Swine Flu/H1N1 Vaccination - Yes or No?

[untamed]

I probably won't. I have never got one in the past. I'm sure there is nothing sinister about the flu vaccine.

I'm pretty sure that more people will get the flu shot this year than previous years.

If I'm wrong, you have my permission to point at my tombstone and say "told you so...".

[mark]

I haven't bought into the world is coming to the end with H1N1 bit but I've got no problem getting it.

Do like the conspiracy vote though, some people seem to believe there is one.

[banditpowdercoat]

freakin SARS was a "pandemic" but truthfully, how many people killed world wide?? How many die from the regular flu world wide? How many from slipping in the shower?

I don't buy the media hype. Media is just what "they" want you to think!!!


So ya, I picked conspiracy


PS i think your right, more WILL get the flu shot this year, and how much does said flu shot cost? Someones planning to make ALOT of money I think, it's ALL marketing. Playing on our fears and the "well, what if they are telling the truth'? How are we supposed to know??


Side note, How many Zietgiest watchers/followers here???

[Mr.nintendo]

It's all bull**** media hype, I'd rather risk "H1N1" then the known and occuring side effects from the shot

[pinhead]

Originally Posted by Mr.nintendo

It's all bull**** media hype, I'd rather risk "H1N1" then the known and occuring side effects from the shot

What are the known and occuring side effects and where are you getting your information - the media?

Or second hand information from other people,

Originally Posted by Quinster

They told me about half a dozen deaths locally they knew about from the same batch of meds that were used.

Or Youtube?

Originally Posted by workn2hard2day

this is one of the side effects, if you are 1 in a million.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mScGC...layer_embedded

(An explanation of the woman's symptoms http://www.examiner.com/x-13791-Balt...ll-in-her-head)



My information comes from the scientist's research. This information is found in peer-reviewed scientific journals or summarized for the layman magazines such as New Scientist. http://www.newscientist.com/article/...ef=online-news

Doing research from these sources will lead you to the following facts:

This strain of flu isn't always mild

It can be fatal - particularly in young people (43 deaths of children in the US in the first 2 weeks of October)

Even if you have a mild reaction to the flu virus, you could be the cause of a serious ilness in your children, other family member, co-worker or anyone else you come in contact with

Although the virus can be breathed in as an aerosol droplet, in can survive upto 48 hours on non-porous surfaces and then transfered to your eyes, nose or mouth.

The vaccine is safe (the canadian vaccine, unlike the US is a dead virus). The misinformation about flu vaccine side effects come from the 1976 US swine flu vaccinations where out of 48 million vaccinations, roughly 500 people developed Guillain-Barré syndrome and 25 died. This rate is roughly 10 cases of Guillain-Barré Syndrome for every 1 million vaccinations. Surprisingly, Guillain-Barré is found at a rate of 40-70 for every 1 million non-vaccinated flu sufferers and in the general population from other sources at 10 - 20 cases for every million people. Your chances if you were vaccinated in 1976 of getting Guillain-Barré were lower than if you caught the flu and the same as getting it from other sources.

Medical technology and vaccines have improved in 23 years - these side effects were from the 1976 vaccine.

One of these advancements is the addition of adjuvants made of fish oil, water and Vitamin E which are added to improve the body's immune response.

In Canada, the vaccine is free.

So the vaccine is: safe, cheap and will protect me or my family from from a possibly fatal disease. I guess I don't have tell you I am getting the vaccine.

I can provide references so you can base your decision on verifiable facts rather than rumors and information from almost 30 years ago.

[wickedfrags]

Some good references made, so I will ask a couple follow up questions:

Is 43 deaths significant given the number of "young people" in the US? How many young people died in the US during the same time period to give us some perspective? Also - the people who died from the curent strain have generally had underlying health issues and were often immuno-compromized prior to aquiring the flu. Asthma, diabetes, obesity, and various and other upper and lower repiratory tract concerns are common among those who died.

Protecting others is a strong reason for getting the flue shot - and remember you are contagious 48 hours before you show any signs or symptoms of the flu yourself.

The flu can survice up to 48 hours outside the human body, but at what relative humidity? Flu season in Canada (well at least outside BC) is generally quite cold and relative humidity is low.

Originally Posted by pinhead

This strain of flu isn't always mild

It can be fatal - particularly in young people (43 deaths of children in the US in the first 2 weeks of October)

Even if you have a mild reaction to the flu virus, you could be the cause of a serious ilness in your children, other family member, co-worker or anyone else you come in contact with

Although the virus can be breathed in as an aerosol droplet, in can survive upto 48 hours on non-porous surfaces and then transfered to your eyes, nose or mouth.

Medical technology and vaccines have improved in 23 years - these side effects were from the 1976 vaccine.

[intarsiabox]

IF it is preventable even one extra death is too many. I sure wouldn't want one of my daughters to die because of the swine flu and then have people say, "Oh well, she was only one of 43". Of course I'm only saying "IF" as the vaccine isn't widely proven yet but I hope it is the answer.

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by wickedfrags.com

Some good references made, so I will ask a couple follow up questions:

The flu can survice up to 48 hours outside the human body, but at what relative humidity? Flu season in Canada (well at least outside BC) is generally quite cold and relative humidity is low.

Hi Dave,

The conditions in Canada in the winter are actually probably more conducive to flu virus survival outside the body. The virus lasts longer at lower temperatures (and indefinitely below freezing) and lower levels of sunlight (less UV to damage it) and humidity. On a dry non-porous surface such as plastic or metal the virus may survive for several days. I believe studies have shown that on a dry piece of paper it remains viable for 15 minutes. If it is in mucous then it can survive much longer.

So even though it is relatively humid in BC during the winter it is still cold and we get little sunlight.

[pinhead]

Originally Posted by wickedfrags.com

Is 43 deaths significant given the number of "young people" in the US? How many young people died in the US during the same time period to give us some perspective? Also - the people who died from the curent strain have generally had underlying health issues and were often immuno-compromized prior to aquiring the flu. Asthma, diabetes, obesity, and various and other upper and lower repiratory tract concerns are common among those who died.

Not going to plow through the weekly updates from the Centre for Disease control for the statistics for the period of the 43 deaths, but I did find the information in the August 8th report

"8 of the 36 children who died of swine flu were aged 5 years and over and had no reported high risk conditions. Although two of these children were reported as obese, no data was given on their height and weight."

So for the time period in that report roughly 20% of the deaths in children were in healthy individuals.

I am not sure how many other deaths of children occured during that time period but if the vaccine were available at that time at these deaths were preventable.

If I was a parent of a child who died because of my decision not to have them or myself vaccinated, I would carry that guilt for the rest of my life.

André Picard, the health reporter for the Globe and Mail emphasizes this point:

"I am not getting the vaccine for myself, I am getting it for my grandmother"

[Ron99]

Originally Posted by pinhead

What are the known and occuring side effects and where are you getting your information - the media?

Or second hand information from other people,


Or Youtube?

(An explanation of the woman's symptoms http://www.examiner.com/x-13791-Balt...ll-in-her-head)



My information comes from the scientist's research. This information is found in peer-reviewed scientific journals or summarized for the layman magazines such as New Scientist. http://www.newscientist.com/article/...ef=online-news

Doing research from these sources will lead you to the following facts:

This strain of flu isn't always mild

It can be fatal - particularly in young people (43 deaths of children in the US in the first 2 weeks of October)

Even if you have a mild reaction to the flu virus, you could be the cause of a serious ilness in your children, other family member, co-worker or anyone else you come in contact with

Although the virus can be breathed in as an aerosol droplet, in can survive upto 48 hours on non-porous surfaces and then transfered to your eyes, nose or mouth.

The vaccine is safe (the canadian vaccine, unlike the US is a dead virus). The misinformation about flu vaccine side effects come from the 1976 US swine flu vaccinations where out of 48 million vaccinations, roughly 500 people developed Guillain-Barré syndrome and 25 died. This rate is roughly 10 cases of Guillain-Barré Syndrome for every 1 million vaccinations. Surprisingly, Guillain-Barré is found at a rate of 40-70 for every 1 million non-vaccinated flu sufferers and in the general population from other sources at 10 - 20 cases for every million people. Your chances if you were vaccinated in 1976 of getting Guillain-Barré were lower than if you caught the flu and the same as getting it from other sources.

Medical technology and vaccines have improved in 23 years - these side effects were from the 1976 vaccine.

One of these advancements is the addition of adjuvants made of fish oil, water and Vitamin E which are added to improve the body's immune response.

In Canada, the vaccine is free.

So the vaccine is: safe, cheap and will protect me or my family from from a possibly fatal disease. I guess I don't have tell you I am getting the vaccine.

I can provide references so you can base your decision on verifiable facts rather than rumors and information from almost 30 years ago.

+1000. This is the best response to this thread yet. I have been trying to decide if and how to respond here. I really can't believe the level of misinformation and paranoia out there. Do people honestly believe this is some sort of government conspiracy (amongst many world governments coordinating it) or conspiracy by the vaccine companies to make money at our expense?

I think we also need to look beyond the fact that H1N1 is a serious health threat to a small subset of the population and also realize that the economic and social threats of a major flu epidemic/pandemic are potentially also very severe, especially coming as the world tries to recover from the economic meltdown.

Imagine millions of people sick and unable to work. The garbage can't be collected, mail doesn't get delivered, transit systems have difficulty running, grocery stores have difficulty receiving shipments of food etc. etc. Now imagine if recalcitrant health care workers do not get vaccinated and start becoming sick. What happens if the health care system itself is impaired during such an epidemic? Sure that's a worse case scenario but it is one that is worth considering as a very real possibility.

Personally I think it is irresponsible to not get vaccinated when we face a global pandemic. Doubly so if you are a health care or emergency service worker. Imagine if huge numbers of people were paranoid about the smallpox vaccine and didn't get their shot?

Of course this is my opinion and I suppose you are entitled to your wrong opinion