Phytoplankton starter culture - Calgary

[Rotifer]

It's really unfortunately that abcha0s is so adamant about Tigger-Pods (Tigriopus californicus) being a cold water species. I'm not going to be able to change his/her mind, but for anybody else that wants to see a scientifically peer-reviewed and published paper stating that their temperature range is 43 F to 91 F, take a look at the link below. Obviously the Cambridge Journals website is not something I can fake

http://journals.cambridge.org/action...line&aid=70713

Temperatures above 80 F and below about 65F are not their optimal temperature range, but they can live and produce in those ranges.

[soapy]

Hi interesting thread. Just hooking up to see where this might go.

[phyto4life]

that would be great news I love the name Tigriopus californicus I also love their size if this is true

when you say reproduce

at what % @ a temp range of 78f-82F?

from the little I read they seem to breed well at sub-tropical temp but seem to die off at tropical temps and seize to reproduce.

do you have any free paper's regarding their reproduction at higher temps?

why do stores put them into the fridge?

is it for the same reasons as phyto?

[abcha0s]

Originally Posted by Rotifer

It's really unfortunately that abcha0s is so adamant about Tigger-Pods (Tigriopus californicus) being a cold water species. I'm not going to be able to change his/her mind, but for anybody else that wants to see a scientifically peer-reviewed and published paper stating that their temperature range is 43 F to 91 F, take a look at the link below. Obviously the Cambridge Journals website is not something I can fake

http://journals.cambridge.org/action...line&aid=70713

Temperatures above 80 F and below about 65F are not their optimal temperature range, but they can live and produce in those ranges.

I have no problem double checking my opinion. You comments sent me to go more in-depth with my research and I did settle on some new ideas (I also updated my original post to reflect this). I concede your point that Tiger-Pods are sustainable at higher temperatures. I had read elsewhere that the higher temperatures result in a predominately male population which over time loses its ability to sustain itself, although I cannot say for sure if this is anything more than someone’s theory. What is certainly a fact is that environmental conditions do affect their reproductive cycle, but more research than I have time for would be needed to identify exactly what that effect is.

Here is an excellent paper that supports your view: https://scholarsbank.uoregon.edu/xml...41/Herbert.pdf

However, my opinion on the usefulness of this species in a reef tank remains unchanged for the following reasons:

* It’s all about the flow in our tanks. Consider 30x as a baseline.
* Tiger-Pods are free swimming. In a high flow tank, they are whipped around like a tornado. They are repeatedly sucked through the pumps which they often survive, but occasionally do not. 30x flow is a lot of flow and many of our tanks have even more than that.
* In a system with powerful skimming, things don’t look good for free swimming pods.

I added 2 bottles of Tiger-Pods to my refugium. Each bottle is between 2000-4000 specimens. I observed the following:
* Within the first day, most of the Tiger-Pods had left the refugium and were circulating through the display tank. All of the ones that I could see were still alive after being sucked through the return pump, but it’s much harder to see the dead ones.
* Many of the Tiger-Pods were skimmed out during the first day.
* Most of the remaining Tiger-Pods were skimmed out on the second day.
* Within a week, I could not find a single Tiger-Pod anywhere.
* I theorized that being repeatedly sucked through the pumps greatly increases the mortality rate.
* My fish chased after the Tiger-Pods but in a 30X system, they are really moving and the fish had only limited success in catching them.

> While irrelevant to this conversation, I also believe that there is little evidence to suggest that Mandarins can survive on Tiger-Pods. Mandarins are slow feeders and like to pick off the rocks, while Tiger-Pods are free swimming. While they may catch the occasion Tiger-Pod, there is no question that better species exist for keeping Mandarins. I had very good success with Tibse Sp. – Incidentally, after adding 5000 Tibse Sp. Copepods to my system about 6 weeks ago, I can still find them alive and well.

To back up my opinion with science, I offer this information on the breading methods of Tigriopus califoricus (quoted from the research paper referrenced above).

“During mating the adult male swims above the adult female or fifth stage female copepodid attached by the hooks of the first antennae. The amplectic pair may spend several hours to several days together during which time a spermatophore is transferred to the female. This will suffice for the development of up to twenty broods of eggs (Vittor, 1971). Five to ten days after copulation, depending on temperature, or soon after the final moult if the female had mated at the fifth copepodid stage, a small dark egg sac appears behind the fifth leg of the female. It grows quickly changing to pale green and eventually assuming a bright pink color. The eggs (average 46, range 10-110 (Vittor, 1971]) remain in the sac from ten to fifteen days and then hatch while the sac is still attached to the female.”

Now – consider how this could possibly occur in a high flow reef tank? – I think it is impossible for this process to complete in our tank.

Some additional science:

“Towing plankton nets just off rocky shores failed to produce Tigriopus (Vittor, 1971).”

My interpretation of this is that certain population densities are required for the species to survive. They have to be able to find each other before they can attempt to mate.

In summary – My “new” research suggests that it should be fairly easy to culture the Tiger-Pods outside of your tank, but they are unlikely to sustain their population within your tank. Further, because they are free swimming, if your tank has a high rate of flow, their usefulness is greatly diminished. Finally, they are not a suitable species for keeping a Mandarin.

[Seamazter]

the "Rotifer" handle is Randy reed.
Randy Reed, Reed Mariculture / Reef Nutrition owner of the tigerpod brand.

[Rotifer]

I completely agree with that they will not do well in a main tank. We recommend putting them in the refugium or sump, or a seperate tank (9x13 cake pans work especially well).

My only bone of contention was your suggestion that they are a cold water species. I'm constantly having to put that fire out. Thank you for your very polite and on-point reply.

I'm flying home from Greece in a few hours and look forward to seeing how this thread continues.

[phyto4life]

I hear that they are extremely cannibalistic eating their young like mysid shrimp


My assumption it that they are like cleaner shrimp etc eating all types of eggs,pods etc there might be a possible chance that they may hunt smaller harp's and kill them

True?

[Rotifer]

Cannibalism is not a behavior that we have ever seen. To my knowledge they are strictly herbivores and detriatavores. You can find many postings on forums that describe them as growing well and playing nicely with other pods.

[Seamazter]

I do have some 1st hand knowlage to add on the tigerpods.
I did buy a bottle after seeing this thread start, just to see what i learned to be the truth.
I added about 90% to a small 2.5 gallon tank, added a slow bubble airsource, and a small amount of live phytoplankton and some crushed flake(formula 2).
The 10% in the bottle are sitting here on my desk on a small usb chiller (meant for chilling drinks on the computer).
The 2.5 gallon in the last week has doubled in growth at normal room tempurtare 78 F.
The small bottle here on the usb chiller has not had any change at all, they are still swimming and active, just a little less active as the room temputare tank.

From my observations this last week, i have noticed the warmer temputure tank has indeed blossemed, the lower temp, in the origninal bottle has also done well however if they are indeed cold water, my money woulda been on the cooler bottle doubling the density.

Im certain with my own review of the tigerpod brand, that they are more prolific in the larger container at normal room temp.

As a result i must agree that they will reproduce in the warmer tank waters that we like to keep our reefs at, those of you running at 80 F may not experience the same growth that i have just seen, however in a reef tank with the turbulance of the pumps and other factors, i would suggest adding to a true refugium with low flow and plenty of places for refuge such as some type of macro algae.

[phyto4life]

That's good news

can they get by their first life stage with t-iso Phyto alone?