Blue Hippo - Ich - Treating with copper

[globaldesigns]

Originally Posted by scherzo

I have a Hippo Tang in a 15 gallon (It is a juvenile) and am treating it with copper. (It had ich).

Since I setup the tank a week ago ammonia is now going up.

How should I handle the water changes and re-dose the copper?

I think I'm about .25ppm for ammonia.

Should I just measure the amount I'm taking out and then re-dose?

I do have a copper test kit but I know that it is sometimes difficult to calculate dosage of the copper using a test kit. Maybe test 1st to get a baseline?

Anyone with experience?

Thanks

Personally, I am not a big believer in treating with copper. If your environment is healthy, then the fish will be... Now saying that, is the 15G your new tank? I am hoping it is a hospital tank, if so then follow the others advice.

If this is your new/regular tank, then a big NO NO.... Too small of a tank and too new for any type of fish.

Good Luck!

[cwatkins]

Originally Posted by globaldesigns

Personally, I am not a big believer in treating with copper. If your environment is healthy, then the fish will be...

+1 I'm a firm believer of this as well as natural healing methods for fish.

I know my tank has Ich in it, and probably always has (to some degree...). But by keeping my fish healthy with a balanced diet and dosing Garlic and Selcon into the food daily, it ensures anything that does appear clears up within a day or so.

I guess the UV also helps too.

[scherzo]

Hi all, Thanks for the tips.

I guess I should have provided some information.

1) Bought the fish about 1.5 weeks ago from a LFS.

2) Acclimated him directly into my 90 Gallon DT.. Then it showed ich the next day (no worries.. drip acclimated over 2 hours with the temperature in check. (and YES I do know that I now have ich in my DT but it hasn't attacked my other fish ever... they must be happy)

3) Pulled him out and setup a hospital tank. Bare bottom with some PVC elbows and tees to make him feel comfortable.

I've been doing WCs with old tank water from my 90 but now I started treating with copper.

I know that feeding well, clean water, etc...etc.. is best. That is what is going on in my DT. This is just a new fish from a LFS that must have been quite stressed by the move.

Once I start doing WCs I guess I have to check the copper level.

I am not using an amine treatment. Just regular copper.
I am using an API copper test kit and ammonia kit.

He currently is eating well.

I've actually had saltwater fish for almost 2 years (after moving from fresh water for over 10 years) and this is my first Saltwater Disease!

Someone's question about going hypo with copper.. from my research (taken with a grain of salt.. ) that going hypo with copper will increase the potency of the copper on the fish so is not recommended. It does make sense to me.

Thanks everyone

[daniella3d]

but there is no point treating your hippo for ich if it is in the main tank because as soon as you will put it back in the DT he will get ich againg. So basically you are treating him with copper for nothing.

Your other fish may not show sign but the ich is in your tank now and your other fish will be carrier. As soon as you will put the hippo back and he will be stressed, he'll get that ich back and back to square 1.

You cannot use copper with hyposalinity yes, but I just think there is no point submitting that fish to copper only to have it reinfest with ich very soon.

So in order to get rid of ich, you must treat all of your fish outside the display tank and leave the display tank fishless for 8 weeks.

Originally Posted by scherzo

Hi all, Thanks for the tips.

I guess I should have provided some information.

1) Bought the fish about 1.5 weeks ago from a LFS.

2) Acclimated him directly into my 90 Gallon DT.. Then it showed ich the next day (no worries.. drip acclimated over 2 hours with the temperature in check. (and YES I do know that I now have ich in my DT but it hasn't attacked my other fish ever... they must be happy)

3) Pulled him out and setup a hospital tank. Bare bottom with some PVC elbows and tees to make him feel comfortable.

I've been doing WCs with old tank water from my 90 but now I started treating with copper.

I know that feeding well, clean water, etc...etc.. is best. That is what is going on in my DT. This is just a new fish from a LFS that must have been quite stressed by the move.

Once I start doing WCs I guess I have to check the copper level.

I am not using an amine treatment. Just regular copper.
I am using an API copper test kit and ammonia kit.

He currently is eating well.

I've actually had saltwater fish for almost 2 years (after moving from fresh water for over 10 years) and this is my first Saltwater Disease!

Someone's question about going hypo with copper.. from my research (taken with a grain of salt.. ) that going hypo with copper will increase the potency of the copper on the fish so is not recommended. It does make sense to me.

Thanks everyone

[globaldesigns]

Glad to hear that you aren't keeping a tang in a 15 Gallon. I didn't think that was the case.

Again, personally I don't believe in hospital tanks. The stress of catching them, the stress of putting them in a new environment, usually much smaller and not of the same water quality usually would stress them out more. Again, just my opinion, but why do that.

I have had ICH, and I have only ever lost one fish to it in my big tank. I find if your environment is spot on, and you keep your parameters good, just let them be and feed them a good varied diet. This also goes for HYPO, I don't believe in it.

Now in saying that, I have great success with fish... I can't say much lately for my coral though. Oh Well.

[scherzo]

Honestly, I really think the same thing. I know that FW and SW are two different things... but when I had similar issues in FW I would just do a few small things and just make the fishes feel comfortable.

I've put the tank in a low traffic area and keep the lights low and for a shorter photo period.

He's only about 1.5" - 2" long so I don't think the 15 is bothering him quite yet. He is still eating and swimming quite actively so I'll just continue to monitor.

I was talking to a fellow reefer a few days ago at work and we were saying that everyone has their own methods of dealing with these types of issues.

Originally Posted by globaldesigns

Glad to hear that you aren't keeping a tang in a 15 Gallon. I didn't think that was the case.

Again, personally I don't believe in hospital tanks. The stress of catching them, the stress of putting them in a new environment, usually much smaller and not of the same water quality usually would stress them out more. Again, just my opinion, but why do that.

I have had ICH, and I have only ever lost one fish to it in my big tank. I find if your environment is spot on, and you keep your parameters good, just let them be and feed them a good varied diet. This also goes for HYPO, I don't believe in it.

Now in saying that, I have great success with fish... I can't say much lately for my coral though. Oh Well.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by scherzo

Honestly, I really think the same thing. I know that FW and SW are two different things... but when I had similar issues in FW I would just do a few small things and just make the fishes feel comfortable.

I've put the tank in a low traffic area and keep the lights low and for a shorter photo period.

He's only about 1.5" - 2" long so I don't think the 15 is bothering him quite yet. He is still eating and swimming quite actively so I'll just continue to monitor.

I was talking to a fellow reefer a few days ago at work and we were saying that everyone has their own methods of dealing with these types of issues.

Two points
You might want to consider soaking all food you feed in garlic extract using selcon as welll from time to time.
The tang you bought will get to be the size of a pie plate.
Your 4 foot tank is too small for this tang.
Despite reefers best intentions to move up to a larger tank as the tang grows, the reality is divorce, marriage, kids, unemployment or a move change things and the tangs suffer.

[reefwars]

Originally Posted by globaldesigns

Glad to hear that you aren't keeping a tang in a 15 Gallon. I didn't think that was the case.

Again, personally I don't believe in hospital tanks. The stress of catching them, the stress of putting them in a new environment, usually much smaller and not of the same water quality usually would stress them out more. Again, just my opinion, but why do that.

I have had ICH, and I have only ever lost one fish to it in my big tank. I find if your environment is spot on, and you keep your parameters good, just let them be and feed them a good varied diet. This also goes for HYPO, I don't believe in it.

Now in saying that, I have great success with fish... I can't say much lately for my coral though. Oh Well.

i have the same thought that if your fish are healthy and your tank is healthy then ich wont be a problem in most cases, i know a few people who battled bad bouts of it only to end up with healthy systems without having them fishless for weeks on end.


it all comes down to this any new arrival never hits your tank... all fish are quarantined even if for a short time is all one can do, it goes to show that if you only ever introduce healthy fish to your system then your systenm will be healthy...if you do introduce a fish into your tank who didnt show signs but do now that doesnt mean the rest of your fish will get it , fish that are healthy swimmers with good appetites and strong immune systems can fight it off or are barely affected.

[plutoniumJoe]

** All treatments are up to the individual (Disclaimer).

I don't think that a hospital tank in this situation is a bad idea. I have had my dealings with ich and I still wake up at night with the sweats occasionally thinking about it. I agree that once a tank gets established ich becomes less of an issue but you sometimes have to give a new fish a fighting chance. Considering what the fish probably went through to get from the ocean to your tank a few weeks recouping in a hospital tank might be what the doctor ordered.

If the fish gets introduced and is too small or to sick to compete with the other fish their chances decrease. By treating the fish and nursing them back to health maybe they will have a strong immune system next time they go back into the display and can fight it off this time. Even removing all fish and treating while the DT remains fallow for 6 weeks or so is not always effective. There are some strains of ich that can live without a host for considerably longer.

I often wondered if the fish can sense my stress over these situations and react accordingly. I added a Powder Blue a few months ago and the other tangs cut it up like swiss cheese. Of course he developed some ich and I thought his days were numbered. For once I didn't stress about it and he healed up and is doing fine now.

Anyway good luck and keep us posted......Just keep swimming.

[Goxy]

I had ich in my tank too, I think it came in with one of my tangs, anyway my vlamingi and regal tang both got it. My response was to buy a few more cleaner shrimp and use garlic. The regal tang would actually hang out by the shrimp and over a couple of weeks it disappeared. I don't like copper and thanks to the shrimp didn't have to try hyposalinity.