Aquariums and GFCI

[Binare]

Originally Posted by Delphinus

I'm not sure I follow you on that last paragraph, sorry. Is that about arc faults still? Or the nuisance tripping? But nothing else in my house is plugged into the circuits I run my tanks off - they are solely for the tanks and associated paraphernalia..

So how come my GFCI tripped on the static discharge when nothing was on? (I touched the reflector which was grounded, there was a zot, and the GFCI tripped.) There wouldn't have been an imbalance between hot and neutral in that case?? Sorry I'm just trying to understand why it happened.

Oh, one more question .. what does "ID" stand for? I know you're referring to the neutral wire in this case but I've never heard it referred to as ID before, just curious what it stands for?

I was speaking of nuisance tripping in the last paragraph... I'm on a cellphone, hard to keep track of what saying on a tiny screen

The rest well... There's a reason electrician have to go to school a quick run down though:

Referring to that wire as the neutral is INCORRECT even though everybody and their dog does, in a 2 wire system it is the identified conductor, it carries full current. In a 3 wire system its called the identified neutral, it carries the difference of current. Between the two hot conductors. Ie. Your stove is a 3 wire system... Technically called 3 wire edison. Now this is gonna get your goat, what you call the ground is actually just a bond, bonds all metal and equipment, boxes etc together. The id and the neutral are considered the grounded conductors. Inside your panel the neutral (is the neutral in the panel) is jumpered to the metal case... This jumper is the Common Grounding Conductor (if I remember correctly) then goes to earth... Or "ground".

A ground fault interrupt does exactly as its name implies... A fault involving the grounded conductor (identified conductor).

Static can cause tripping, so can inductive loads (motors) static is very high voltage... Even as high as 25,000 volts and very very little current, if that small amount of current introduced is high enough to trip it, it will. Remember kids, volts don't kill, current does. A gfci might trip out at 5mA, it might only take 10mA to kill you. A GFCI does not protect you from shock, it shuts the circuit fast enough that hopefully it doesn't injure you seriously, where as the circuit breaker in your panel doesn't care, its looking for the amps its rated for, you could electricy running through you all day long, as long as the total draw aint reaching what that breakers rated for. Simply won't happen with a GFCI, or atleast shouldnt

[Gizmo]

I'll just quip in with this: while yes the gfi can protect you, it can also be a danger to your inhabitants. By that I mean, say you went on a holiday. And you had all your gear plugged into this trustful device, and pop it has a nuceince trip. Pumps are down heaters are down and your tank is toast. I say run your lighting and non mission critical systems on a gfi but keep at a min one powerhead and a heater off that gfi

[mark]

Originally Posted by Gizmo

I'll just quip in with this: while yes the gfi can protect you, it can also be a danger to your inhabitants. By that I mean, say you went on a holiday. And you had all your gear plugged into this trustful device, and pop it has a nuceince trip. Pumps are down heaters are down and your tank is toast. I say run your lighting and non mission critical systems on a gfi but keep at a min one powerhead and a heater off that gfi

I've split my system between 2 GFI breakers and a GFI outlet for that reason.

[Binare]

Originally Posted by Gizmo

I'll just quip in with this: while yes the gfi can protect you, it can also be a danger to your inhabitants. By that I mean, say you went on a holiday. And you had all your gear plugged into this trustful device, and pop it has a nuceince trip. Pumps are down heaters are down and your tank is toast. I say run your lighting and non mission critical systems on a gfi but keep at a min one powerhead and a heater off that gfi

Not to be argumentative, but I personally value my life and that of my 3 year olds more then my coral. My tank is pretty important to me, but so is mine and my families. Another thing to check for is your home owners insurance. If a fire is caused by your tank and its not on a GFCI protected circuit or outlet I bet they would take that 'out' without losin any sleep over it. Having 1 thing protected and another not protected defeats the purpose.

IMO any current that could hurt me, could hurt any fish or coral just as easily. GFCI really is a no brainer.

[Toxik]

Having a GFCI is something that has never even occured to me and something I probably never would have thought nessesary. Iv'e had my tank running for 5 years and thankfully never been shocked. I'll be picking some GFCI's up very soon.
Thanks guys

[banditpowdercoat]

You know, I don't run a GFCI, because of the fact that they will trip and then you loose power to essentials. I am an electrician too. I am confidant enough in my wiring to know that everything is OK. I did have a leaky float. Shocked me once. But I've been shocked before, no big deal LOL

[mark]

Originally Posted by banditpowdercoat

You know, I don't run a GFCI, because of the fact that they will trip and then you loose power to essentials. I am an electrician too. I am confidant enough in my wiring to know that everything is OK. I did have a leaky float. Shocked me once. But I've been shocked before, no big deal LOL

As confidant as you are with you're wiring, you don't control the build of the equipment in your tank nor what may happen to it over the years. And thought I never heard on the news fish tank owner electrocuted, shocks are a big deal and do kill.

[JTaylor420]

ok i've heard debates on gfci's for quite some time now. Will I ever use one on my setup? the answer quite simply put is no. Does anyone know the difference between electric shock and electrocution? shock is a shock you'll live, Electrocution = death i see people quite frequently throw these terms around with no idea of what they actually mean. Ok first off i am an electrician and do u know what the number 1 problem i run into when dealing specifically with gfci's is? you got it probably from reading earlier posts, nuisance tripping. Are you guys aware you can grab a hot conductor of any voltage and have that voltage flow through you with absolutely no ill effect? if there is no path to ground through you then nothing will happen, i've done it so don't tell me i don't know what i'm talking about. For me personally i'm not scared of electricity i know that it simply will take the shortest path to ground and if it's not me great who cares. I do however on the other hand care very much so if i go out lets say at 6:45 am in the morning for work and boom 7 am nuisance trip when something kicks on. Guess what 5-6 at night when i come home i'll be some upset if everything in my tank is dead corals, fish everything 2000$+ wasted because some infernal device shut off for no reason.



Ok i'm not trying to preach my knowledge on anyone that's got it stuck in there head that gfci's are great, they are but not for fish tanks. If your concerned with with electric shock then cool, ground your tank i'd rather get a grounding probe in my tank that will short out the circuit if there is actually a serious problem and if livestock is lost that way well hey $hit happens. But as far as losing my tank over something that in all honestly will probably never happen i'd probably get out of the hobby. I'm not trying to start a heated debate here but honestly when was the last time a gfi has actually tripped to save your life? ever? i didn't think so.

[banditpowdercoat]

Originally Posted by mark

As confidant as you are with you're wiring, you don't control the build of the equipment in your tank nor what may happen to it over the years. And thought I never heard on the news fish tank owner electrocuted, shocks are a big deal and do kill.

I may not control the build, But I monitor the condition's, and inspect. But hey, like stated, I'ts a personal choice.