Aquadigital Products Discussion

Aqua-Digital · #1 01-13-2015, 01:46 AM

We will have another one on board by April

mikellini · #2 01-13-2015, 02:02 AM

An issue I have with AD (and I've already spoken with them via email about this) is regarding 'reviews'. From an ethical perspective, essentially offering someone a sale price on an item in exchange for doing a review on that item is a bad idea. You would never presume to do this with a publication/journalist, but for some reason it seems that this has been done many times (and continues to be common practice) with hobbyists. Putting the aside the issue of inherent bias due to money invested and desire to buy the product, the biggest problem with this is gross misrepresentation of a 'sale price' as a 'review opportunity'. I'd like to hear what others have to say about this (since I've already heard from AD).

Reef Pilot · #3 01-13-2015, 02:07 AM

You would be surprised how common this is everywhere, incl journalism. Very hard to find true reviews anywhere... Do you really believe what Motortrend says about a new car review??...

That's actually where these forums are in fact very valuable. You get experiences and opinions from real users, who actually paid for the product.

Aqua-Digital · #4 01-13-2015, 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

You would be surprised how common this is everywhere, incl journalism. Very hard to find true reviews anywhere... Do you really believe what Motortrend says about a new car review??...

That's actually where these forums are in fact very valuable. You get experiences and opinions from real users, who actually paid for the product.

+1

mikellini · #5 01-13-2015, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

You would be surprised how common this is everywhere, incl journalism. Very hard to find true reviews anywhere... Do you really believe what Motortrend says about a new car review??...

That's actually where these forums are in fact very valuable. You get experiences and opinions from real users, who actually paid for the product.

Motortrend (and other journalists) do not have to pay to review things. They aren't usually given things free of charge either. They are given 'review units' that are returned after the review is completed.

I completely understand that it wouldn't often work (except with low cost items) to just 'gift' items to hobbyists for review. I also understand the worry about someone taking the product and running. But I suggested what I feel is the right way to do it (taking a deposit, then giving the option to purchase or return after the review, split shipping costs) and was told that I should essentially just read someone else's review.

Ron99 · #6 01-13-2015, 02:30 AM

I've had some experience in this industry with review units and the ones I have seen were provided free of charge to select bloggers/reviewers. They are a marketing write off for the manufacturer etc.

I've done some automotive writing and reviews and in that case the car companies usually give me a car for a week or so to drive and review. Cars are big ticket items so no give aways there. There were a couple I would have loved to keep

Aqua-Digital · #7 01-13-2015, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ron99

I've had some experience in this industry with review units and the ones I have seen were provided free of charge to select bloggers/reviewers. They are a marketing write off for the manufacturer etc.

I've done some automotive writing and reviews and in that case the car companies usually give me a car for a week or so to drive and review. Cars are big ticket items so no give aways there. There were a couple I would have loved to keep

100% agree, manufacturers often will give away products, but as a distributor if the manufacturer wont play ball we try and find a way to still get a review so everyone is happy.

Aqua-Digital · #8 01-13-2015, 02:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikellini

I completely understand that it wouldn't often work (except with low cost items) to just 'gift' items to hobbyists for review. I also understand the worry about someone taking the product and running. But I suggested what I feel is the right way to do it (taking a deposit, then giving the option to purchase or return after the review, split shipping costs) and was told that I should essentially just read someone else's review.

I understand the theory, the issue is cost, believe it or not distributors have the tin margins, and to give a product away that then comes back effectively second hand that can not be sold is a huge loss, where as giving someone the opportunity to have something they may not be able to afford in return for as best as possible an unbiased review is a two way positive deal.

Distributors in this industry do not have the luxury to give away products even if it can be written off or seen as a marketing plus point. I wish we could just give out units, but it just can not be afforded.

Sadly nothing in life these days is free. So we offer a middle ground, nobody is making that reviewer take up the offer of course

mikellini · #9 01-13-2015, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aqua-Digital

I understand the theory, the issue is cost, believe it or not distributors have the tin margins, and to give a product away that then comes back effectively second hand that can not be sold is a huge loss, where as giving someone the opportunity to have something they may not be able to afford in return for as best as possible an unbiased review is a two way positive deal.

Distributors in this industry do not have the luxury to give away products even if it can be written off or seen as a marketing plus point. I wish we could just give out units, but it just can not be afforded.

Sadly nothing in life these days is free. So we offer a middle ground, nobody is making that reviewer take up the offer of course

It's likely you'd only receive a product back if it wasn't a good product. I can't see why someone would essentially take a loss on their time and money by sending back something they were happy with. And if second hand products can't be sold, I guess we should close the Buy&Sell forum...

Your 'middle ground' is getting a free review. I can see how you might call it a 'win win' situation, but clearly you are taking no risk and getting a potentially nice, free reward. It's this viewpoint, and many other comments by many other people in many other threads, that I hope you consider.

Aqua-Digital · #10 01-13-2015, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikellini

Your 'middle ground' is getting a free review. I can see how you might call it a 'win win' situation, but clearly you are taking no risk and getting a potentially nice, free reward. It's this viewpoint, and many other comments by many other people in many other threads, that I hope you consider.

We get emails and calls all the time asking for free stuff in return for a review, we have even got recently from someone an email on this exact subject demanding to do a review for free and got very upset when we turned them down, total idiot in my view

Some people do think they can bully you with the threat of negative posts on forums to get what they want. So you see we have to be careful, give into one it sets a precedent.

Business is about limiting risks, so I have absolute no issues with this. And currently the mass majority do not either.

Currently this is not a policy we will be changing, I have seen absolute no evidence other than yourself and BB that feel it alienates anyone,I also spent a ton of time trawling through the forum to find complaints about this as you say and there is not one from I can find, in fact more posts on here about the subject are for it than against. So the majority rule

we have been doing this for 7 years in this country and about 14 years in Europe with not one single complaint, so I see no reason to change now.

As it stands dealers we have asked (and we do) like the idea as it gives insight to the product and end user like having something to review at a cheaper price. we benefit from the review and so do the reviewers, dealers and end users.

I understand and respect you personally do not like it, so all I can advise is dont read them, it is impossible to please everyone and on this topic we cant please you or really try to. We will continue to monitor the policy with our dealers primarily and if they have issues then we will of course listen, as its the dealers the policy more than anything to make a structured choice if the product is right for them.

I have nothing else to add to this topic, so this one is now closed, but thank you for your input (only because i know full well how these things spiral and want to keep this thread open)