Marked up prices . . .

[BCOrchidGuy]

The sad truth is that many places do sell stuff at an elevated then reduced price on boxing day. I have seen this at many many places. The only TRUE deal will always be on clearance or door crasher items, IE of all places Big Al's has a 120H for $199, I believe it's a 5 foot long tank. They also have 10 gallon tanks for $7.99 maybe $6.99 but I think it's $7.99. Yes it's a perfecto but if anyone wants a good deal on a tank to make into a sump or refugium for their nano it's a good deal. I think it's a damn steal on the 120 but most of the other stuff there is priced way to high.
Anyone here who knows me knows where I prefer to shop and to avoid a bunch of flames about the one store I'll just say I believe I always get the best deal there on my stuff. I can't afford Tunze powerheads, I still go to J&L's from time to time and I've never been dissapointed by their prices and only had one bad experience with their live stock and if I had followed MY OWN advice and the advice of many others here and used a QT tank my bad experience would have been just a bit of a bummer rather than a horror, that was my fault not theirs and I know it.
I don't agree with the BS of bumping up prices so the sale looks better, yes the dollar moves up and down but it does that daily so if that is their only reason for adjusting prices they should be adjusting them daily. ALSO!!!! if they purchase something on Dec 15, 2005 and the dollar is good and strong then on Dec 20 the item that came in on the Dec 15th purchase should be priced accordingly. Doing the pricing this way would be a logistical nightmare
with prices on some items being a few percentage points higher than identical items from the same vendor. Customers would be demanding prices be adjusted accordingly so it would end up being a waste of time anyway.
I myself would go to the store and argue for the discount advertised, according to their pre boxing day price. If I got satisfaction great, if I didn't I would be clear with them that I am not pleased.
All in all J&L is one of the best stores around, my own personal belief is that they should have stayed in the store on Austin, up by Blue Mtn. I think they had the world by the tail there, either that or they should have stayed mail order out of the basement. The new store must be a burden on them, about 2 years ago I went in and they all looked exausted, completely and utterly exausted. It's my understanding that they sold the store or part of it and then it was purchased back or something, I really do wish them the best of luck. The origonal owners were very good people, very easy to talk to and when there was something I said taken out of context a quick visit to the store and a talk and they were very very understanding. I even helped one of them get started in orchids with a gift of an orchid and a book.
We need LFS stores like this to help keep our market competitive, I think we are spoiled in a lot of ways, our prices are low because the stores are trying to compete on price point. Store A tries to compete with store B's prices on dry goods and equipent, maybe store A has a better selection of livestock though but they won't stay in business if that's all they sell or if they try to keep their customer base happy with just good livestock but sell everything at suggested retail price. Lets not forget they are just a fish store, some of the other stores they compete against sell dog food, cat food, birds, cages etc, etc. Supporting a store like J&L helps us have the prices we do, I know for a fact that the stores in Seattle are all priced way above what we would pay for livestock, the fish we pay $39 for here would go for close to $100 there just because they wont compete the way our stores do.
Anyway, I've been gone for just over two years, the board has changed, lots of new names, my life has seen some huge changes, I'll find some time later to catch up with everyone, in the mean time, best of the season, and a Happy New year to everyone.

Doug

[j83]

Originally Posted by fakename

Reeferaddict:

I don't think the argument here is about whether or not J&L has good prices (they do), or if they are allowed to sell their products for what they want to (they are). The real issue is that a lot of people on the board, many good customers of J&L, feel that the store was dishonest.

Aaron

I think Aaron says it best here. I will continue to support J&L, their prices are great and so is there service it just ****ed me off with what they did on boxing day. Just be honest and call it as it is. If your only gonna take 5% off your regular prices then call that.

[dunl]

And that's really just it. Of course they have great prices, and everyone here will agree with that.

But marking it up just to make your discount look better is dishonest. It's not as much of a deal as they are trying to advertise it as.

Plus yes, it's illegal to raise prices and mislead customers(but at no point in time am I making a claim that J&L didn't follow proper law - I'm not a lawyer, and don't know all the fine print on these things):

The Forzani Group

Date: 2004-07-06
Event: Consent Agreement
Court: Competition Tribunal
Court File Number: CT-2004-010
Parties: The Forzani Group Ltd.
Provisions: 74.01(2) and (3) of the Competition Act - Ordinary Price: suppliers generally and supplier's own

Summary:On July 6, 2004, the Commissioner of Competition and The Forzani Group Ltd. filed a consent agreement with the Competition Tribunal addressing the Commissioner's concerns under the Ordinary Price provisions of the Competition Act.

The agreement stemmed from a Competition Bureau investigation regarding concerns that The Forzani Group Ltd. had overstated the regular selling prices of certain products at its Sport Chek and Sport Mart stores.

The Act requires that one of the two following tests are met when setting a regular selling price:

either a substantial volume of the product was sold at that price or a higher price within a reasonable period of time before or after the making of the representation (volume test); or

the product was offered for sale, in good faith, at that price or a higher price for a substantial period of time recently before or immediately after the making of the representation (time test).
Under the terms of the agreement, The Forzani Group Ltd., which operates 217 corporate stores under the banners of Sport Chek, Sport Mart and Coast Mountain Sports and 174 franchise stores under the banners of Sports Experts, Intersport, RnR, Atmosphere, Econosports and Tech Shop, has agreed to:

ensure that all of its future savings claims and regular selling price representations comply with the misleading advertising provisions of the Act;

implement a corporate compliance program designed to ensure compliance with the Act;

publish corrective notices in newspapers across Canada, in Sport Chek and Sport Mart flyers, on its corporate Web sites and its retail stores across Canada; and

pay an administrative monetary penalty in the amount of $1,200,000, along with the Bureau's costs for its investigation in the amount of $500,000.
The agreement will remain in force for 10 years.

http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/i...emid=1182&lg=e

So yeah, it's not a legal thing in Canada.

[reeferaddict]

OK... I actually spoke to someone at J&L about this today as I was looking into my own item - Calcium monitor. Around summertime they were $319... then $309... then finally $293... In the summer, J&L, (as stated in the newsletter), discounted ACROSS the BOARD 5% to reflect the recent strength in the Canadian dollar. This discount isn't remarked, (as it is in the store), rather just reflected on the final price we pay as a percentage of the RETAIL price. Problem is we don't see that online... it is just given to us. So 95% of $309 is $293... the boxing day sale is also based on the $309 as well... call it what you will, maybe poor communication or what have you... but it is legal... and taken in the light it was explained to me about how their POS system works, I perfectly understand it and have no problem with the ethics. They are very frustrated right now, and I pity their position as this has obviously been a big headache to them... one option is to leave the prices at the full retail rate and just have sale discounts from those prices, but we would be giving up that US dollar 5% that we now get to enjoy every day...

There was no frilly announcement for the 5% originally given, and did any of us complain? Didn't think so... And kudos to them for actually taking the time to call me and settle this. I can only imagine how busy they must be right now...

[RonPeter]

The thing I find funny was the items I marked the prices down before the sale were at one price, sale comes on and the retail price is higher and now I just checked their website again and all my items are back down to the price they were on Dec 25 when I made my list...that excuse doesn't make sense to me BUT sometimes I am slow to figure things out. I will still deal with them as they have excellent prices but it just doesn't smell right...to me anyways.

[Willow]

woo good thing my bulbs were sold out and i got a rain check. now i will get a better price on them.

[dunl]

Free bump for a good discussion.

[Richy44]

Bumper again!

[EmilyB]

Hey why is it when other LFS are talked about on Canreef the thread is pulled, but when it's J&L fire away. Just a comment not a criticism

Now isn't that the truth.

[midgetwaiter]

2 things strike me as interesting about this.

Some of us are again willing to jump all over somebody before finding out the facts. Seems to me like J&L are very willing to discuss this, it was in the bloody newsletter even. They certainly went out of their way to talk to reeferadict about it. You can debate the merits of their explanation, given my few years experience in a similar operation it seems to make some sense. At least we get some of that discussion but the usual pot stirrers (Wayne, Darcy) have to stick their noses in and turn it into a big production.

The other thing, and this is pretty disappointing, is the way people are willing to give them a pass on something like this if it saves a buck. If they were really behaving this way (I don't think that they are) would so many of us really shrug it off and buy from them anyway just to save $50 the next time? I don't know about the rest of you but if I feel somebody is treating me badly I'm not going to give them a pass just because it saves me a little money. Pretty sad that they could get away with anything just because they're cheaper.