WHAT IS A CORPORATION?

[MitchM]

Conspiracy movies like Zeitgeist should not be shown to kids.
I tried to watch it a few years ago and turned it off because of it's nonsense.

Kids need to learn how our actual economy works and make decisions that will help them make productive choices, not fringe films that are meant to confuse them.

I'm not sure the point of this thread, but corporations are a pretty simple concept, a legal entity that allow business people to safely conduct business without putting their personal property at risk.

[reefermadness]

Yes because our economies and monetary system is perfect and infallible. They definitely should never be scrutinized. The shenanigans (yes I said it) of Wallstreet is just part of the perfection.

If kids/students can't listen to different ideas and arguments and look on them objectively, we'll that is a shame. Also if we can't think and work on improvements to systems (monetary system being one), that is so closed minded and also sad.

Personally I really like the Zeitgeist films (there are 3). I don't agree with everything in them but they are eye openers for sure. They cover a lot of topics, like mental health, religion, war and are probably only 25% about the monetary system.

A good documentary to watch about the crash of 2008 and subsequent recession is inside job. It does a good job of laying out the sicking financial moves that lead to one of worst market declines in history. In October '08 the head of the International Monetary Fund/IMF warned that the world financial system was teetering on the "brink of systemic meltdown.

I'm not personally against any of this stuff but even if you think something is great you can still try to objectively look at the flaws and think of improvements. I love myself but sometimes I think about how I can be a better person. Then I grab a beer

[Reef Pilot]

Zeitgeist reminds me of the hippie movement back in the late 60's and the communes. Then in later life many of them ended up on Wall Street, and in corporations.

As was said, corporations are very simple. People pooling their resources and different skills to create more assets for everyone to share. Some are profitable, some are not. Definitely more efficient and productive than individuals or communes.

But we will always have protests and alternative lifestyle movements, as envy and jealously just seems to be part of the human make-up. And it seems our species are not the only ones, as per another thread I posted recently.
http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...d.php?t=101358

[reefermadness]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Zeitgeist reminds me of the hippie movement back in the late 60's and the communes. Then in later life many of them ended up on Wall Street, and in corporations.

Aint no hippie mo fo here, but I do like the films. Honestly, have you even watched one start to finish?

As was said, corporations are very simple. People pooling their resources and different skills to create more assets for everyone to share. Some are profitable, some are not. Definitely more efficient and productive than individuals or communes.

Everything is simple if you choose not to look at the details. C'mon I can give you the definition of a nuclear reaction but does that tell you everything you need to know about a nuclear reaction?

nuclear reaction

— n
a process in which the structure and energy content of an atomic nucleus are changed by interaction with another nucleus or particle

But we will always have protests and alternative lifestyle movements, as envy and jealously just seems to be part of the human make-up. And it seems our species are not the only ones, as per another thread I posted recently.
http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...d.php?t=101358

And when people protest anything that is unjust or unfair that makes them jealous in your mind?

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by reefermadness

Aint no hippie mo fo here, but I do like the films. Honestly, have you even watched one start to finish?
Everything is simple if you choose not to look at the details. C'mon I can give you the definition of a nuclear reaction but does that tell you everything you need to know about a nuclear reaction?

nuclear reaction

— n
a process in which the structure and energy content of an atomic nucleus are changed by interaction with another nucleus or particle

And when people protest anything that is unjust or unfair that makes them jealous in your mind?

Let me just say that life is never fair, and I am not going to waste my energy fretting about it. Life is too short to be unhappy. What is more important is to make the most of what we have and the opportunities that come our way. That includes making good choices and helping our kids, as well as those less fortunate than ourselves.

And be thankful for what we have. Hmmm, isn't that what this past weekend was supposed to be about?....

[reefermadness]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Let me just say that life is never fair, and I am not going to waste my energy fretting about it. Life is too short to be unhappy. What is more important is to make the most of what we have and the opportunities that come our way. That includes making good choices and helping our kids, as well as those less fortunate than ourselves.

And be thankful for what we have. Hmmm, isn't that what this past weekend was supposed to be about?....

So you are saying women should stop worrying about equal pay for equal work. Minorities should stop fretting about discrimination. African Americans should have been happy enough as slaves. People with out food and water should be thankful they have air. People who lost there life retirement savings or could not retire when they planned to because of the wallstreet crash should just be quite. Students with thousands of dollars in debt should be happy cause although they can't find a decent job in their field they do have a job (although its at walmart).

You start out by saying life is never fair and you shouldnt worry about it, than you go on and say we should make good choices and help our kids and those less fortunate. Which one is it??

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by reefermadness

So you are saying women should stop worrying about equal pay for equal work. Minorities should stop fretting about discrimination. African Americans should have been happy enough as slaves. People with out food and water should be thankful they have air. People who lost there life retirement savings or could not retire when they planned to because of the wallstreet crash should just be quite. Students with thousands of dollars in debt should be happy cause although they can't find a decent job in their field they do have a job (although its at walmart).

You start out by saying life is never fair and you shouldnt worry about it, than you go on and say we should make good choices and help our kids and those less fortunate. Which one is it??

Well, if I was going to fret about every bit of unfairness (in my opinion) I see in life, I would be a very unhappy person. Instead I choose to change things for the better and help people, with whatever choices and resources I can muster.

You probably won't agree with this either, but here is what Bill Gates said to some school kids some time ago (although the source may be in dispute):

----------Whether you like Bill Gates or not...this is pretty
cool. Here's some advice Bill Gates recently dished out
at a high school speech about 11 things they did not
learn in school. He talks about how feel-good,
politically correct teaching has created a full
generation of kids with no concept of reality and how
this concept sets them up for failure in the real
world.

RULE 1
Life is not fair - get used to it.

RULE 2
The world won't care about your self-esteem. The world
will expect you to accomplish something BEFORE you feel
good about yourself.

RULE 3
You will NOT make 40 thousand dollars a year right out
of high school. You won't be a vice president with
car phone, until you earn both.

RULE 4
If you think your teacher is tough, wait till you get a
boss. He doesn't have tenure.

RULE 5
Flipping burgers is not beneath your dignity. Your
grandparents had a different word for burger flipping
they
called it Opportunity.

RULE 6
If you mess up,it's not your parents' fault, so don't
whine about your mistakes, learn from them.

RULE 7
Before you were born, your parents weren't as boring as
they are now. They got that way from paying your bills,
cleaning your clothes and listening to you talk about
how cool you are. So before you save the rain forest
from the parasites of your parent's generation, try
delousing the closet in your own room.


RULE 8
Your school may have done away with winners and losers,
but life has not. In some schools they have abolished
failing grades and they'll give you as many times as
you want to get the right answer. This doesn't bear the
slightest resemblance to ANYTHING in real life.

RULE 9
Life is not divided into semesters. You don't get
summers off and very few employers are interested in
helping you find yourself. Do that on your own time.

RULE 10
Television is NOT real life. In real life people
actually have to leave the coffee shop and go to jobs.

RULE 11
Be nice to nerds. Chances are you'll end up working for
one.

[MitchM]

Originally Posted by reefermadness

Yes because our economies and monetary system is perfect and infallible. They definitely should never be scrutinized. The shenanigans (yes I said it) of Wallstreet is just part of the perfection.

If kids/students can't listen to different ideas and arguments and look on them objectively, we'll that is a shame. Also if we can't think and work on improvements to systems (monetary system being one), that is so closed minded and also sad.

Personally I really like the Zeitgeist films (there are 3). I don't agree with everything in them but they are eye openers for sure. They cover a lot of topics, like mental health, religion, war and are probably only 25% about the monetary system.

A good documentary to watch about the crash of 2008 and subsequent recession is inside job. It does a good job of laying out the sicking financial moves that lead to one of worst market declines in history. In October '08 the head of the International Monetary Fund/IMF warned that the world financial system was teetering on the "brink of systemic meltdown.

I'm not personally against any of this stuff but even if you think something is great you can still try to objectively look at the flaws and think of improvements. I love myself but sometimes I think about how I can be a better person. Then I grab a beer

I didn't say the system was perfect, of course is is not. That's why we need more education about the systems that are currently in place.

I am also neither closed minded or sad, quite the opposite.

In order to view or discuss conspiracy stories, one should have a good understanding of the subject beforehand and a sophistication that allows for an objective understanding of who the presenter is. The "artist" or "activist" does have an agenda. I would prefer to see a respected investigative journalist first dig up some actual facts. Otherwise it's basically just campfire talking points.

Also, you can be sure that the presenter has a few corporations of their own, in order to maximize profits from the product that they're selling.

I'm also not naive.

[reefermadness]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Well, if I was going to fret about every bit of unfairness (in my opinion) I see in life, I would be a very unhappy person. Instead I choose to change things for the better and help people, with whatever choices and resources I can muster.

Again this is very confusing. If you are not concerned about anything why are you trying to change anything. Someone who is not concerned does nothing.

I'm no huge activist, far from it but at least I can look at this world and be concerned. I don't let it affect my daily life but I acknowledge the messed up stuff I witness/read and engage in a conversation about it sure. Maybe that will increase awareness. Like when I mentioned 18,000 children die of hungry related causes a day. I bet that blew the minds of a lot of people reading it. I know when I first read that statistic I was shocked.

You probably won't agree with this either, but here is what Bill Gates said to some school kids some time ago (although the source may be in dispute.

....the source is in dispute (Bill Gates did not say or write these words) by pretty much everyone.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/librar...tes_speech.htm
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors...m#.UmAJLVP-tWo
http://www.snopes.com/politics/soapbox/schoolrules.asp

[reefermadness]

Originally Posted by MitchM

I didn't say the system was perfect, of course is is not. That's why we need more education about the systems that are currently in place.

I am also neither closed minded or sad, quite the opposite.

In order to view or discuss conspiracy stories, one should have a good understanding of the subject beforehand and a sophistication that allows for an objective understanding of who the presenter is. The "artist" or "activist" does have an agenda. I would prefer to see a respected investigative journalist first dig up some actual facts. Otherwise it's basically just campfire talking points.

Also, you can be sure that the presenter has a few corporations of their own, in order to maximize profits from the product that they're selling.

I'm also not naive.

Sorry I'm not saying your are sad or close minded in general but to not even allow yourself to consider the possibility of truth or partial truth in at least some of his arguments is. I'm not a conspiracy theorist and Im sure some of his arguments are made out of thin air but some hold truth as well, its just to get you thinking. Waiting for main stream media to shed light on some of these issues is not a good idea either, IMO the state of media today is pretty bad. Do you really think what the "trusted media" feeds us today is fool proof and 100% true?

I also never said you were naive.