Talk me into a Apex!!!

[daniella3d]

I have no idea how you did your price comparaison but the RA with a temp probe, PH, a salinity module, 2 power bars of 8 outlets and wifi is 577 $ not 889$!! that's still 357$ less than the Apex package.

The temp, ph and ATO come STANDARD with the basic model at 219$. All you need to add is the salinity module and the wifi adapter and the second power bars to get a total of 16 outlets.

I am going to get the ORP as my salinity don't vary with the ATO, and my controller is still going to cost me just 430$ for temp, ph, orp, ATO, wifi and 8 outlets. That's about half the Apex price for these options.

Originally Posted by FishyFishy!

Just did a price comparison between Apex and this "Reef Angel" controller.......because my next purchase is a controller.

To make them do the same things (this is what I would want them to do as a base)

Temp
PH
Salinity
2 X powerbars
ATO
Wifi

Apex - $934.95
Reef Angel - $889.00

Main issue with the Reef Angel is that you need to add an expensive "expansion module" for every little thing you want to add.

[FishyFishy!]

Originally Posted by daniella3d

I have no idea how you did your price comparaison but the RA with a temp probe, PH, a salinity module, 2 power bars of 8 outlets and wifi is 577 $ not 889$!! that's still 357$ less than the Apex package.

Simple math. And you MUST be forgetting that you need 'expansion modules' for all add ons, like the second power bar, and the salinity monitor.

Here it is broken down -

Controller - $289.00 (I chose the higher model in both cases, APEX as well)
Relay Expansion for Power Bar - $119.00
8 Outlet Powerbar - $99.00
Salinity Expansion Module - $149.00
Salinity Probe - $75.00
Expansion Hub (required when you have more than one expansion..lol) - $49.00
Wifi Attachment - $109.00


You add that all up.... (Those extra items are what I would want on my controller, especially a salinity monitor).

[sphelps]

Well within three days of starting this thread another members Apex has crashed. So for those people following along and comparing profilux to apex, that's one more reason profilux costs more.

[Aquattro]

Originally Posted by sphelps

Well within three days of starting this thread another members Apex has crashed. So for those people following along and comparing profilux to apex, that's one more reason profilux costs more.

Exactly. Never in the history of Profilux has one ever had a problem. lol

[sphelps]

Originally Posted by Aquattro

Exactly. Never in the history of Profilux has one ever had a problem.

You had a typo, I fixed it for you

[daniella3d]

Simple math? not so simple it seems?

The salinity module come with the probe already. If you are only going to use the salinity module, then you don't need the model at 289$ as the model that I have cost 219$ and does everything as well. The only time the more expensive model is required is when you are going to do a lot of your own programmation with it, which I doubt you would do. And surely much more than what the Apex can do because with the Apex you cannot even add your own coding...that's limited to what's been programmed in there. With the basic unit you still can do lots of your own programmation as well. I did a good analysis of this before choosing the basic or the model with more memory and realized the basic was more than enough for about 99% of the people.

The relay expension come with the relay box as well, so are doing the math without even knowing what you need to calculate. That's why you end up with the wrong total.

So here is the correct math for a system which you said you want, with salinity and 16 outlets, wifi, PH, temp and controllable ATO with 2 float switch.

controller 219$ (Comes with ATO, PH, temp and 8 outlets bar)
wifi 109$
relay expension + 8 outlets relay box 119$
expension hub 49$
salinity module 149$ (come with the salinity probe)

total 645$

that's still far from what the Apex would cost for the same configuration. Even if you choose the model with more memory, which you would not need, you still much lower than with the Apex.


Now how much does the Apex version of this system cost? I would bet that it is more than 1000$. I am now at 1015$ on the goreef web site and I don't even have any ATO included in this.


LOL!? who's loughting?

Originally Posted by FishyFishy!

Simple math. And you MUST be forgetting that you need 'expansion modules' for all add ons, like the second power bar, and the salinity monitor.

Here it is broken down -

Controller - $289.00 (I chose the higher model in both cases, APEX as well)
Relay Expansion for Power Bar - $119.00
8 Outlet Powerbar - $99.00
Salinity Expansion Module - $149.00
Salinity Probe - $75.00
Expansion Hub (required when you have more than one expansion..lol) - $49.00
Wifi Attachment - $109.00


You add that all up.... (Those extra items are what I would want on my controller, especially a salinity monitor).

[mike31154]

My tank's been running fine without a controller for 6+ years now. I've never been able to justify the price for something that's so specific to our hobby. In the end, they're all simply processors with some coding & a display. IMO, with today's technology, there should be generic components available that can be configured to run on any smart phone, notebook, pc, mac, tablet, what have you without having to be a 'reef' thing. I've been looking at home automation systems lately & it looks like things are finally getting to the point where it may be worthwhile. After all, the components used for a reef controller are really only sensors, timers, relays, a display, a low power processor & the appropriate coding/software. It's beyond me why you can't simply buy generic components & hook them up to your smart phone, notebook, tablet.... Sure there are some unique sensors for pH, salinity, etc. but as far as timers, controlled power outlets etc., these items are available for other systems as well, aka home automation. I don't know of too many folks these days that don't have the required processing power in components they already own. It would be nice if a manufacturer would step up & simply provide the sensing components with some cables or wifi that will talk to the components you already have at home.

As far as the $$$ war between apex, reef angel, profilux etc., what the hey, if you can afford a controller & want one, what difference does a couple hundred $$s make? Any electronic/electric/software component is subject to failure, like most things in life. That's why I think 'generic' & noname stuff is preferable since you're not tied to the 'brand' name goodies that are only repairable by the OEM.

end rant...

[daniella3d]

so basically you would want your reef controller to start your coffee in the morning? or start the sprinkler for watering your garden?

The most important part of the controller is its programmation and if you know about programming you could make your Reef Angel control your home as well.

What is reef oriented like you said are the PH probe, salinity and ORP probe. It would probably be easier to work on your controller to become a home automation system than to make a home automation system control all these reef oriented features and probes.

The problem with any system, and almost all controllers, is that they are not user programmable. YOu have to live with what ever has been encoded into it. Not so with the Reef Angel.

I know pretty darn well why an aquarium controller is an essential piece of equipeemnt for me, but I don't see how a home automation system is necessary? To do what exactly? control the lights when you're away? there are already little gadgets to do that. What else? water your garden? again there are automated system for that. Record your favorite programs? it is already taken care of with a recorder.

The only thing I would want when away from the house would be a set of webcams to watch over the house. I have one on my reef so I can see my aquarium when I leave the house.

Originally Posted by mike31154

My tank's been running fine without a controller for 6+ years now. I've never been able to justify the price for something that's so specific to our hobby. In the end, they're all simply processors with some coding & a display. IMO, with today's technology, there should be generic components available that can be configured to run on any smart phone, notebook, pc, mac, tablet, what have you without having to be a 'reef' thing. I've been looking at home automation systems lately & it looks like things are finally getting to the point where it may be worthwhile. After all, the components used for a reef controller are really only sensors, timers, relays, a display, a low power processor & the appropriate coding/software. It's beyond me why you can't simply buy generic components & hook them up to your smart phone, notebook, tablet.... Sure there are some unique sensors for pH, salinity, etc. but as far as timers, controlled power outlets etc., these items are available for other systems as well, aka home automation. I don't know of too many folks these days that don't have the required processing power in components they already own. It would be nice if a manufacturer would step up & simply provide the sensing components with some cables or wifi that will talk to the components you already have at home.

As far as the $$$ war between apex, reef angel, profilux etc., what the hey, if you can afford a controller & want one, what difference does a couple hundred $$s make? Any electronic/electric/software component is subject to failure, like most things in life. That's why I think 'generic' & noname stuff is preferable since you're not tied to the 'brand' name goodies that are only repairable by the OEM.

end rant...

[jorjef]

Tomorrows sunrise is 6:08 am and the high will be -2. Or at least that's what some controller told someone that reported it free of charge. Oh tank temp is 78 with my finger dip probe ... salinity of who cares , PH of not really sure, the corals say alk and calcium are close and my five gallon pail top off system if flawless

[mike31154]

Originally Posted by daniella3d

so basically you would want your reef controller to start your coffee in the morning? or start the sprinkler for watering your garden?

The most important part of the controller is its programmation and if you know about programming you could make your Reef Angel control your home as well.

What is reef oriented like you said are the PH probe, salinity and ORP probe. It would probably be easier to work on your controller to become a home automation system than to make a home automation system control all these reef oriented features and probes.

The problem with any system, and almost all controllers, is that they are not user programmable. YOu have to live with what ever has been encoded into it. Not so with the Reef Angel.

I know pretty darn well why an aquarium controller is an essential piece of equipeemnt for me, but I don't see how a home automation system is necessary? To do what exactly? control the lights when you're away? there are already little gadgets to do that. What else? water your garden? again there are automated system for that. Record your favorite programs? it is already taken care of with a recorder.

The only thing I would want when away from the house would be a set of webcams to watch over the house. I have one on my reef so I can see my aquarium when I leave the house.

Well, like I said, I don't currently have an aquarium controller & probably won't get one. I certainly don't need one to start my coffee in the morning. I do have an irrigation system & controller though!

As far as my tank goes, I don't test water paramaters that often & when I do, I don't consider it a chore. With my current set up, I don't feel I need to have something constantly monitoring pH, salinity, orp, alk, calc. Digital timers run my lights. I'm with jorjef on that stuff. I see my tank every day & have been at it long enough that I can tell pretty quick if something is off sufficiently to cause concern. When I'm away for more than a few days, my lovely daughter & future son in law check in on the tank.

I guess the point I'm trying to make with the controllers & home automation is that the technology is available that there should be a relatively low cost, easily programable interface that one can use with any computing device. You should be able to also acquire the hardware for whatever you'd like to control without it having to be a niche item. Kind of like a DIN standard or something. The sensors, relays, timers are out there, we just need them to have the flexibility to be hooked up to & controlled by the computing devices we already own instead of having to by another proprietary device. We're getting there & I don't think it will be too long before this happens. There are already smart light bulbs & electrical receptacles available which have wireless capabilty & can be controlled by your computer via the proper interface.

http://www.homelinkdesign.net/automation.html

http://robothouse.net/wordpress/overview/

... and to the OP, looks like you've made your choice on the Apex & it will undoubtedly do the job for you. Don't think you needed all that much convincing from us!