unique fish????

[sphelps]

Originally Posted by justinl

boo to the fu manchu. that fish shouldn't even be in the trade considering it's success rate.

How about a dwarf eel like G. melatremus? or a ghost eel (Uropterygius concolor)? they should play nice with the angler or leaf fish. If price isn't an object, how about a rhinopias? or a candy basslet (Liopropoma carmabi) if you don't go with the predator theme?

note that a nano predator tank isn't done often because of the high bioload it produces... especially not conducive towards SPS tanks.

I've never heard of the fu man chu being anymore difficult to keep than any other lionfish. All the ones I've seen at the LFS adapted much better than other types. I've also had one for over a year and it has always been easy to feed.

The rhino, leaf, and frog are however much more difficult. I've kept all three before and I probably won't keep them again because of the special requirements involved. I have also kept a white ribbon eel for a long time, although it's a great addition and easy to keep, 30 gallons may be a little small and they can get into tiny holes and escape tanks very easily. You would have to "ribbon eel proof" the tank which can be fairly difficult.

Predator and reef is not done often but it's not difficult. Most predators like lionfish are not very active meaning they use less energy than most reef fish, so you actually can feed them less. Check out my tank, not too many fish but my bioload is small, I go through much less food than I did with a more standard reef tank.

[Lance]

A small predator tank would be pretty cool, with smaller fishes, such as: a dwarf lion, small eel, hawkfish, dwarf puffer. (The puffer may be trouble though, fin-nipping the lion).

[justinl]

Originally Posted by sphelps

I've never heard of the fu man chu being anymore difficult to keep than any other lionfish. All the ones I've seen at the LFS adapted much better than other types. I've also had one for over a year and it has always been easy to feed.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-11/fm/feature/
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2004/fish.htm

I don't mean any offense, but your one success alone doesn't outweigh the majority. I honestly don't know much about keeping rhinopias or leafs. I always thought frogfish were supposed to be pretty easy to keep. True that the eel would require escape proofing; forgot about that.

Originally Posted by sphelps

Predator and reef is not done often but it's not difficult. Most predators like lionfish are not very active meaning they use less energy than most reef fish, so you actually can feed them less. Check out my tank, not too many fish but my bioload is small, I go through much less food than I did with a more standard reef tank.

You could say the same for any fish, but good husbandry means feeding the proper amount of food, not the convenient amount.

[sphelps]

Originally Posted by justinl

I don't mean any offense, but your one success alone doesn't outweigh the majority. I honestly don't know much about keeping rhinopias or leafs. I always thought frogfish were supposed to be pretty easy to keep. True that the eel would require escape proofing; forgot about that.

None taken but it was not based on my one success, I've seen many of these fish come in and adapt well, much better than most other dawrf lions. Just because this fish may be considered "one of the more difficult lionfish to keep" doesn't mean it shouldn't be attempted as you seem to think. It may be difficult compared to other dwarf lions but may be quite easy compared to other fish which are often kept. It should of course be approached with caution as you may need to feed it live food until it can be trained on frozen but this is typical of most lions. Providing information about a fish and why it may be difficult to keep is helpful but simply stating it should not be done is not. No offense.

Originally Posted by justinl

You could say the same for any fish, but good husbandry means feeding the proper amount of food, not the convenient amount.

Not really, most reef fish swim non stop and feed constantly in the wild to keep up the energy they require. This means in captivity they require several feedings daily to stay healthy. Predators like lion fish don't move around very much and conserve energy better, this is because they don't eat as often in the wild and this adaptation will transfer into the aquarium, therefore you should not feed them as often.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by sphelps

None taken but it was not based on my one success, I've seen many of these fish come in and adapt well, much better than most other dawrf lions. Just because this fish may be considered "one of the more difficult lionfish to keep" doesn't mean it shouldn't be attempted as you seem to think. It may be difficult compared to other dwarf lions but may be quite easy compared to other fish which are often kept. It should of course be approached with caution as you may need to feed it live food until it can be trained on frozen but this is typical of most lions. Providing information about a fish and why it may be difficult to keep is helpful but simply stating it should not be done is not. No offense.


Not really, most reef fish swim non stop and feed constantly in the wild to keep up the energy they require. This means in captivity they require several feedings daily to stay healthy. Predators like lion fish don't move around very much and conserve energy better, this is because they don't eat as often in the wild and this adaptation will transfer into the aquarium, therefore you should not feed them as often.

What do you mean when you say that you see many of these fish come in.......
Come into where?

[sphelps]

Originally Posted by naesco

What do you mean when you say that you see many of these fish come in.......
Come into where?

The LFS, I may only have one tank myself but I've setup and maintained many in the past. I'm also good friends with the LFS owner and employees so I tend to notice when certain fish are trained on frozen. I've also been looking for a new dwarf lionfish but haven't found one just yet, like I said the fu man chu's seem to be doing better on average but I already have one of those. It also helps that the owner of our LFS is very knowledgeable and does very well at training many types of fish onto frozen.

[naesco]

Originally Posted by sphelps

I've never heard of the fu man chu being anymore difficult to keep than any other lionfish. All the ones I've seen at the LFS adapted much better than other types. I've also had one for over a year and it has always been easy to feed.

The rhino, leaf, and frog are however much more difficult. I've kept all three before and I probably won't keep them again because of the special requirements involved. I have also kept a white ribbon eel for a long time, although it's a great addition and easy to keep, 30 gallons may be a little small and they can get into tiny holes and escape tanks very easily. You would have to "ribbon eel proof" the tank which can be fairly difficult.

Predator and reef is not done often but it's not difficult. Most predators like lionfish are not very active meaning they use less energy than most reef fish, so you actually can feed them less. Check out my tank, not too many fish but my bioload is small, I go through much less food than I did with a more standard reef tank.

SPhelps
I was surprised to read that you were of the opinion that ribbon eels are easy to keep. I was also surprised that you would put them in with predator/active fish.

Two of the acknowledged experts in marine fish disagree.
Scott Michael states they are difficult to keep and are on his red list.
http://en.microcosmaquariumexplorer.com/wiki/Ribbon_Eel

Robert Fenner states that 90%+ do not survive 30 days.
http://wetwebmedia.com/ribbonmorayeels.htm

With statistics like this the ribbon eel should not be on anyone's stock list and should only be available on special order by aquarists' who have the experience and patience to provide for their care.

Wayne

[sphelps]

Originally Posted by naesco

SPhelps
I was surprised to read that you were of the opinion that ribbon eels are easy to keep. I was also surprised that you would put them in with predator/active fish.

Two of the acknowledged experts in marine fish disagree.
Scott Michael states they are difficult to keep and are on his red list.
http://en.microcosmaquariumexplorer.com/wiki/Ribbon_Eel

Robert Fenner states that 90%+ do not survive 30 days.
http://wetwebmedia.com/ribbonmorayeels.htm

With statistics like this the ribbon eel should not be on anyone's stock list and should only be available on special order by aquarists' who have the experience and patience to provide for their care.

Wayne

In the previous post I referred to a white (or ghost) ribbon eel which is easier to keep than the other types of ribbons. I would agree that other species should be avoided.
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...t2004/fish.htm

I kept one for well over two years before an unfortunate accident during my last move a couple months back. Did very well with other tank mates and never caused any issues.
A video from my previous tank