aquascaping

[spikehs]

When I finally can water in my tank I really want to try and create some unique structures, so i was looking for some advice...I was wondering what is the best way to secure to pieces of lr together to form arches cliffs, etc? I have heard of people use pvc and zip ties...How long can LR stay out of the water? I was planning on putting all the sand in (most anyways) then place the rocks and get em like i want them, then put in the water...I figure this way I know the rock structure will be sturdy and if I want to move stuff around I dont' get massive sand storms..anything wrong with doing it this way? thanks.

Sean

[Beverly]

Originally Posted by spikehs

I was planning on putting all the sand in (most anyways) then place the rocks and get em like i want them, then put in the water...I figure this way I know the rock structure will be sturdy and if I want to move stuff around I dont' get massive sand storms..anything wrong with doing it this way? thanks.

Sean,

The way I put together a new reef is to first make as much saltwater as I can and store it (aerated and heated) until I'm ready to use it. Then I place the sandbed into the bare, but clean, tank. Once the sand is in place, I put a dinner sized plate on top of the sand where the water will spill onto reducing, but not completely eliminating, the sandstorm. Powerhead(s) and heater(s) go into the tank to get the tank working like a tank should work. If possible, throw on some mechanical filtration to filter out some of the fine debris from the water column.

After the water has cleared, stack your rock. Take your time stacking it. There isn't any hurry to get your rock stacked, so stack it, then walk away for the rest of the day. If it doesn't look the way you want the first, second or third time, try restacking until you get it the way you want it.

As for how long the rock should be without water is hard to say, imo. If it's uncured rock, it will already have been out of water for awhile, so a little longer isn't going to hurt too much. However, if you can have a couple of buckets of water to pack the rock into while you're stacking, all the better for the rock.

I rearranged a well cured tank today and some of the rock was out of the water for 10-15 minutes at various times with no harm done to the tank or its inhabitants.

HTH.

[Canadian Man]

Hey Sean,
Since your rock is in your current tank and full of life I would not leave it out of the water for more than a minute. If you have pods, small brittles etc than i'm sure they can't last too long with out water. It took me about 1 1/2 years to get my rock the way I like it and now I'm moving to a bigger tank soon

[StirCrazy]

Originally Posted by Canadian Man

Hey Sean,
If you have pods, small brittles etc than i'm sure they can't last too long with out water.

they made it throught a 24 to 48 hour shipping in most cases. seriously thought I have had my rock out of the water for up to two hours and not noticed anything.. obviously the shorter the better but the worst that you might get by being over a hour is that your rock will have to re cure. just keep it moist and fairly warm and you should be fine.

Steve

[tkhawaja]

Originally Posted by spikehs

I was planning on putting all the sand in (most anyways) then place the rocks and get em like i want them, then put in the water...

I'm going through my planning phase for the next two weeks. Waiting for the tank to arrive is a drag. From all my research and reading, this is what i will be doing for a new tank setup.

1-check for leaks
2-place tank in its desired location, level tank
3-assemble equipment
4-add water
5-add salt mix, wait 24 hours
6-add live rock
7-add sand or whatever substrate

This way your rock will always have a stable base. With any sort of a sand bed the rock placed on top of the sand can shift due to burrowing critters, causing a rock slide. Not a good thing, even in the smallest aquariums.

There should be some "glue" available from your LFS for putting together live rock. If not I've definately seen some on J & L's website. garf.org has also done some research on super glue. The cheapest solution would be to use plastic. The encrusting algea love to grow on plastic.

[Beverly]

Originally Posted by tkhawaja

this is what i will be doing for a new tank setup.

1-check for leaks
2-place tank in its desired location, level tank
3-assemble equipment
4-add water
5-add salt mix, wait 24 hours
6-add live rock
7-add sand or whatever substrate

This way your rock will always have a stable base. With any sort of a sand bed the rock placed on top of the sand can shift due to burrowing critters, causing a rock slide. Not a good thing, even in the smallest aquariums.

If going Tahir's route, add powerheads and heaters after adding the salt to the water. Before adding rock, make sure SG is what you think it is, as it can sometimes shift a bit from the time you add the salt to the time it is all fully dissolved. Turn off powerheads while adding the sandbed to minimize the sand storm.

Also want to amend something from my previous post about snails: Good snails to add are astreas that will clean algae from rock and glass, and nassarius that will eat leftover food and slightly stir the sandbed.

[Quinn]

when i set up my tank, i put all my sand and base rock in first, then mixed the water in a barrel, and pumped it into the tank. much less sand and crap everywhere, and easier to tell how much water i needed. canadian man was there and at first suggested it might not be the way to go, but i think by the time we were done he had changed his mind, so there must be some advantage in the way i did it just a thought...

[spikehs]

I heard of people drilling the rock and using plastic zip ties and rods, anyone have any experiance with this?

[Beverly]

Originally Posted by spikehs

I heard of people drilling the rock and using plastic zip ties and rods, anyone have any experiance with this?

When we set up our very first tank, a 75 gal several years ago, I thought I'd stacked the rock to perfection on my very first try and I wanted it to stay that way forever

After a few months, though, I had time to observe water flow throughout the tank, fish interaction with the caves and ledges I had carefully made, placement of the corals I'd chosen to keep, along with other factors that don't immediately come to mind.

You know, I began to think the rock structure needed to be rearranged to provide better water flow and better places for the tang we had to hide and swim through. Some of the corals needed to be placed in different locations, too. So I rearranged my FIRST perfect rock structure to my SECOND perfect rock structure.

A few months later, the rock was rearranged yet again because it wasn't yet the way it needed to be to fullfill the needs of the inhabitants. Don't know how many major or minor rearrangements I did over the years, but I was glad I hadn't permanantly adhered the rocks together.

IMO, don't drill or fasten your rocks together as you're probably going to find good reasons down the road to rearrange everything a few times. Taking time when stacking the rock will keep it from falling over and you won't have to go to the extra work of drilling, etc. JMHO, though.

[Michael]

It's interesting that in The Reef Aquarium Volume 1 they actually sugest drilling liverock and using plastic ties to hold them together.

Michael