Where dose it come from?

[reefwars]

Originally Posted by lorenz0

damn kien, you have now offset the worlds axis causing it to tilt a bit... shame on you lol

gobytrons answer=



lorenzos answer=












sooooo guys just and then we can all

[gobytron]

Originally Posted by kien

Actually I smashed up some boulders and moved them around my backyard over the weekend and changed the earths geology. Sorry I don't write books.

I think you mean you changed your backyards geology.
Unless you're a tectonic plate, you likely didnt alter the earths geology at all.

but hey, nothing wrong a few delusions of grandeur...

[gobytron]

Originally Posted by lorenz0

You just answered yourself. One small change could have been made, but i'm sure nothing would have happened because it would have effected the economy. Wait did I just bring that up... yes. If something is a negative effect on some sort of profit they won't do it.

Btw I haven't listed reasons due to the fact that sounding like a broken record is not me. You know them, people preach about them, but yet no one gives a damn. Its because we depend on these things so much that giving them up is out of the question. EG. cars with one driver (how about driving trucks when you don't need to)

If you think I answered myself, you don get the question.
I dont feel that you or I choosing to buy only captive bred organisms will make any relative difference when the governements and the corporations they pander to take no accountability for themselves.

Even the "green revolution" you hear about is just a cash grab and a way to sell more product for more money.

Same as, IMO, charging more for captive bred aquaria.
It sounds nice on the surface, but you've still got to contend with the lumber mills of the world.

And there's alot more lumber millsout there than reef hobbyists...conscientious or otherwise.

[kien]

Last I checked my backyard was a part of the earth. I could be wrong though and may need to have this independently verified. Stay tuned..

[lorenz0]

^^^^
LOL

I stayed sober this weekend. My chemistry is off balanced with no traces of C2H5OH

Gobytron, I'm done talking to you. I'm putting my filter on

[gobytron]

Originally Posted by kien

Last I checked my backyard was a part of the earth. I could be wrong though and may need to have this independently verified. Stay tuned..

What an excellent point.
spoken like a true layman.

Thank you for the science lesson Bill Nye.

With such a succinct point of view, you must have a newsletter...
how can I subscribe?

Let me know if you ever do verify your facts.
something tells me it's a rare occurence over there.

[reefwars]

Originally Posted by lorenz0

my tank and i share hangovers on sunday due to excessive carbon dosing

just noticed this love it lol

[kien]

Originally Posted by gobytron

What an excellent point.

Thanks!

[CandyCane]

The veiw of "one person can't make a difference" really baffles me. Think of it like recycling. If one person never recycled anything their whole life you'd prob make a pile of garbage at least 50 feet tall! Consider recycleing now and that pile becomes way way smaller! If one person starts promoting in a lfs near them the selling of only farm bread marine creatures I think they could easily make a difference. If you hear a coral is "rare" maybe you shouldnt buy it, or cleaner wrasses, without them natural ocean reefs can't survive and they do horrible in our tanks anyways. Every little thing helps

[intarsiabox]

Originally Posted by CandyCane

If one person starts promoting in a lfs near them the selling of only farm bread marine creatures I think they could easily make a difference. If you hear a coral is "rare" maybe you shouldnt buy it, or cleaner wrasses, without them natural ocean reefs can't survive and they do horrible in our tanks anyways. Every little thing helps

You can walk into just about any salt water fish store and buy all the frags and captive bred clownfish you want right now. So stores are already doing something to "make a difference". It's not that stores don't want to sell lots of captive bred fish (cheaper if done on a large scale)its that they can't get them to breed in captivity(people are working on this daily). Rare fish and corals aren't usually rare because there's none to be found in the ocean, it's because they are usually deep water species so most of the collectors who only have access to snorkels and hold their breathe can't reach them. You need a trained deep water scuba diver to collect them and that won't be cheap so there is little market demand, hence rare. Most people on this board buy/trade/sell among each other so every time that happens people are doing something to save a reef. If you own a salt water fish tank then you are directly responsible for reef destruction. Even if you are sure none of your livestock or rock came from the ocean you have still put money into and supported the industry responsible. If people are actually serious about supporting the reefs they would sell every fish related item they had and get out of the hobby forever. Easy to say, hard to do. No different than driving a car instead of an SUV, you are still supporting the oil companies, haven't had to make any personal sacrifice but get to feel better of yourself and less of others. I guess the question is how big of a commitment is one willing to make to save a reef, a little one, a large one, total? I have captive bred fish and coral frags from others, does that make me more enviromentally friendly than other reef keepers? I think not.