Clam troubles

[Delphinus]

You'll need a strong stomach. I do this for all my clams that I remove but you need to be a biologist or pathologist to really understand what you're seeing.

Greg I do sympathize but you are jumping to the wrong conclusion. Bristle worms (and for pity's sake, EVERYONE - PLEASE STOP CALLING THEM BRISTOL WORMS, for crying out loud! Geez! Sorry I just can't take it anymore!! BRISTLE WORMS!!! As in, the bristles like that on a broom. Bristol is a city in England!!) are scavengers.

Any scavenger will move in and possibly deal the final blow to a dieing animal. But does that make them the cause of death?

I'm sorry but I'm compelled to share one key learning in almost 15 years of keeping tridacnid clams: they don't turn around once past a point. They simply don't have the auto-immune response that other organisms might have. If you or I were tired or distressed and our immune response was compromised, we'd probably get the sniffles or a head cold. A clam on the other hand ... well that's just basically it. They CAN turnaround from some things but for the most part by the time you have realized something is amiss, it's usually well past the point of no return.

I don't mean to be mean here but you have to consider a few things. 1) You've added a lot of clams in the past 6 to 12 months from many different sources. If a pathogenic agent was introduced along the way there is no way to trace it back conclusively. 2) As I've stated MANY times before .... clam ailments are HUGELY contagious. I feel like a broken record but I'll say it again. Clam ailments are HUGELY contagious! All it takes is one clam that is compromised and your entire stock is at risk. It could have been something that affected one clam 6 to 8 months ago and the recent losses are simply the cascading-forward effects from that. 3) Clams are also hugely sensitive to, well, everything. Temperature, pH, Ca, Alk, heck even Mg levels, if any of these are not rock solid stable the clams are among the first to show it. Simply moving from one tank to another can be enough to kill them.

My point being basically that longevity of clams is dependent hugely on luck. It sucks but it's the reality. Sometimes a clam just dies. Every few years the clustering of clam deaths causes this kind of thread on the board because it's just human nature to want to pinpoint a single cause that we can all blame but the reality is it's probably a combination of rotten luck, coincidence, and the fact that we hobbyists don't tend to employ the strictest of cross-contamination-protocols.

[pelle31]

^^+1. Gotta agree with that post. My Clams are doing great and have no problems with the BRISTLE worms that I have in my tank with the clams. Then again I haven't added any either and nor will I for awhile.

[The Grizz]

Then how do you explain how a perfectly healthy clam in the morning and for the last 6 month in my tank and how ever long in Dougs tank can be dead in less then 8 hrs? I have been checking all my clams an hr after the lights go out for creepy crawlies and last night there were 2 BRISTLE worms going for the bottom of my 2 biggest clams, not to mention NEITHER are on the sand bed. I got to all 4 of them before they could get into the clam but still one died. And again I said WTF!!

[reefwars]

Originally Posted by The Grizz

Then how do you explain how a perfectly healthy clam in the morning and for the last 6 month in my tank and how ever long in Dougs tank can be dead in less then 8 hrs? I have been checking all my clams an hr after the lights go out for creepy crawlies and last night there were 2 BRISTLE worms going for the bottom of my 2 biggest clams, not to mention NEITHER are on the sand bed. I got to all 4 of them before they could get into the clam but still one died. And again I said WTF!!

i think what tony is saying is one of your new additions has brought in "the cold" and now they all are sick.....the healthy ones are either gonna fight it to a certain point and just die...... or possibly make it

to keep some bristle worms off try putting your clam on a shelf from eggcrate untill you figure out whats going on good luck buddy sorry to hear about all the clams .....

[Delphinus]

Greg I totally sympathize. Imagine how I felt when I lost my >5 year 14" squamosa last fall in the same manner. I can conclusively say it was not bristleworms: I checked. I removed brittlestars and copepods but the worms hadn't moved in yet.

The thing with scavengers is that they move in when they sense opportunity. I guess a dieing clam must smell like food. I'll tell you, I've seen all manners of critters move in on clams in the last moments - shrimp, fish, etc. Entirely possible that the clams might be saveable at certain points before the scavangers deal the final blow, but generally there's something else that pushes them to the edge first.

The basic layout of clam physiology/biology can be summed up as follows: mantle, digestive system, respiratory system, circulatory system, then the shell and the muscles to open and close. Some of these operate in more or less complete independence of the others - meaning that internally there could be something wrong before the mantle (generally the only part we really see) starts to show any signs of distress. This could potentially explain part of the "it looked fine yesterday but now it's just an empty shell" phenomenon.

Two books I highly recommend if you're interested in learning more about clams: "Giant Clams in the Sea and the Aquarium" by James Fatheree, and "Giant Clams" by Daniel Knop. The Knop book is a little old now and translated into English so gets a little awkward at time but it is still current and basically the defacto Tridacnid bible so is still worthy of a spot on your bookshelf if you're into tridacnids (and hippopus for that matter). I WAS going to say "if you're into clams" but why give Brett/Kien/Doug/etc. an opening like that.

Sorry if the tone regarding the Bristol vs bristle wasn't obvious as lighthearted, was only intended as a razz.

Anyhow I realize this doesn't explain anything and it's frustrating and I really do sympathize. Clams are hugely vexatious parts of the hobby: nothing screams "tropical Pacific reef" more than giant clams and here are they are teasing us and causing us stress when they check out en masse like that. Believe me, I'm conflicted, they drive me nuts and yet I can't stop lovin' them and wanting more.

cheers

[kien]

So let me get this straight. What you're trying to say here is that in a Brett and Doug sandwich I would be the filler? I'm not sure how I feel about that.

[es355lucille]

LMAO!!!!!

Originally Posted by kien

So let me get this straight. What you're trying to say here is that in a Brett and Doug sandwich I would be the filler? I'm not sure how I feel about that.

[fishytime]

Originally Posted by kien

So let me get this straight. What you're trying to say here is that in a Brett and Doug sandwich I would be the filler? I'm not sure how I feel about that.

I like samages........but that sounds to me like too much meat for my liking......I would more prefer more of a Laurie/Doug/Girly samage....more bun than meat

[kien]

Originally Posted by Delphinus

and for pity's sake, EVERYONE - PLEASE STOP CALLING THEM BRISTOL WORMS, for crying out loud! Geez! Sorry I just can't take it anymore!! BRISTLE WORMS!!!

Um, hey Tony, hope you're having a great weekend buddy.

Just an FYI, this may be the Bristol worm that people are talking about? Nasty little buggers.

[Zoaelite]

Originally Posted by kien

Um, hey Tony, hope you're having a great weekend buddy.

Just an FYI, this may be the Bristol worm that people are talking about? Nasty little buggers.

Talk about creeper child in the front .

It is definatley a clamademic!!!

Y'all crazy...
I could take a couple of fresh samples into the lab and try and culture them for some tests if Doug or you is willing to drop them off @ my house Tuesday night or Wed. morning?

I can't promise you anything but I would sure love to try?