Hawaiian Ornamental Fishing Ban PASSED

[Slick Fork]

Originally Posted by gobytron

Ugh...
It IS a good thing Myka.

Just not for us.

For the fish, for the oceans, while you may believe we can be beneficial to these animals in the best of cases scenrio, the fact is, they are better off in the ocean no matter what...as long as the ocean remains able to supprt them.

Stop collection and protect these same habitats that collection is banned in and you have yourself the best case sceanrio for the fish...

I get why you feel so strongly there is a happy medium but it's only a medium for us and not for the animals themselves.

It's hard not to be selfish in a situation like this, but I think no matter which way you look at it the oceans and reefs especially would be better off without our meddling.

Habitat/environment protection is key and without it, any ban is senseless but the next largest mitigating factor to the continued survival of any trade related animal is us.

Looking at it any other way, IME, is seeing only the side that appeals to u as hobbyists....but I do get where you're coming from.

Very well said

[Aquaria]

I can't speak for everyone but I'm personally glad I won't get to see hawiian cleaner wrasses dieing in LFS tanks any more. so sad watching them starve to death and must I mention moorish idols? I know there range is huge but at least they won't be collected in Hawaii now

[Myka]

Originally Posted by Aquaria

I can't speak for everyone but I'm personally glad I won't get to see hawiian cleaner wrasses dieing in LFS tanks any more. so sad watching them starve to death and must I mention moorish idols? I know there range is huge but at least they won't be collected in Hawaii now

It wouldn't take a whole lot of effort to make collection limits on these fish (and other "sensitive" species) which would drive up the price and help to prevent "the average hobbyist" from acquiring them. The governing body is already in place (DAR). The only thing needing to happen are regulations on collecting limits.

Who wants to buy a $300 that is difficult to keep alive? Mostly only experts that know they can do it. I would LOVE to have a Moorish Idol, but I know I probably can't keep it which is enough for me to refuse to try.

I was in an LFS not too long ago where a customer was mad because a Moorish Idol died before he could buy it. I tried to tactfully explain why he would be a moron to buy it (he's a newbie in the sw world), but he wouldn't hear any of it. Something tells me he might have thought twice if the fish was $300 instead of $50. I personally don't believe that fish like the Moorish Idol and Cleaner Wrasse should be readily available to any hobbyist, and especially not for the insanely low prices they are offered at.

If we can't get regulations governing the export of fish from their country of origin then maybe we could put governing regulations on fishes being imported. Maybe sensitive species could have high import taxes which are forwarded to research institutes. There are a lot of ways that these issues in question could be improved.

[Slick Fork]

Originally Posted by Myka

It wouldn't take a whole lot of effort to make collection limits on these fish (and other "sensitive" species) which would drive up the price and help to prevent "the average hobbyist" from acquiring them. The governing body is already in place (DAR). The only thing needing to happen are regulations on collecting limits.

Who wants to buy a $300 that is difficult to keep alive? Mostly only experts that know they can do it. I would LOVE to have a Moorish Idol, but I know I probably can't keep it which is enough for me to refuse to try.

I was in an LFS not too long ago where a customer was mad because a Moorish Idol died before he could buy it. I tried to tactfully explain why he would be a moron to buy it (he's a newbie in the sw world), but he wouldn't hear any of it. Something tells me he might have thought twice if the fish was $300 instead of $50. I personally don't believe that fish like the Moorish Idol and Cleaner Wrasse should be readily available to any hobbyist, and especially not for the insanely low prices they are offered at.

If we can't get regulations governing the export of fish from their country of origin then maybe we could put governing regulations on fishes being imported. Maybe sensitive species could have high import taxes which are forwarded to research institutes. There are a lot of ways that these issues in question could be improved.

A blanket import tax on wild-caught fish is the only really practical method. A species specific tax relies on some customs guy being able to tell the difference between an ocellaris clownfish and a moorish idol, or a wholesaler being ethical enough to fill out the forms honestly.

Revenues from the tax would probably only be sufficient to cover the cost of enforcing it

I think everyone is in agreement that legislation and enforcement of collection practices and species is one thing in a developed place like Hawaii, but completely impractical in most of these impoverished nations where the bulk of our fish come from.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by Slick Fork

A blanket import tax on wild-caught fish is the only really practical method. A species specific tax relies on some customs guy being able to tell the difference between an ocellaris clownfish and a moorish idol, or a wholesaler being ethical enough to fill out the forms honestly.

The trouble with a blanket tax is that it wouldn't protect the more sensitive species. Hawaii Division of Aquatic Resources already has plenty of employees that can identify the different species.

Originally Posted by Slick Fork

I think everyone is in agreement that legislation and enforcement of collection practices and species is one thing in a developed place like Hawaii, but completely impractical in most of these impoverished nations where the bulk of our fish come from.

Yes, I agree with you there. MASNA is talking a bit about organizing some sort of governing body.

[Myka]

Kaua'i joins in the Ban. Another first.

Originally Posted by Ret Talbot

he second of five counties in Hawai'i have now voted urging the state to ban the marine aquarium trade. Many close to the debate over the marine aquarium fishery contend the vote was influenced by misinformation and misused statistics that seek to frame an ethical debate as a resource issue. The local media's response appears uncritical and potentially makes it more difficult for multi-stakeholder groups to work toward collaborative solutions that can ensure sustainability.

Two of the five counties in the state of Hawai‘i have now voted to urge the State to prohibit the sale of aquatic life for aquarium purposes. Echoing action taken by the Hawai‘i County Council in early October, Kaua‘i County Council recently voted unanimously to include in the 2012 Kaua‘i County Legislative Package a proposed draft resolution urging the Legislature to ban the collection of marine life for the aquarium trade statewide.

http://www.masna.org/Blog/tabid/430/...Statewide.aspx

[Delphinus]

Interesting days. I really feel the hobby and the industry behind it is at a major crossroads. It will be very interesting to see where things wind up in a couple years.