cleaner wrasse

[justinl]

these walls of text are killing me to write. I hope you're actually reading the damned things.

my2rotties, chill. I don't know where you got the impression that I'm bashing you from... I mean my statements to be general, not targeted. That said, you're still ignoring the fact that wild stocks (which FAR outnumber the fish in your tank) are now deprived of the same service. How is it not cruel to hamstring an important ecosystem function, further restricting the hobby's only resource of ALL fish? How is that not cruel to any reefer in our hobby? How is that not cruel to future hobbyists who would like to join? Until someone comes up with a decent rebuttal to that, I'm not even going to think about changing my mind regarding this species.

I know this will sound abrasive, but to think that fish in tanks are more important than wild fish is incredibly arrogant. I can't think of a more suitable word than that. naive is a close second though.

as long as people buy a fish, they supply the demand for it. As long as there's a demand, collectors will collect it; so in the end, it's the reefers who are responsible for what is collected. This topic has been beat to death already. This hobby is selfish by nature, I do agree, but it does not have to be destructive as well. Buying second hand/aquacultured is great, I fully encourage that practice.

as for their being essential to a tank with fish, look at how many successful tanks don't have cleaner wrasses in them and say that again.

edit: when I say "you" in my posts, I don't mean you. I mean yooooouuuuuu in the general sense. I had hoped that would have been assumed. Like I said, I'm not here to bash anyone; I'm not Jesus (believe it or not ), I have no right to pass judgement

[fishoholic]

justinl you make very valid points and obviously you are passionate about the fish in the wild. I understand you're concern about people demanding cleaner wrasses and eventually them starting to become extinct. Just so you know I hope that doesn't happen and if (to you it's probably more of a when but to me it's an if) cleaner wrasse's are put on a list saying they are becoming endangered I will not buy one. I hope that they are able to reproduce effectively in the wild so that day will never happen, and even better, I hope that some day they will be captively bred.

When aquarists say things like "my fish are more important than wild stocks", I'm not saying my fish are more important (after all they came from the wild) I'm just saying that to me they are as important, after all I didn't know them when they were in the wild, but only came to know them after I brought them home. This caused me to have an emotional connection to my fish. If one of the fish in my tank dies I will be sad. If a fish in the wild dies I probably wont even be aware of when it happened even though I know fish die in the wild every day.

For example: if a grandparent dies in another part of the world, sure it's sad, but I didn't know the person and I probably wont grieve over them. However if my grandparent was to die I would grieve for a long time. To me life is all about personal and emotional connections. I have that with my fish I don't have it with the fish in the wild, maybe you do, I'm not sure but it seems like it. Not saying my opinion is right or wrong but for me it's just keeping it real and being honest.

I'm sure I'm probably frustrating you justinl (and probably some others as well) and I apologize for that, it wasn't my intent, but I like playing Devils advocate every now and then and I do enjoy a good debate. So again justinl,

Anyway the original point of this thread was:

are these fish as hard to keep as people say....im thinking of getting one since my peppermint or coral banded shrimp keep killing my cleaner shrimp i put in so thinking of another route of fish cleaning...thanks

My short answer would have to be: No they are not as hard to keep as some people say they are. Just find one that is already eating mysis and or nori (most reputable fish stores will feed the fish upon request) and as long as you find one that's eating you shouldn't have problems keeping this fish.

This was my original thread asking about other options because I was having ich issues and I knew people said cleaner wrasses are bad to buy and don't do well etc.

http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...cleaner+wrasse

I bought my cleaner wrasse July 21 2008 (the cleaner wrasse that I bought had been at the lfs for over a month and was eating mysis and was half the price of the neon gobies the store was selling) naesco told me (and I quote) "As you know, the chances that the clearner wrasse you bought lasting more than a few weeks are remote." Well needless to say he is still alive and well and fatter then ever.

This is a pic. of my cleaner from when I first bought him. He is definitely fatter now, but he still was a good size then.

[IMG][/IMG]