My New 72"x20"x20" Tank Build

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Untamed, thanks for all the advice! I just read it quickly but I will read it again slower later on. Your right about the gate valve...I was ****ed when I ordered some of my plumbing online and it arrived much different than what I expected! The main thing was those gate valves, that are not actually gate valves! Im going to have to find a proper gate valve tomorrow.

Thanks again for the advice and I will use the herbie method for the connection between the refugium and sump. Thanks for the heads up on that. That should also keep any bubbles from getting into the sump from the refugium.

I checked JL and ocean Aquatics but neither have 2" Gate Valves. I know Home Depot and Rona do not either. Anyone know where I can get one? It has to be easy to get to though because I have no car right now. Im in Vancouver.

[Canuckgod420]

hey if your still looking for large gate valves check out the plumbing supply stores...ie hillcrest plumbing on kingsway.....or B.A. Robinson.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Yeah thanks, I will call Hillcrest tomorrow. I am still looking. I need to get this gate valve by Thursday if possible.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Untamed, for the refugium to sump "herbie", do you think a ball valve would be accurate enough? I agree that for the overflow drain, I need a proper Gate Valve but I was thinking that for the reugium one, a ball valve would do...maybe not though.

[untamed]

re: Ball valve directing flow to refugium...

I'm thinking that a ball valve will work fine for that application. It will be a bit crude to adjust the flow into the refugium, but once you get it set you'll be fine if you just leave it alone. You'll then be able to fine tune the water exiting the refugium with a gate valve.

As the Herbies don't allow any air into the lines, you can always have the pipes exit silently below water line. That also avoids splashing and bubbling which results in less salt creep everywhere.

[mark]

Can't say nothing about the Herbie as but to listen to Untamed as he's experienced with running one.

For the return you should be able to reduce pipe diameter one size to make a little more manageable after the top Tee, build a manifold (such as like here) to even out flow and with multiple outlet not have a great loss.
RC calculator might be a guide.

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by mark

Can't say nothing about the Herbie as but to listen to Untamed as he's experienced with running one.

For the return you should be able to reduce pipe diameter one size to make a little more manageable after the top Tee, build a manifold (such as like here) to even out flow and with multiple outlet not have a great loss.
RC calculator might be a guide.

Do yo mean for the closed loop return or sump return? I think your talking about the closed loop right?

If you are, you say it should be fine to reduce down to a 1.5" PVC after the first "T"? That may help out a lot actually. In a way...Its kind of a weird situation and heres why...

The closed loop pump has a 1.5" outlet. The bulkhead that the return is going through is 2". I figured this is good because I always hear its good to go up a size anyways. So like I said, I figured it would work well if I went from 1.5" at the outlet to 2" right away and then through the bulkhead and used a 2" manifold. As I said though, the 2" manifold is a bit tricky to manage. So your idea to reduce down to 1.5" seems good. Maybe I should just use to reducers right around the bulkhead? So basically the pump goes to the bulkhead at 1.5" and goes through at 2" and then goes back to 1.5". Seems kind of weird but I can't change the 2" bulkhead at this point. Any thoughts???

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by untamed

re: Ball valve directing flow to refugium...

I'm thinking that a ball valve will work fine for that application. It will be a bit crude to adjust the flow into the refugium, but once you get it set you'll be fine if you just leave it alone. You'll then be able to fine tune the water exiting the refugium with a gate valve.

As the Herbies don't allow any air into the lines, you can always have the pipes exit silently below water line. That also avoids splashing and bubbling which results in less salt creep everywhere.

Yeah I love the "herbie" style for that exact reason, you can keep bubbles out of the system easily. Well if I can find some gate valves for a decent price, I may do all gate valves instead of the ball valve for the refugium but Im getting to the point where I cannot spend too much more on this tank. All the little trips to Home Depot or Canadian Tire for something small have added up and I just looked at the bills...almost $500 AFTER I thought I had everything already! Anyways, I can't pay $40 for 1.5" gate valves and $50 for 2" which is what I have seen them selling for online so far. Hopefully I can find some cheaper locally.

[banditpowdercoat]

Originally Posted by mark

Can't say nothing about the Herbie as but to listen to Untamed as he's experienced with running one.

For the return you should be able to reduce pipe diameter one size to make a little more manageable after the top Tee, build a manifold (such as like here) to even out flow and with multiple outlet not have a great loss.
RC calculator might be a guide.

Ya, you can reduce the loop pipe diam from what your vertical lift pipe diam is after a T. Just like in drains, you cna go down 1 pipe size when using 2 pipes. So, 2". you can go to 1.75 or 1.5 on a closed loop manifold. Acctually, you can reduce the size after every T in the manifold. As long as they are even on each side of the main inlet T. Remember, your loosing GPH flow in the manifold after every tank outlet, so no need for the whole manifold to be the same size as the inlet. There will be a point in the manifold where the water will acctually be still, where water form the left and rigth sides meet, and basically stop. I did mine with a outlet in the center, where I belive the water will meet, so hopefully to not get stagnent section of the manifold. Weather it worked or not, that remains to be seen

Also, if your pump has a 1.5" outlet, you may be better off to keep the rise pipe form sump to tank that size. Increasing the vertical pipe to larger will add more water in the vertical colum, thus more weight. More weight the pump has to lift, the more head pressure the pump will see, the less GPH it will flow. On Horizontal, and bends, larger is better, but not uphill. Just ask any Firefighter. I'd much rather haul the 1.5" hose up 3 storys than the 2.5"

Just changing the pipe pump outlet pipe to 2" for the bulkhead will be fine, and I think, would be the best bet

[GreenSpottedPuffer]

Originally Posted by banditpowdercoat

Ya, you can reduce the loop pipe diam from what your vertical lift pipe diam is after a T. Just like in drains, you cna go down 1 pipe size when using 2 pipes. So, 2". you can go to 1.75 or 1.5 on a closed loop manifold. Acctually, you can reduce the size after every T in the manifold. As long as they are even on each side of the main inlet T. Remember, your loosing GPH flow in the manifold after every tank outlet, so no need for the whole manifold to be the same size as the inlet. There will be a point in the manifold where the water will acctually be still, where water form the left and rigth sides meet, and basically stop. I did mine with a outlet in the center, where I belive the water will meet, so hopefully to not get stagnent section of the manifold. Weather it worked or not, that remains to be seen

Also, if your pump has a 1.5" outlet, you may be better off to keep the rise pipe form sump to tank that size. Increasing the vertical pipe to larger will add more water in the vertical colum, thus more weight. More weight the pump has to lift, the more head pressure the pump will see, the less GPH it will flow. On Horizontal, and bends, larger is better, but not uphill. Just ask any Firefighter. I'd much rather haul the 1.5" hose up 3 storys than the 2.5"

Just changing the pipe pump outlet pipe to 2" for the bulkhead will be fine, and I think, would be the best bet

Yeah I do understand the concept of increasing adding weight and pressure but I hear a lot of times that these pumps preform much better when increased by 1/2". The main issue here is that I HAVE to increase to 2" no matter what to go through the bulkhead. I have no choice there. Its just a matter of when. I was going to increase to 2" right away near the outlet and keep the manifold at 2" (still may). Otherwise, I think I will increase to 2" right away and then after the top "t", reduce down to 1.5".

I do understand what you are saying but there was also a specific reason people increase the pipe size on these pumps I just forget why

I know for sure that Mag pumps should always be plumbed with a size bigger pipe. The manufacturer states that themselves.