Which T5 should I get

[i have crabs]

Originally Posted by Myka

With your tank being 21" deep you will be limited in what you can keep in your tank if you choose to go with T5s to a certain extent. Once you get past about 14-16" T5s don't compare to metal halide for intensity. You will be able to keep all softies, probably all LPS, and some SPS. If you want to keep certain types of clams, anemones, and SPS corals then metal halide would be a better choice. If you're ok with a few limitations, then the Tek fixture you chose should do quite well for you.

not completly true. going with a 4 bulb t5 id probably agree, 6-8 bulb fixtures have really good par. i have a par meter and have tested lots of lights and my 8 bulb tek fixture puts out better power at 27"down that most 250w halides ive tested by quite alot.

since your tank is 36" and only 21" high id say the a 6 bulb in either the tek or compact usa would allow you to keep almost anything you want, some sps probably would need to be in the upper 12" but most would be fine id think. a 4 bulb might not cut it for sps but lps and softies would be no problem.


im quite shure the compact usa lights with 4 and 6 bulbs have individual reflectors while the 8 bulb and the glo lights have 1 large relfector. you definatly want individual reflectors, imo the glo lights are junk as far as power goes thier cheep so people buy them and will defend them to the grave. i didnt even keep the 2 bulb glo light i bought on my qt tank made me crazy everytime id look at the tank
the 8 bulb compact usa with 1 reflector tested about 40% less power than my tek light with the same bulbs just for a comparison on how much reflectors matter

[mike31154]

Originally Posted by i have crabs

not completly true. going with a 4 bulb t5 id probably agree, 6-8 bulb fixtures have really good par. i have a par meter and have tested lots of lights and my 8 bulb tek fixture puts out better power at 27"down that most 250w halides ive tested by quite alot.

since your tank is 36" and only 21" high id say the a 6 bulb in either the tek or compact usa would allow you to keep almost anything you want, some sps probably would need to be in the upper 12" but most would be fine id think. a 4 bulb might not cut it for sps but lps and softies would be no problem.


im quite shure the compact usa lights with 4 and 6 bulbs have individual reflectors while the 8 bulb and the glo lights have 1 large relfector. you definatly want individual reflectors, imo the glo lights are junk as far as power goes thier cheep so people buy them and will defend them to the grave. i didnt even keep the 2 bulb glo light i bought on my qt tank made me crazy everytime id look at the tank
the 8 bulb compact usa with 1 reflector tested about 40% less power than my tek light with the same bulbs just for a comparison on how much reflectors matter

Yep, I'm inexperienced compared to many of the members of this board, that's why I generally offer advice only on what I've experienced so far and do my best not to regurgitate things I've read elsewhere. I have a 36" Hagen Glo T5HO fixture which I purchased when I first set up my used tank. Yes I'm cheap but it worked for me initially even if it didn't completely cover my 48" long tank. A mushroom and zoa both started growing on their own a few months after I started the tank, I did not add them, they appeared on the Live Rock on their own under the cheapo Glo. I'm currently not keeping any SPS corals, but now have a large colony of zoas and a hammer coral. I've since 'upgraded' to a 4x48" T5HO retrofit kit with individual reflectors run by two Fulham Workhorse 8 ballasts. Nothing fancy but it works for me. I still use the Glo fixture with actinics for dawn/dusk effect and am quite happy with it's performance. Did have an issue with one of the endcaps but it works fine. I would not "defend them to the grave" and I think I was quite candid in my original post in stating that the Glo fixture is "not bad". I was simply trying to provide the OP with an alternative to what he was looking at. I do not consider them as 'junk' either though. We don't all have the budget for the actively cooled high end fixtures with all the bells and whistles. Personally if I was going to go to that expense, I'd probably just fire up the used tar and coil MH goodies I have gathering dust in the basement. Not ready for SPS yet, so I'm quite content with my current set up.

[Canadian]

FWIW,

I think getting a T5 fixture without active cooling and quality individual parabolic reflectors is tantamount to using MH with flat piece of polished aluminum as a reflector. The type of lighting (T5 or MH) isn't so much important as is the quality of the reflector (and in the case of T5s of equal importance is active cooling).

If a consumer can't afford to get some of the most simple and necessary components (active cooling and good reflectors) then they would be far better served operating MH. And I'll state it again: MH is still typically the best simple option for lighting a reef tank. T5 has been proven to work superbly if appropriately implemented but doing it half-a$$ed will almost certainly lead to disappointment.

[mike31154]

Originally Posted by Canadian

FWIW,

I think getting a T5 fixture without active cooling and quality individual parabolic reflectors is tantamount to using MH with flat piece of polished aluminum as a reflector. The type of lighting (T5 or MH) isn't so much important as is the quality of the reflector (and in the case of T5s of equal importance is active cooling).

If a consumer can't afford to get some of the most simple and necessary components (active cooling and good reflectors) then they would be far better served operating MH. And I'll state it again: MH is still typically the best simple option for lighting a reef tank. T5 has been proven to work superbly if appropriately implemented but doing it half-a$$ed will almost certainly lead to disappointment.

Well, I spent all my scheckels on a VorTech pump for flow and am hoping to get another. The livestock I have is doing just fine under my half-a$$ed T5 setup so I'll just have to live with it for now.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by i have crabs

not completly true. going with a 4 bulb t5 id probably agree, 6-8 bulb fixtures have really good par. i have a par meter and have tested lots of lights and my 8 bulb tek fixture puts out better power at 27"down that most 250w halides ive tested by quite alot.

You're comparing grapes to raisins. 8 bulbs x how many watts? 54w? That is 432 w (quick math I hope that's right haha). You can't compare 432w of T5 to 250w of halide! That's not a fair comparison. PLUS, you have to use the same Kelvin bulbs in order for it to be accurate. According to Steve (Stir Crazy) actinic bulbs put out a false high PAR reading as well, so if you have actinics in your 8 bulb fixture you're not getting an accurate reading.

In order to compare T5 to MH you need to make sure all the variables are equal...this is where a lot of people fail, and come up with misleading numbers which they now think is the be all end all.

[Canadian]

Originally Posted by Myka

You're comparing grapes to raisins. 8 bulbs x how many watts? 54w? That is 432 w (quick math I hope that's right haha). You can't compare 432w of T5 to 250w of halide! That's not a fair comparison. PLUS, you have to use the same Kelvin bulbs in order for it to be accurate. According to Steve (Stir Crazy) actinic bulbs put out a false high PAR reading as well, so if you have actinics in your 8 bulb fixture you're not getting an accurate reading.

In order to compare T5 to MH you need to make sure all the variables are equal...this is where a lot of people fail, and come up with misleading numbers which they now think is the be all end all.

If you're going to calculate the T5 as if it's going on a 4 foot tank (54W) then you also need to be reasonable about the application of the MH - no one is going to try to realistically light a 4 foot tank with a single 250W MH. So consider that the above example is likely 2 x 250W MH in a real-world application (although that's purely speculation on my part as I wasn't the one making the claim - but it's certainly a reasonable consideration).

Secondly, very few people actually recommend running T5HO actinic lamps. A typical application would include lamps measured some where around 450nm but generally not pure "actinic" 420nm. And as an example even a 250W AB 10,000K on an M80 ballast has its largest peak at 420nm (actinic) so I suppose it's producing false high PAR readings?

[i have crabs]

Originally Posted by Canadian

If you're going to calculate the T5 as if it's going on a 4 foot tank (54W) then you also need to be reasonable about the application of the MH - no one is going to try to realistically light a 4 foot tank with a single 250W MH. So consider that the above example is likely 2 x 250W MH in a real-world application (although that's purely speculation on my part as I wasn't the one making the claim - but it's certainly a reasonable consideration).

Secondly, very few people actually recommend running T5HO actinic lamps. A typical application would include lamps measured some where around 450nm but generally not pure "actinic" 420nm. And as an example even a 250W AB 10,000K on an M80 ballast has its largest peak at 420nm (actinic) so I suppose it's producing false high PAR readings?

ive tested a few different setups, the 4 foot tanks i tested were under 2 250w's for comparison, the tek i have tested equall to a 400w even, the 400w was a tar ballast and not so nice reflector though, personally i hate how every t5 thread goes this way every time, im just stating facts that ive tested with my own par meter for my own knowledge, if anyone wants to listen great if not fine too my corals are doing great in a 27" deep tank with the light way higher than it needs to be so in my opinion tek lights work great, i havnt yet tested any higher end 48" t5 lights that would make a fair comparison so im still a bit skeptical on how much better the light output is on them, personally i think its mostly name and features like cooling and dimming that make the over double the price

[Myka]

Originally Posted by Canadian

If you're going to calculate the T5 as if it's going on a 4 foot tank (54W) then you also need to be reasonable about the application of the MH - no one is going to try to realistically light a 4 foot tank with a single 250W MH. So consider that the above example is likely 2 x 250W MH in a real-world application (although that's purely speculation on my part as I wasn't the one making the claim - but it's certainly a reasonable consideration).

Secondly, very few people actually recommend running T5HO actinic lamps. A typical application would include lamps measured some where around 450nm but generally not pure "actinic" 420nm. And as an example even a 250W AB 10,000K on an M80 ballast has its largest peak at 420nm (actinic) so I suppose it's producing false high PAR readings?

Actually, LOTS of people run 420 nm bulbs...but the tendency is leaning away from it, yes.

You're still not comparing fairly. A 54w T5 is more intense than a 39w T5 no matter how long it (obviously) is. Just like having a 400w MH is more intense than a 250w. This is taking the same Kelvin bulbs into consideration though...for arguments' sake here. If you want to take the coverage of the bulbs, then you have to break down that 48" T5, and cover a 24x24" area with 4x54w T5 bulbs (breaking them in half to be 24x24"). Now, compare 4x54w T5 bulbs to a 250w MH. OR you have to compare 2x250w MH to 8x54w T5 to get the same coverage per 24x24" space as typical T5 spacing is 3". Comparing 4x54w T5 to 2x250w MH is hardly a fair comparison.

OR, you could try comparing it that way, but you would have a very complicated mathematical equation to figure out how many watts per square inch and PAR over the total useful area, and you would have to determine what PAR is considered usable, and wow that would be quite a chore.

Plus...it REALLY depends on what T5 and MH bulbs you choose, but even moreso for MH. You can get more PAR out of a 175w Iwasaki SE bulb run on an electronic ballast than half the 250w SE bulbs run off an electronic ballast. The amount of wattage actually used... Oh, and then you have reflectors to talk about too...

My point?? It is very difficult to give an ACCURATE judgement between MH and T5 by the average hobbyist. That's better left to the professionals. It's just better to realize that there are applications where T5s will be better than MH and there are applications where MH will be better than T5.

[Canadian]

Originally Posted by Myka

The Tek fixture is one of the best T5 fixtures you can buy, very nice, and good quality.

WHAT!? Hardly. I would argue the Tek fixtures fit somewhere between bottom of the barrel and mid range - hardly "one of the best". Mid range would be something like an ATI Sunpower which has active cooling with an acrylic shield in place. One of the best (upper range) would be something like maybe an Aquactinics Constellation and then ATI Powermodule, Fauna Marin Star Fire, Sfiligoi Stealth,.

Recommendations like this are why T5s get slagged more than they deserve - people recommend low end fixtures as if they are high end and then consumers end up complaining about staining of their reflectors, poor PAR output (when it actually gets measured), rapid lamp degradation, etc.

Read this thread from this page on for more information about choosing a quality T5 fixture: http://canreef.com/vbulletin/showthr...t=50915&page=3

[Treebeard]

The ATI fixtures are very sexy looking! Are they available in Canada?