25g Mid-Week Detritus Export Video

[Reef Pilot]

Originally Posted by Beverly

I can only guess that the MB7 and bio pellets are doing what they are supposed to do. Is the water in your pail dirty after vacuuming your sand? How dirty your water is indicates how much detritus your sandbed still accumulates.

I'm wondering if anyone has taken the time to do the sand and tankwater in a jar experiment I suggested earlier in this thread

Yes, the water from the sand is still dirty after vacuuming, but a lot less now. I think the MB7 is what probably makes the biggest visible difference in my tank. The bio pellets just take out the nitrates.

You should try it in your nano (without the bio pellets) just to see what it does.

[Beverly]

Oh, I don't use bio pellets and don't intend to use them. And, no sandbed to put in the jar

Just wondering if anyone thought of doing the experiment for their own information and to share with the rest of us

[RuGlu6]

last time when i used bio pellets i lost about $450 worth of my best SPS.
Plus the $$$ lost to buying pellets and equipment.
Will stick to overskimming for now.

[Reef Pilot]

I didn't want to turn this thread into a discussion on the merits of bio pellets. Some have been successful using them and some have not. There are many potential reasons for this, and it has been extensively discussed elsewhere.

I became interested in this thread to try and gain a better understanding on the role of a thin sand bed and its relationship to detritus and ability to increase a tank's bio load capacity while maintaining low nitrates and phosphates. Beverly highlighted how much detritus is generated even in a BB tank. But what I am not sure of is whether this detritus is reduced with a thin sand bed because of the beneficial bacteria that would reside there and consume it.

Also, would be interested if just the use of MB7 (without bio pellets) would reduce detritus. I know in my tank, detritus (and algae) was dramatically decreased (along with the reduction of N03 and P04) after I started using it with my bio pellets. But have never tried MB7 without the bio pellets. I might try that later after I reset my upstairs display tank.

[ScubaSteve]

Oh Beverly, you ain't seen nothin'! Even with only 2 fish in a 50G, restricted feeding and aggressive Vodka/MB7 dosing it is still terrifying when I do detritus export. Have you ever seen that scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark where they open the ark and that dude's face melts off? It's like that but with less face-melting.

Actually, ever since going the Vodka/MB7 route it's been worse. Most people are surprised by this but they're missing an important part of the bacterial cycle. Bacteria are a living, growing things. They consume nitrates, phosphates, and carbon to produce biomass (ie. grow!); they grow, reproduce and die. If you carbon dose you turbo charge this process. A lot of what we call "detritus" in our tanks is actually bacteria (unless you have one of those "poop factory" fish, it which case it's all crap). This keeps your water clean but if you don't clean your sand bed (or any other porous material in your tank for that matter) regularly, bacteria builds up (along with all of their dead soldiers). If you don't remove the dead bacteria from time to time, they just begin to decay and release the nutrients back into the water.

So yes, having BB does reduce this because there is no sand for bacteria to grow in and it's very easier to blast it out of the tank. But then again, BB is missing an important aspect of the bacterial filtration: a high surface area media on which to grow (very little of the bacteria in our systems are suspended in the water column). I agree that BB is way easier to maintain and have been tempted to go that route before but I, personally, am still attached my bacteria growing substrate. I have been wondering though what is the minimum amount of substrate I can get away with?

Originally Posted by Reef Pilot

Also, would be interested if just the use of MB7 (without bio pellets) would reduce detritus. I know in my tank, detritus (and algae) was dramatically decreased (along with the reduction of N03 and P04) after I started using it with my bio pellets. But have never tried MB7 without the bio pellets. I might try that later after I reset my upstairs display tank.

No, it doesn't really reduce detritus because detritus is mostly bacteria as per above. Sure, it will break down some of the solid matter but the matter that gets broken down doesn't magically disappear, it gets turned into more bacteria! (Newton says "Matter can neither be created nor destroyed". Mass balance baby!)

[RuGlu6]

Originally Posted by ScubaSteve

Oh Beverly, you ain't seen nothin'! Even with only 2 fish in a 50G, restricted feeding and aggressive Vodka/MB7 dosing it is still terrifying when I do detritus export. Have you ever seen that scene in Raiders of the Lost Ark where they open the ark and that dude's face melts off? It's like that but with less face-melting.

Actually, ever since going the Vodka/MB7 route it's been worse. Most people are surprised by this but they're missing an important part of the bacterial cycle. Bacteria are a living, growing things. They consume nitrates, phosphates, and carbon to produce biomass (ie. grow!); they grow, reproduce and die. If you carbon dose you turbo charge this process. A lot of what we call "detritus" in our tanks is actually bacteria (unless you have one of those "poop factory" fish, it which case it's all crap). This keeps your water clean but if you don't clean your sand bed (or any other porous material in your tank for that matter) regularly, bacteria builds up (along with all of their dead soldiers). If you don't remove the dead bacteria from time to time, they just begin to decay and release the nutrients back into the water.

So yes, having BB does reduce this because there is no sand for bacteria to grow in and it's very easier to blast it out of the tank. But then again, BB is missing an important aspect of the bacterial filtration: a high surface area media on which to grow (very little of the bacteria in our systems are suspended in the water column). I agree that BB is way easier to maintain and have been tempted to go that route before but I, personally, am still attached my bacteria growing substrate. I have been wondering though what is the minimum amount of substrate I can get away with?

The above is correct the more surface area provided the more bacteria will grow.
The way I got it set up is I use a " acrylic box in the sump" that my overflow is being emptied to so there is a lot of flow in the small container. And that is where I have my send about 1.5" inch. Not as mach as in the tank bottom abviously but better then nothing.
So two things achieved: One no detritus in the display tank two surface area is provided for bacteria to grow