2 issues- Algae and Dying torch

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by denny@concept

yes but the math is a very small difference when applied permanently , if you read the article you'll see in the graphs how small the differences actually were ....very small.......randy also clearly states that the amount is so small that its irrelevant while the risks are many and not so irrelevant


not sure whats so hard to understand......seems the rest of the experienced reef world gets it so not sure what you question about smaller water changes lol

are you saying that small water changes arn't adequate enough of a practice?

why would you think a larger water change that not only removes but changes the system overall the more the larger it gets is any better than a small one?

OK, to cut through the chase... Do you believe that changing 1.75 gal per day (ie 16% total vol over 3 weeks) on a 235 gal system is a good regime?? Yes, or no.

As I stated before, even 16% all at once every 3 weeks is not enough vol.

[denny_C]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

OK, to cut through the chase... Do you believe that changing 1.75 gal per day (ie 16% total vol over 3 weeks) on a 235 gal system is a good regime?? Yes, or no.

i would shoot for 1-2% or around there per day , be it in large or small. its the large or small part i dont think matters if your looking at it from a removal of nutirents point of view

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by denny@concept

i would shoot for 1-2% or around there per day , be it in large or small. its the large or small part i dont think matters if your looking at it from a removal of nutirents point of view

Well, that's about double the quantity the OP is changing per day. So, I guess your answer is no, that is not a good water change regime that he is using... Wow, we agree...

[denny_C]

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Well, that's about double the quantity the OP is changing per day. So, I guess your answer is no, that is not a good water change regime that he is using... Wow, we agree...

for sure , haha i think james said it best as long as hes DOING water changes thats the important part.

right now like you my water changes are in bulk cause the hobby over the years beat into my head that it has to be better , but now i look at it from a whats important point of view ...i dont suffer from excess nutrients, i dont use water changes to replenish calcium/alk or mg and i dont use water changes to syphon out ditrius i believe a system can be simple and automation is pretty practical alot of the numbers that weren't know years ago are better detailed today as actual data so i believe a more stable approach to things and assurances it works is easier than its ever been and overall its the health and impacts on the animals i keep i care most about

i will be looking in the future to doing smaller changes continuously vs weekly , right now the way im set up is more convenient to do bulk but that doesnt mean my system wouldnt do well with smaller one either.

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by denny@concept

for sure , haha i think james said it best as long as hes DOING water changes thats the important part.

Very graceful backpeddle... Have a great Black Friday. You want to keep Dave happy..., that's what really important,... haha.

[reefwithareefer]

Poor torch has all but been ignored today..lol

OK. My 2 cents on water changes...Mmm, looking at how long this is, maybe I will say, "here is my 5 bucks worth!"

I did a lot of research on water changes. Randys info was the leading reason I chose to do daily water. Now bear in mind that even as a noob, I know there is very little that is an absolute in reefkeeping, as this thread has shown.
There is science beind everything, but that science is limited and leaves alot of question of why, what, how etc. I have a ton of respect for the guys that have been doing this for so long. How they managed to keep a stable tank without half the gizmos, juices, elixirs, etc, I do not know. They are literally pioneers, and that is cool to me.

Even though I may do daily water changes at 1.75 gals a day, it does not mean that it is an absolute. I may find I want to do water changes twice a week instead, maybe stick to daily and double the amount. Who knows.....
I am not going to determine that, my tank will. The inhabitants may say, "hey, knock it off buddy!" or "more changes". That to me is husbandry. It is also how looking after a reef is a lot easier that it was 5, 10 , 20 years ago. I watch and learn, If i do not know why or what, I go do research and if that does not work, I ask you guys and try to form an opinion of what is logical or illogical, right or wrong etc.


I do daily water changes because...............


1: Randy Holmes says it is alright and he seems to be a pretty smart guy.

2: I paid alot of money for my apex. I now have 20 outlets. For as much as I paid for it, I hate seeing them unused. Fill'em up is what I say. lol

3: The Apex makes my life easy. I have the ability to automate everything. thereby, letting me watch the tank more. Once you learn the methodology of the skimmer. chemicals, hoses, plumbing, glues, food. sumps, refugiums etc etc, what else is there , but to watch your tank and learn what makes them tick, so you take care of the living things you have paid to have snatched from the ocean, their home!

4: My best analogy is......Look at it as if you were to take a glass and fill it up with apple juice and grape juice, doing a 50/50 split, and then decide to add water to it because it tasted too strong.

Of course the glass is full, so you need to empty it. Let's say you have a choice to do it all at once or you can do it over a week.
To me, doing it over time, gives the ability to taste it(look at your tank) each day and see what is going on. It would not change the flavor drastically,
if changed day by day.

If you just take 25% out and dump 25% back in, you change the taste drastically, instantly; don't you?

Now I dose my tank etc etc to keep the parameters consistent (Hold the flavor more consistent.) I also believe that the tank grows microorganisms and stuff that I have no idea about, because I add stuff to it, plus I believe it occurs naturally as well. These things do not just all appear, they take time to grow, dose, add etc.

Now you take away 25 percent of the juice, and you take 25% of those good things; do you not?
As opposed to changeing out a smaller amount, because I believe that the orginisms, chemicals etc will restock to a consistent level easier and way quicker than trying to get back from a 25% change

I also believe this goes for my alk, calcium, mag. The new saltwater will replenish some of it, but I highly doubt it will replenish all of what was taken.
Does this not make more work for me, since I will have to figure out how much to add to get to the parameters to what they were originally, just so my dosing will hold them steady?

It seems to me that if I do daily changes, I hold everything more consistent. From what I have read, consistency is really important for a tanks inhabitants.

5: Because I like to think I can

6: Because I like to figure out how to do it and the challenges it posed to get the same amount out as in


I think my logic seems ok, maybe not..Time will tell.

[reefwithareefer]

Shoot...To who ever thought it was a good idea to stop feeding the mixture to the corals...I think you are right. It makes sense that it would be adding many nutrients. I was told that sun corals had to be feed once a day, so I figured it would not hurt to feed many things in one shot by making the elixir.
Thanks