What do you want out or a club?

[StirCrazy]

ok cool well if Darren needs a extra10 megs for pics and stuff he can let me know and I will give him some space.

Steve

[Reefmaster]

Hey guys. Sounds like the meeting this weekend was great, i'm disappointed i couldn't make it.

i'm at a bit of a deficit not having heard all that was discussed at the meeting, but i have some opinions on this topic [img]images/smiles/icon_eek.gif[/img] (troy, i can just imagine ya going "oh no, here it comes" [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [img]images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] ).

1) i strongly support the idea of an organized club with an elected body. i can think of a lot of benefits of doing this, and the only negative is the time people would be putting in to it. but for me, its not like work, or home chores, its something i enjoy mucking about with so i would gladly contribute time to it (just bloody great says tanja [img]images/smiles/icon_rolleyes.gif[/img] ).

2) i'm gonna state this up front. i, just like most or all of you using this BB, are very greatful to titus for having set it up and having paid for it this far. titus, you've achieved a pretty remarkable feat in pulling as many local hobbyists together as you have, and for being the catalyst to meetings, friendships and discussion of a club. i have never and in no way would undermine that.
however there has been substantial reference in the past to the costs of maintaining the BB. we do have a great BB here (for free at that), but this isn't free for titus, and really, why should he be paying for the continuation of this board if it effectively is used by club members. i'm not suggesting we should just start up another and jump ship. not at all. i don't know what the best way of handling it is. but my point is that if we have a group of people, and this group incurs expenses (such as maintaining this board), then it's my opinion that membership fees should be paying for these expenses until such time as other avenues are available - sponsorship, raffles, etc. and if membership fees are going to assist in paying for this board, then an agreement has to be made between the club and titus. thats my thought at least.

the rest sounds great. i think some of you would be amazed at the buying power we could develop! shane

[BCReefer]

My thoughts on the club:

1. We do need elected members – as I understand it we should have at least a President/Chairperson Vice President/Chair and Secretary/Treasurer and depending on the amount of member you have other members that could handle other departments. The President usually has the final vote if a tie takes place. I have down loaded the “Starting Your Own” Marine Aquarium Society from MASNA and I am going to contact Vancouver Volunteer, which is non-profit group who helps people start up non-profit societies.

2. A member ship fee should be levied as it makes the club more, IMHO, legitimate. The member ship dues would go to pay for stuff like advertising, paying for meeting rooms, mail outs, printing costs and other miscellaneous costs.

3. There would be 2 types of meetings, the monthly meeting where we can discuss the topic of the day, exchange frags, guest speakers, field trips or what ever we want to do. The 2nd type of meetings are were we as a society must bring in new bylaws and/or elect officials. An agenda must be drawn up in advanced and distributed to all members. The agenda should be followed closely so the meeting does not get off track but still allow for good discussions to take place.

4. From my experience in a Strata Council for my Condo building I understand the following - in the original meeting we would have to vote on the bylaws that would govern the society, these bylaws would be enforced until a AGM (annual general meeting) or a EGM is called (Emergency General Meeting). The memo on the meeting must be issued in advance so that all members have sufficient time to plan for the meeting (in my building it is 2 weeks).

5. I am very leery of having any major sponsors as many of us would feel obligated to shop at the sponsors store. I really believe that we should stay non-partisan so we do not get into any political battle between members over what each stores does or does not do. Today we could be happy with a certain store but in 2 years what happens if they get new owners/employees and some people feel slighted.

6. Politics will be the biggest stumbling block for this society to grow and thrive – as you can read on many of BB there are several ways to do everything and no one way is the best, yet when you get 20 people in a room there will be some heated discussion. The discussions themselves will not be the problem, it will the little groups that get organized with each thinking they are right. Because of this I feel strong about my point #5.

I will try and find out some information from the Vancouver site today and post my findings tonight.

Patrick

[BCReefer]

OK after E Mailing a few people and checking out some web sites I have found the following hints and recommendations:

Below is an E Mail from a person working at Vancouver Economic Development Commission.

You can go as far as you want in terms of the formality of your club or society structure. If you're going to do fundraising, set up club-sponsored events - anything that has to do with significant sums of money – for taxation and even liability purposes, you will probably have to consider incorporating. Basically, the government doesn't care if you want to get together - they just care that if you make any money, they know about it.

If you're going to collect dues and have a formal voting structure, you might want to draw up a society constitution, but unless it's formally incorporated, it has no legal status. For example, if you don't formally incorporate but collect dues, and then your treasurer runs off with the money, you don't really have any recourse, although you could try for small claims court. The only difference between a club and a non-profit is pretty much the scope of your activities.


I went to Toronto’s web site and I found some really good information that we could use as a guide to a set of bylaws and a constitution that we could adopt with any required changes.

Here is a link.

Toronto

Hope this information helps and I hope no one minds me posting this information so quick but once I get burr under my saddle I like to get things done ASAP. I really am excited about this club and I look forward to the exciting times coming up.

Patrick

[SuperFudge]

Wheres the emoticon for fence sitting?

[ 28 January 2002: Message edited by: Fudge ]</p>

[christyf5]

Hey guys,
Everything sounds great. I'm all for paying memberships for the club meetings and/or donations to Titus to keep the BB going. I don't think he should have to shoulder that alone (unless of course he finds some great sponsors to keep us going (which I will not feel obligated to shop at but hey if they sound good I'll check them out).
However, what I would not like to see is meetings where we get bogged down in semantics. Like deciding what our name should be or some such thing. I don't know how many "club" meetings I have gone to and people lose track of why we are there and you spend 3 hours arguing over the tiniest little point. Of course I know we are all more laid back than that [img]images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]
As for expectations, well I hope to learn as much as I can from you guys. The guest speaker idea totally rocks. Some things you just can't get from books.

Christy [img]images/smiles/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[naesco]

I have set up clubs as a Society in the past. Let me know if I can help.
Thank you

[DJ88]

Here we go huh?

Well I guess to start I will state where I feel a club should go and what I feel its aim should be.

Plain and simple, the advancement of the hobby in our area.

Through the following means;

<ul type="square">[*]Education of new people into the hobby with proper methods of caring for corals and fish alike. Education of new “reefers” through information being available about how to join or contact the club at LFS’s. In addition to the education means below.[*]Education of the people who have been in the hobby for a longer period of time. Through informative discussion and sharing of ideas and info between members. Through meetings and seminars demonstrating new advances in the hobby given by speakers brought in for the express purpose of those seminars/meetings.[*]Through trading of properly cared for frags of corals and where possible captive raised fish specimens. This being done not for profit but to help spread the use of these captive raised specimens rather than store bought wild caught specimens. [/list:u:8bc6216ac1]

For each of those it is going to take a bit of discussion to exactly where we go with those three. But to me that is what is important. EDUCATION and CONSERVATION.

With each of those we can branch out and get into detail as desired.

I do think we should have an “elected” body. Basically there for organization and running of the needs of the organization. My worry there is about power and who has it. I like Troy’s Idea of for now having the main two people being taken from the mainland and island. This keeps us together as it is at this moment. With the net it is nothing to sit and communicate easily.

Web Site/forum

KISS. Keep It Simple Stupid

We have a great forum here. And I have about 50 megs of space available for a club web page. That is all we need. Why change what isn’t broke? Web page only. Titus has given us an area(this forum on his BB) for the Vancouver reef club. Lets use that. The Web Page will be for member info, a shot of members web pages. Listings of upcoming events such as bulk purchases, corals and fish arrivals at LFS’s, meetings etc. Nothing fancy. Once we get fancy we introduce too many things to work on. KISS holds true here.

Membership

I think a yearly due is a good idea. I don’t know about implementing it right now but give it a couple of months to iron out the details of a full-blown club. We are going to need some time to iron out the kinks about the club on its own. By adding cash into the mix we are looking at too many details at once to figure it all out.

These dues should be used towards things such as web page, membership cards(or whatever), speakers being brought in to have a more personal information session. Delbeek’s angel rearing in captivity has me amazed. Who wouldn’t want to pick the brain of Dana Riddle? I don’t know that the people newer to the hobby will know all the names but in time will grow to appreciate the knowledge base these people have. If we were to have 30 members it would cost about $40 per person to get a visit from the western US by someone like Rob Toonen. This money could also be raised through raffles, car washes etc. Dues could also be used to a degree towards renting a hall for larger meetings ie annual meeting for election of a board etc.

Associations with LFS’s

Mainly for posting of the club’s info for shoppers who don’t know about us. If the LFS wants to have their banner on our page so be it. Something will be worked out with them at that time. If not the only need I think we have from LFS’s is for that express purpose. The discount from J&L was nice. But even without it I will still shop there and have no qualms about paying full price for what I need. Maybe, and I stress maybe if we are doing large pooling orders then approach businesses about some form of discount.

Another reason I can foresee to have this relationship is for donations of small items to be used in raffles for fund raising.

Harassing these stores about petty things such as discounts for each end every purchase is not a major thing to push for in my books. It will turn around to bite us and they may not want us to put up a poster or banner letting new or old reef keepers about us. Keep our dealings with them for a poster for the club and that is it.
IF the store decides on it’ sown to be generous in some fashion so be it. We start harassing he stores for a few cents off we are biting the hands that feed us in many respects. I know that in my experiences with stores if you are a return repetitive customer to a store they tend to treat you well in time. Treat them with the respect they deserve for doing something that keeps you doing what you like and they may in turn be quite nice to you when you least expect it. I had three stores help me when my tank crashed. And that was all kinds of offers for help and assistance. Nothing asked for in return.
Advertising

Short n sweet. LFS’s and Papers such as buy and sell, Georgia straight etc.. Get exposure. Period. More exposure means more members. More members means more knowledge.

In time we can get more detailed with regards to this. At this time I think it is time we look at figuring out where we want to start. Start small. Then once we get one goal completed we look to the next. If we try to bite off too much and expect too much at once we are going to have a hard time at succeeding. Small steps. Lets get a consensus from everyone who wants to join, next comes name, election of officials, then dues etc etc etc. KISS. Best saying in the world IMO.

Wow.. my fingers hurt..

[Canadian]

Darren, would you care to elaborate on the concept of "...properly cared for frags of corals...?" I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at here. I presume, by the context in which you wrote the above quote, that it pertains to ensuring that existing club members and potential future members not haphazardly frag corals for each monthly meeting in an attempt to either pocket some cash or make trades. And that those who do bring frags to meetings do so with the intention of helping out other hobbyists and contributing to the distribution of captive raised corals thereby furthering the hobby locally.

Is this what you were getting at? [img]images/smiles/icon_wink.gif[/img]

I'll post my thoughts about the club a little later when I'm not so busy studying.

[ 28 January 2002: Message edited by: Canadian ]</p>

[Reefmaster]

darren - just a follow up thought. i hope my post didn't suggest we should nickel and dime the stores that we shop at. actually, i was thinking of bulk orders of lr, ls, and even calc playground sand, things that could be MUCH cheaper if ordered in volume. just making sure that wasn't muddled in my earlier post. shane