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#31
10-31-2011, 01:04 AM
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Hard to say what each individual should be looking at with any particular LED solution, since we all have slightly different tanks & requirements with respect to the livestock we choose to keep. If someone is having success with a particular size tank that's similar to yours, especially with a PAR38 set up, you will likely be in the ballpark for your own system. The great thing about the PAR38 form factor, is you can always add another without too much rewiring. PAR38s are continuing to evolve with more and higher power emitters being installed in them all the time. Pretty sure I've seen some with 12 individual LEDs in them.
I was at the Home Depot yesterday and there are already a number of new offerings in the LED lighting section compared to when I was last there a few weeks ago. The lights Steve (StirCrazy) purchased for home lighting are currently on sale for under $13, so I picked up a couple more myself. This price would have been unheard of just a few months ago, let alone even having something of this nature on the shelf. Not for aquarium, but the writing certainly appears to be on the wall. Other lighting technologies will eventually be eclipsed by LEDs. I mentioned I was looking at a 12 volt DC solution with my MR16 schtick. I just read that one of the LED manufacturers is actually working on an AC powered LED, no driver required. Most folks may not be aware of the fact that conversion of AC to DC to run LEDs (DC devices) results in a 15 to 30% power loss in the process. So each of those Meanwells, buck pucks or whatever driver you use, is consuming extra power that would be better utilized using a straight DC voltage source. I just ordered a couple of these to see how they may work:  They are 10 watt Cool White LEDS & the price is right for experimenting. Chips similar to these although at 50 & 100 watts look to be the ones used in the Ecoxotic Cannon type LED lights that cost a freakin' fortune. By buying these chips yourself, with the reflector & lens assemblies, you can build something similar for less than $50. I got two sets of two of these for $21. The reason I chose the 10 watt jobs is again, they can run directly off 12 volts DC. Might be wise to add a regulator/driver to ensure the voltage & current does not deviate too far off the 12 volt nominal voltage. If this ends up working well, I may ditch the MR16 build and do this instead, or a combo. To me, the craze in DIY LEDs seems to be single Cree emitters in the 3 watt range. Not sure everyone needs that much light and am trying to see if alternatives such as this are viable.
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Mike 77g sumpless SW DIY 10 watt multi-chip LED build  http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=82206
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#32
10-31-2011, 03:24 AM
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the main reason for having AC is the ability to change its voltage easy and it carries over long distances better. I think the man drive for developing AC Line voltage driven LEDs is cost. no ballast needed, can be dimmed with a simple wall dimmer from home depot ect..... Steve
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 *everything said above is just my opinion, and may or may not reflect the views of this BBS, its Operators, and its Members. If cornered on any “opinion” I post I will totally deny having ever said this in a Court of Law…Unless I am the right one*Some strive to be perfect.... I just strive.
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#33
10-31-2011, 03:55 PM
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Sorry, I simply meant to highlight that the voltage conversion process itself uses some power, not that DC is less efficient. Efficiency depends on the individual device design & usage regardless whether it's designed for AC or DC. Even the conversion process from DC to AC, using an inverter, loses some efficiency. The inverter robs some power to do its job. While the 12VDC furnace fan you mention may be more efficient, you still need a device (transformer/rectifier) to bring your 120VAC down to the 12VDC. The transformer/rectifier uses some power itself, not much mind you, but if you had a 12VDC supply in your home home & could ditch the TRU, you would run even more efficiently, saving additional power over the long term.
Ideally the grid would provide us with both AC & DC, this way we could choose to run either type of device without converting the voltage using drivers, xformers, rectifiers, power supplies, etc. in our home. Not that far fetched these days even. The province of Manitoba has the distinction of having some of the longest DC power transmission lines in the world. Trouble is, they convert it back into AC before connecting it to the grid since this has been the standard in homes since the dawn of the electrical age. People with solar/wind/micro-hydro power that are also still connected to the grid already have this option to an extent, depending on the capacity of their home power genreation system. This is why I'm thinking of getting a solar array & some batteries. I already have a small wind generator, but haven't set it up yet. Once set up I can run DC devices such as my VorTechs from the battery bank using 24 VDC with 12 VDC as backup and also a certain amount of my LED lighting straight from the DC source. Come to think of it, I believe the MR16 LED lamps I have already handle either 12VAC or 12VDC. An old MR16 LED I salvaged out of a fixture was polarity sensitive, I had to plug it into the socket the correct way, my new ones automatically sense, so they're foolproof. Here's a link to a pretty good article about the development & usage of AC LEDs. A little technical in parts, but plenty of less complex info as well. http://www.ledsmagazine.com/features/3/5/2
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Mike 77g sumpless SW DIY 10 watt multi-chip LED build http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=82206
Last edited by mike31154; 10-31-2011 at 10:46 PM.
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#34
10-31-2011, 07:32 PM
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this does show a lot of prommis especialy in lenght of runs, if they run the two side wave form they basicly have 60V at 15 amps X2 so essentualy you could run 300 3watt LEDs in one string. and see a power savings of about 4% if I am reading it right, as that is the average 12V driver inefficiency. in bigger led's like 100 watt units that are used for arena lighting and such you would realize a much larger power savings. imagine 3 or 4 100watt briglux LEDs over your tank for lighting.. 
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*everything said above is just my opinion, and may or may not reflect the views of this BBS, its Operators, and its Members. If cornered on any “opinion” I post I will totally deny having ever said this in a Court of Law…Unless I am the right one*Some strive to be perfect.... I just strive.
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#35
10-31-2011, 08:54 PM
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i was just wondering why led is soo expensive
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#36
10-31-2011, 09:01 PM
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Since it is newer, it is not mass produced to the extend of other lighting options, so availability is not high. So, high demand plus low quantity equals really high price. As more and more companies produce it and more consumers buy it, it will be more widely mass produced and costs will eventually come down.
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240 gallon tank build: http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...d.php?t=110073
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#37
10-31-2011, 10:31 PM
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#38
11-01-2011, 12:59 AM
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I actually want to try a Kessil Canon to see how it compares to my 150 MH.
http://kessil.com/products/a150_led_aquarium_light.php Cheers, Vic
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#39
12-08-2011, 04:11 AM
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Philips AmbientLED 12W http://www.homedepot.ca/product/12w-...t-white/926038 3W LED Chandelier http://www.homedepot.ca/product/3w-l...t-white/926044
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#40
12-08-2011, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
 Steve
__________________
*everything said above is just my opinion, and may or may not reflect the views of this BBS, its Operators, and its Members. If cornered on any “opinion” I post I will totally deny having ever said this in a Court of Law…Unless I am the right one*Some strive to be perfect.... I just strive.
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