Goby is for. He stirs it up and it is taken away by the water column. Like I said, that is the easiest solution (instead of changing or frequently vacuuming your sand).

Walter, I don't mean to point out the obvious, but your formula doesn't work for everyone. I sell tons of those gobies. I still see people with nutrient buildup issues because of their rock work, crappy skimmers, not enough flow, etc, etc, etc. Sure, they could improve these aspects, but that doesn't change the fact that they went for however long with crap advice and crap setups which led to the problem in the first place. How do you solve for x when x is years of sh1tty tank? Often, removing the sand and running it BB for a few water change cycles is the easiest and most effective option.

I feel there's a lot of resistance here because people think pulling out sand is hard or messy. It's not. Here's what you do:

Materials
• 3/4" or larger ID hose
• enough buckets to cover your regular water change
• a helping hand (you will need someone to keep the hose from flooding and to break up clogs in the hose

Method
1. Set all your buckets up in front of the tank.
2. Start siphon and shove hose into the sand. Pick up as much as you can.
3. When all your buckets are full, stop. You don't need to get all of the sand in one go. Spread it over several water changes if you have to.

That's it. Using a hose, you won't cloud up and crash your tank. Having a helping hand will keep you from putting your foot through your sump.