Supporting the LFS

[midgetwaiter]

Okay well I do work occasionally at a local retailer so I have a pretty good idea why some of this happens.

First, a store is expensive. You need staff and space and utilities and all that stuff. Retail space in Calgary for example is INSANELY EXPENSIVE. $60 / square foot is not unheard of. Basically you need to do a 70% to 80% markup to cover your overhead, minimum.

When you consider the scale most local retailers work at as well you can see where they can't really compete with larger online vendors or stores with bigger markets. When you buy in quantity you get a better deal but what is one of our local shops going to do with 80 mag 7s. It will take forever to recover that kind of capital.

Often you will see retailers push larger margins onto small items like snails. Like it or not, it's the way retial businesses work. Ask Future Shop how much they make on batteries or Safeway about laundry soap. Way back when I worked in a retail computer store I almost fell over when they told me how much they marked up printer cables. Small "sure sale" items always get padded. It's the economics of the business.

Also, it is tons more expensive to get dry goos here compared to somepalce like Vancouver. Most of this stuff comes out of Asia and Vancouver is a major pacific port. Cargo flights are also more expensive, most of the livestock you see for sale here comes though either Vancouver or Los Angeles. Manilla to Calgary direct flights are VERY rare. You see that extra shipping expense at the till.

A retialer is also aking a risk on livestock that youre are usually not. Some things ship poorly and airlines will regularly screw up your life. Those losses have to be covered.

I'm not saying that here isn't profiteering going on sometimes. Every once in a while I'll look at something and wonder too. There are a couple places that I find rather amusing most of the time but I shouldn't say where.

I just don't think it's as bad as people seem to think it is. How many LFS owners in this province drive BMWs? Nobody ever got rich owning a fish store.

[Moogled]

midgetwaiter has some good points. I feel that there's obviously much more to business than just prices.

Also, I need to mention that not everyone is as sensible when it comes to business techniques. I can think of at least 1 LFS that brings in tankbusters every second week while most of its customers want small fish only. Since alot of the big fish go unsold (not everyone has a 160 gallon tank), there is considerable loss and to compensate for that, the person has to markup fish at least 350%. (500% in some cases)

Now tell me---is that smart?

Bottom line: It sometimes boils down to how well a person can operate a business.

[Matt]

IBTL? Anyway, this is striaght economics. Retail space is expensive, QT is expensive (if they do it), losses during QT are real, must be factored in. Staff to answer your questions are expensive. Shipping can be expensive. Carrying stock and debt (really the same thing) is expensive. All of these costs are also borne by the coastal companies.

My family owned a FW LFS in Nova Scotia from '76 to '85. We purchased in bulk from the US, arranged "group orders" from drop shippers with other stores -- did everything we could to keep our costs low. We got grief from the 'local' suppliers (ironically the shame jive the LFS give us now) about killing their business. We somehow owed them something? We also re-wholesaled (after a small markup) our surplus stock to other LFS in the area. Our prices were the lowest in the area, and people came for miles to shop with us. We also went way out of our way to have interesting and rare fish: First Pacu, First red-tailed cat (a 15" monster), 12" oscars. Exotic African Cichlids (before they were so trendy). Arawana. Pirahhna (they were illegal, I think). Fish we couldn't sell, because nobody could afford them, but looked cool and drove trade in other spp. We earned their buisness that way. After all that, it was a good but surprisingly marginal business. It always made money, but it wasn't a money factory, by any means.

Edmonton's LFS are likely not money factories either. Thier costs most likely dictate their prices. Some managers will find ways of lowering their costs. Some companies just don't.

My opinion though, is the same as others have posted. It doesn't matter what they charge. They don't own my business. If I choose to buy in Vancouver or Calgary or only trade with others, and that causes their business to become untenable, they will adjust their model, or close. If enough people continue to support them, because they either see value, or aren't aware of their options, they will continue to survive, and we'll all continue to wonder how.

I support the LFS when necessary. Honestly, although I've only been in this hobby a bit more than a year, I've gotten -or heard- enough bad advice from the LFS to last a lifetime. I enjoy browsing, and will buy when the price is good or impulse overcomes me.

Matthew

[Invigor]

Originally Posted by Matt

My opinion though, is the same as others have posted. It doesn't matter what they charge. They don't own my business. If I choose to buy in Vancouver or Calgary or only trade with others, and that causes their business to become untenable, they will adjust their model, or close. If enough people continue to support them, because they either see value, or aren't aware of their options, they will continue to survive, and we'll all continue to wonder how.

I support the LFS when necessary. Honestly, although I've only been in this hobby a bit more than a year, I've gotten -or heard- enough bad advice from the LFS to last a lifetime. I enjoy browsing, and will buy when the price is good or impulse overcomes me.

I enjoy your post, I feel the same way.

[DanG]

It all comes down to the cost of doing business. Just because a yellow tang costs $4 for the LFS to buy, there's shipping and paperwork costs that get added in. Add to that the cost of having a suitable place to house the fish before it's sold, feeding it, possible meds, etc, etc. It goes on for ever.
I will definately support the local guy, but if he's blatantly trying to rip me off, then I won't buy anything from him.
I guess it's different because I've worked as a sales/purchasing manager for a computer store so I can take into account all the other costs associated with doing business.

[Invigor]

yea, but aren't places like J&L and ocean aquatics businesses too?

[Skimmerking]

Very well said everyone. let's look at some fish ok.
Say some one wants to buy a Leopard wrasse ok they retail for around $80 dollars well around here or more

So if a store buys one the price would be 5.60 US
and then they are chagred for shipping, duty, or what ever
taxes, and there 20% mark up and then you get your price.

now if you know the right people they will not mark up 20 % maybe 10% depending on the person too .but it will end up being the guy will mark up the most he can get away with.

THe reason is maybe he is the only store around and thinks he is the only one that can get it.. Pretty sad....

[Murminator]

Originally Posted by midgetwaiter

Often you will see retailers push larger margins onto small items like snails. Like it or not, it's the way retial businesses work. Ask Future Shop how much they make on batteries or Safeway about laundry soap. Way back when I worked in a retail computer store I almost fell over when they told me how much they marked up printer cables. Small "sure sale" items always get padded. It's the economics of the business.

So does this mean laundry soap at Sobeys in Vancouver is half the price than it is in Edmonton? or batteries at Visions?........if so GROUP ORDER