Help: SPS bleaching and STN

[daniella3d]

If you are paying for your water, then you might want to consider a RO unit that is low on water usage like this one, which will waste no water, so cost much less at the end:

http://www.costco.ca/Premier-Zro-Pur...100016456.html

If you are using tap water I would start with using RO. This is probably your problem.

Originally Posted by ChizerBunoi

I am going to buy a RODI unit from BRS. Just looking at the cost of RO in my city, it's going to be $40 just to do a 40 gallon water change. That's not including the ATO water of 15 gallons a week.

Also going to try some BRS GFO in a media bag, in my filter sock. But I'll put it on the output of my protein skimmer.

I really want to get a way from carbon dosing entirely. It's scaring me off.

I am thinking it was a combination of ALK ( initially at 7 and then I slowly raised it to 8), and bad water quality. Lesson learnt, listen to people's advice as they have been there, done that.

[Myka]

Originally Posted by ChizerBunoi

What do you think? Will this look tacky? My SPS will then be about 6" from the surface.

Yeah, it probably will. If you don't have something laying around you could use (like a cheap Koralia that you can put the back magnet into the overflow) then just try the RO. Your SPS are fairly small still, so it may not be a flow issue. As they grow you're probably going to get some trouble. If you see a good deal on an MP40 I would probably pick it up if I were you and replace two of the MP10s with one MP40.

I am going to buy a RODI unit from BRS. Just looking at the cost of RO in my city, it's going to be $40 just to do a 40 gallon water change. That's not including the ATO water of 15 gallons a week.

Ouch. Yeah, that's a good plan. Talk to someone in your area that knows RO/DI systems really well to figure out which filters types work best. Here in Saskatoon we have chloramines to worry about, in Alberta I know many areas have really high iron content. I have no idea how that may or may not affect RO/DI systems. If you don't know a fish RO/DI expert, ask a drinking water company and just tell them you're looking at options for drinking water. They will tell you what you need for stages, and then buy it at BRS for 1/4 the price.

I am thinking it was a combination of ALK ( initially at 7 and then I slowly raised it to 8), and bad water quality. Lesson learnt, listen to people's advice as they have been there, done that.

I don't think it is the alkalinity. Tanks that run biopellets are prone to RTN if the alkalinity is above 8 dKH. Zeovit tanks are also supposed to run around 7 dKH. Natural seawater averages around 7 dKH. My reefs both run 7-8 dKH.

[Myka]

I was just looking at your pictures again...

I see some algae growth on the back glass and the pumps, are those the only places in the tank that have algae? How long since you cleaned it off last? I notice also that you have few fish and run BB. You do feed the corals some, but what I'm getting at with these new questions is maybe the corals are starving. The nutrient level is really low. Do you feed the Reef Roids at night when the SPS have their feeding polyps out? Are you getting a good feeding response when you feed the Reef Roids?

[gregzz4]

Besides Myka's good thoughts, I'll add my similar issues from the last few months (or maybe a bit longer)

It sounds like you may be having similar issues to mine and your tank is 'too' clean. I found out our corals need food, or they will bleach

My corals were bleaching pretty badly
I had zero nitrates and phosphates, so some fellow reefers helped me out
Our thoughts are that I wasn't feeding my fish enough, and not feeding my corals, so the corals expelled their zooxanthellae. Once the zoox are gone, there's nothing to protect the corals from my 8x54w light, so bleach away

I turned off half my lights, started feeding the fish double-time, and also started using coral frenzy, phyto plan and coral vitalizer
A couple of weeks and the corals were coming back
Now all are looking much better, and I'm getting the new algae under control
I've also started playing with my lights to get a happy medium between the corals and our viewing times

I see your lights are a total of 15 hours for 3 pairs
I knocked mine down from 27 hours for 4 pairs, to 19 hours for 2 pairs for a couple months. This worked very well for me and I don't think your lights are on too much
I'm currently running a total of (I think) 20 hours total with 4 pairs and all is looking good. It's been many months since I started making changes, so don't expect a quick fix

I also see you wash your socks daily. Do they plug up this fast, or are you just cleaning them 'cause ? I wash mine once a week. Maybe you're removing more nutrients here than you need to

And you run your skimmer very wet. Maybe it's of no consequence, but I run mine dry and only remove a few hundred ml/week, and the nog is very dark

Hope this helps some

[daniella3d]

Running a skimmer wet will remove more DOC from the water I think.

I would also feed amino acids from zeovit as well. A little bottle goes a long way and make the colors great for the corals that are bleached.

Originally Posted by gregzz4

Besides Myka's good thoughts, I'll add my similar issues from the last few months (or maybe a bit longer)

It sounds like you may be having similar issues to mine and your tank is 'too' clean. I found out our corals need food, or they will bleach

My corals were bleaching pretty badly
I had zero nitrates and phosphates, so some fellow reefers helped me out
Our thoughts are that I wasn't feeding my fish enough, and not feeding my corals, so the corals expelled their zooxanthellae. Once the zoox are gone, there's nothing to protect the corals from my 8x54w light, so bleach away

I turned off half my lights, started feeding the fish double-time, and also started using coral frenzy, phyto plan and coral vitalizer
A couple of weeks and the corals were coming back
Now all are looking much better, and I'm getting the new algae under control
I've also started playing with my lights to get a happy medium between the corals and our viewing times

I see your lights are a total of 15 hours for 3 pairs
I knocked mine down from 27 hours for 4 pairs, to 19 hours for 2 pairs for a couple months. This worked very well for me and I don't think your lights are on too much
I'm currently running a total of (I think) 20 hours total with 4 pairs and all is looking good. It's been many months since I started making changes, so don't expect a quick fix

I also see you wash your socks daily. Do they plug up this fast, or are you just cleaning them 'cause ? I wash mine once a week. Maybe you're removing more nutrients here than you need to

And you run your skimmer very wet. Maybe it's of no consequence, but I run mine dry and only remove a few hundred ml/week, and the nog is very dark

Hope this helps some

Originally Posted by gregzz4

Besides Myka's good thoughts, I'll add my similar issues from the last few months (or maybe a bit longer)

It sounds like you may be having similar issues to mine and your tank is 'too' clean. I found out our corals need food, or they will bleach

My corals were bleaching pretty badly
I had zero nitrates and phosphates, so some fellow reefers helped me out
Our thoughts are that I wasn't feeding my fish enough, and not feeding my corals, so the corals expelled their zooxanthellae. Once the zoox are gone, there's nothing to protect the corals from my 8x54w light, so bleach away

I turned off half my lights, started feeding the fish double-time, and also started using coral frenzy, phyto plan and coral vitalizer
A couple of weeks and the corals were coming back
Now all are looking much better, and I'm getting the new algae under control
I've also started playing with my lights to get a happy medium between the corals and our viewing times

I see your lights are a total of 15 hours for 3 pairs
I knocked mine down from 27 hours for 4 pairs, to 19 hours for 2 pairs for a couple months. This worked very well for me and I don't think your lights are on too much

I'm currently running a total of (I think) 20 hours total with 4 pairs and all is looking good. It's been many months since I started making changes, so don't expect a quick fix

Thanks Greg. I'll set the timers to turn the lights on for another 30 minutes this week and perhaps bump it up to a total of 6 hours next week. Dependent on how things go that is.

Originally Posted by gregzz4

I also see you wash your socks daily. Do they plug up this fast, or are you just cleaning them 'cause ? I wash mine once a week. Maybe you're removing more nutrients here than you need to

They plug up every 8 hours. I find that I need to clean it once in the morning and then at night. Depending on how often I turkey baster blast the live rock, it could gunk up every 6 hours.

Originally Posted by gregzz4

And you run your skimmer very wet. Maybe it's of no consequence, but I run mine dry and only remove a few hundred ml/week, and the nog is very dark

Hope this helps some

I have the stupid Bubble Magus skimmer open all the way and the water level is overflowing. I'll try lowering the water level in the sump to less than 9" to see if that helps a difference. It's a HOB protein skimmer that I adapted to use a in sump.

Originally Posted by Myka

I was just looking at your pictures again...

I see some algae growth on the back glass and the pumps, are those the only places in the tank that have algae? How long since you cleaned it off last?

The algae on the back wall is very short. I leave it on there for the lawnmower blenny and tail spot blenny to munch on. When the turbo snails go over it, it's completely clean.

I used to be on top if it by wiping it down, but when the algae started growing, I couldn't get it off. It's an acrylic backing and takes so much scraping to even remove. I do wipe that wall down almost daily, using a sponge.

Originally Posted by Myka

I notice also that you have few fish and run BB. You do feed the corals some, but what I'm getting at with these new questions is maybe the corals are starving. The nutrient level is really low.

I started running barebottom about 3 months ago. Do you remember commenting on my build thread that I would hate Oolite sand? We'll I did. The cyano started to appear on the sand bed at that time, so I siphoned a bit out with each weekly water change.

For feeding, I give my fish NLS pellets/flakes. Then I alternate on other days with Ocean Fresh Pacifica Plankton or Cyclopeeze. I try to feed every single day, but some days are skipped based on my schedule.

The nutrient levels are very low. On Thursday I performed a 4 gallon water change using IORC.

Nitrate (API) - 0
Phosphate (Hanna ULR) - 9 ppb (0.027 ppm)
Calcium (Salifert) - 475 ppm
Alkalinity (Hanna) - 7.8 dkH

I know they are not balanced. You had mentioned before. How do I get them balanced? I am not dosing in equal parts. I am currently only dosing:

Alkalinity (Arm and Hammer) - 25 ML (8 times per day)

Calcium Chloride (got it free from another member, maybe it is downflake but they don't remember the brand) - 20 ML (8 times per day)

This is dosed through an auto doser. I'll dial the Calcium down a bit.

Part of the problem I think is that the salt mix is so high in it's levels that it raises everything up. Then it slowly drops down, but doesn't ever balance as by the end of the week, I do another water change.

Originally Posted by Myka

Do you feed the Reef Roids at night when the SPS have their feeding polyps out? Are you getting a good feeding response when you feed the Reef Roids?

I dose twice a week with a heaping spoonful from the Salifert Calcium test kit. This is probably 1/4 tsp? The polyps are out but I don't see much of a response to the feeding. I turn the return pump/protein skimmer off. But leave all the Vortech's turned on (they are at 100% now BTW).

I also dose 1 drop of Pohls CV every so often. Maybe 2 times a week?

[Myka]

Originally Posted by ChizerBunoi

The algae on the back wall is very short. I leave it on there for the lawnmower blenny and tail spot blenny to munch on. [...] I do wipe that wall down almost daily, using a sponge.

If you're wiping it down that much, then there is obviously nutrients within the system, so if you continue with your coral feedings in the evenings it sounds like you're on the right track there.

I started running barebottom about 3 months ago. Do you remember commenting on my build thread that I would hate Oolite sand? We'll I did.

Haha, I didn't remember who the comment was to, but I remember now.

Calcium (Salifert) - 475 ppm
Alkalinity (Hanna) - 7.8 dkH

I know they are not balanced. You had mentioned before. How do I get them balanced?

Part of the problem I think is that the salt mix is so high in it's levels

If you're doing a 10% or 15% waterchange it really doesn't change the values within the tank very much. Just skip dosing calcium (but continue dosing alkalinity) for a day or two to allow the value to drop.