The dearth of spirited discussion

[Aquattro]

I find it's actually cheaper now. My original set of Tunze pumps cost $1000. I can move the same water now for a fraction of that. Many items haven't changed at all. Bulbs are cheaper, heaters, about the same, salt, about the same. Sure, all the new fancy gimmick toys cost more, but they aren't really needed. I'm actually surprised prices have stayed as constant, or in some cases, dropped as they have.

Only thing I see costing more are frags. Where 20 years ago I could buy a whole bucket of nice frags for 100 bucks, now I get one frag.

I think keeping reefs has also become much easier. When I started, it was a craft to get a nice SPS tank. You had to work at it. Now, it seems it's add water and stir. Takes the challenge out of it

My biggest thoughts these days are thoughts of envy when I see people posting shut down sales. Maybe another year or two for me, just to get this tank where I planned, then I'm done. Just tired of it all.

[F.H]

Originally Posted by Aquattro

most things ever wondered about are already talked to death, and can just be referenced. I don't need to ask anything, I can use Google and find someone that already asked it.

Nail in the coffin. Why start up another thread on a topic already beat to death, and wait hours for responses, when you can just google the answer. I suspect it's because reefkeeping has reached a stalemate of sorts. People have found what works, almost turned it into an ehow webpage for dummies and until any game changing technologies or revolutionary techniques show up, there's not much else to ponder.

Originally Posted by Aquattro

More and more I see a "what's in it for me" thought process. Where I have annually had reef meets/swaps at my place, less and less people came because there was nothing for them in the way of adding to their collection, or profits to be made. The idea of just gathering and chatting in person with like minded people seems to be lost. This year was the last year I'll be hosting this..

I suspect that after the xmas holidays, I probably won't even come here anymore.

As much as I have been a lurker on these forums, I've come to enjoy your posts, and as is with anything else, it might be healthy to take a small break, or vacation. But you can never truly quit.

[squibege]

Originally Posted by Delphinus

I used to frequently obsess over this hobby but lately I feel almost a bit pushed away from it, and one huge driver is the sheer cost of things compared to a decade ago. Whereas in the early days, there were lots of expensive things, there were also a lot of DIY attitudes and experimentation that made things fun. I don't seem to see a lot of that cowboy'ing anymore?

Now everytime I see a new product, first of all, there's pressure to "preorder" it before it's even hit the market; and odds are good that whatever it is, I can't afford it anyhow. Part of it is my own station in life, have kids now, other expenses other priorities etc. but my own subjective feel is that it just costs more now.

As a newbie I'm scared to attempt to DIY stuff.The fear of harming my tank is greater than my disappointment at shelling out $$. I saw a post on how to build a skimmer from an air stone and a waterbottle. I would WAY rather do that than spend a couple hundred bucks- but I don't trust being able to figure our how its working for my tank. Purchasing something a fancy company has poured R&D into just seems 'safer' even if it is way less fun.

Money is what has kept me at bay from starting up this hobby for years.

[Myka]

I've found in the last 5 years that there is so much more science behind it all that there isn't as much to debate in any given topic. There are more scientists involved, and papers you can read. There aren't any reef related scientists here or even members with associated degrees. I find all sorts of interesting topics on other forums where really qualified people can answer questions and not so much debate, but work as a group to figure things out. That's what I think is lacking at Canreef - REAL experts. The sponsors aren't as active as they used to be a few years ago either. Aside from good discussions on "new" topics, I like to read Tank Journals.

[jorjef]

Originally Posted by Zoaelite

In my opinion the lack of discussion isn't because the issues have been beat to death, rather the members have left (for a myriad of reasons, most of which have been listed).

I'm just back for the occasional sale thread and to reminisce about the old days.

Originally Posted by Delphinus

I used to frequently obsess over this hobby but lately I feel almost a bit pushed away from it, and one huge driver is the sheer cost of things.

Now everytime I see a new product, first of all, there's pressure to "preorder" it before it's even hit the market; and odds are good that whatever it is, I can't afford it anyhow.

Originally Posted by Aquattro

My biggest thoughts these days are thoughts of envy when I see people posting shut down sales. Maybe another year or two for me, just to get this tank where I planned, then I'm done. Just tired of it all.

All the above and the wholesale loss on all antagonistic posts that sometimes maaaayy have walked on the wrong side of the line but were usually meant in fun.... Most of the time but always lead to wonderful mayhem. So much fun.

Brad if you're not coming back after Chistmas I'm done....Ban me for the third and final time.

[Scythanith]

Originally Posted by Myka

There aren't any reef related scientists here or even members with associated degrees.

Speak for yourself 4 yr B.Sc. with Hon in Palaeobiology. I studied my fair share of fossilized vertebrates and invertebrates

But I know what you mean, I'm not elbow deep in the aquatic research tanks anymore.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by Scythanith

Speak for yourself 4 yr B.Sc. with Hon in Palaeobiology. I studied my fair share of fossilized vertebrates and invertebrates

But I know what you mean, I'm not elbow deep in the aquatic research tanks anymore.

I'm not sure that's directly relatable - except maybe Coelacanths.

[Madreefer]

Originally Posted by Myka

I've found in the last 5 years that there is so much more science behind it all that there isn't as much to debate in any given topic. There are more scientists involved, and papers you can read. There aren't any reef related scientists here or even members with associated degrees. I find all sorts of interesting topics on other forums where really qualified people can answer questions and not so much debate, but work as a group to figure things out. That's what I think is lacking at Canreef - REAL experts. The sponsors aren't as active as they used to be a few years ago either. Aside from good discussions on "new" topics, I like to read Tank Journals.

Myself I would rather not read nor hear from scientists. They're write ups are totally boring and put me to sleep. I'd much rather hear from a hobbyist, it's easier and way more interesting as they speak in layman's terms. I've read so many posts from the cut copy and paste scientists and they are proven wrong so many times. People take this hobby way too far and it's really not as difficult as one thinks. It scares people away constantly hearing that scientific talk. That and the cost of the hobby.

[SeaHorse_Fanatic]

Well locally, almost all the old-timer fellow reefers I knew in the early 2000s have since quit, completely downsized or are in a holding pattern (ie. not changing anything & no longer participating much). For me, not having my buddies in this hobby anymore is a real bummer. I understand though because life happens. When things change, like having kids or kids growing old and more involved in extracurricular activities, its hard to stay focused and devote a lot of time to reefing. Also, sometimes work is just so busy that there's little time to do more than take a quick look at the "New Posts" items and then back to work.

[Aquattro]

Originally Posted by jorjef

Brad if you're not coming back after Chistmas I'm done....Ban me for the third and final time.

Maybe for Xmas, ok? lol