New Lighting and more

Josh23 · #1 01-05-2003, 04:41 AM

Well I have just returned from a week in Mexico and have now decided to upgrade my lighting. Well I hope so pending a couple things, My Dad and the electric bill.

That was the good news. The bad news is that the six line wrasse I bought on boxing day died a while I was away. Not sure why he died but I feel that I robbed a life which would have been longer if he had remained in the ocean. Although if there is one good thing that came from this fishes death, I believe it is this. Im going to stop purchasing ocean caught fish and only buy tank raised. I know this decreases the variety of fish which I will be able to keep but I will feel better knowing that Im not contributing to the death of fish who would otherwise still be in the ocean.

NOW ON TO LIGHTING

1. Where and what should I buy?
2. The deepest I can ever see my tank getting is 2 feet.
3. I would like to keep softies and maybe some sps. Well lets just say I would like to keep a variety of propagated corals so I beleive that a 250 watt lamp would be good.
4. I was thinking of a 10,000 K bulb
5. What kind of ballast should I buy and why? (I was thinking PFO standard)
6. Where can I buy a dual ballast for the cheapest?

Feed back on one or all of the above questions and comments would be great.
Thanks
Josh

Canadian Man · #2 01-05-2003, 06:05 AM

How was your trip josh?

Here are some of my opinions.

Quote:

1. Where and what should I buy?

Well I would say J/L or Saltwater connection.
I purchased my pfo ballast at J/l and their prices are good etc.

The ballast you buy depends somewhat on the type of bulb.
Iwasaki's are nice but you "Probably Want" Actinic supliments. Oh they are also quite inexpensive per bulb when you compare them to the 10k bulbs.

10k bulbs are great but you will probably still want some actinics as well.

Josh23 · #3 01-05-2003, 02:45 PM

First the lighting.

I was thinking about JL as a good source I had just heard someone say a while back that they thought you could buy ballasts cheaper here in Calgary. Not sure who said it.

The Trip.
Its was excellant. I did a couple days snorkling and saw some huge angels. I was not sure of the species but I would have to say they were about the size of a small tire. The so large you could see them very well from the second story of the boat. I didnt see to many corals as the water we were snorkling is was pretty deep. I did however while walking along the shore see a lot of zoo's, hermit crabs, snails, tons of sea urchins and varioius other creatures. It was a great time. Im also booking a month long trip this spring to visit Sinapour and some of the surrounding islands. I hope to do a lot of snorkling and maybe even get certifitied for diving while Im there. Sorry I didnt get any diving picks although I do have some of the creatures I saw while on the shore. Ill post them once I get them back.

Josh

MitchM · #4 01-05-2003, 10:36 PM

People usually balk at the initial cost of the DE light, but I suggest you do the math on the long term affordability of them. If The Aqualine or Giesmann's are out of reach, have a look at the Hamilton fixtures. I've got a single 150w over my sump that was 6 or $700. (you can probably find it a bit cheaper than I did, too) I know it's available in 250w, but I don't know that price. One feature about the DE's (double ended) bulbs is that they have to be replaced less frequently. If you get one with an electronic ballast, it will use less electricity than a comparable tar ballast set-up. Also, with identical reflectors, I believe that watt for watt, the DE's will out perform the mogul based versions.
Food for thought.

Mitch

StirCrazy · #5 01-05-2003, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carpentersreef

People usually balk at the initial cost of the DE light, but I suggest you do the math on the long term affordability of them. If The Aqualine or Giesmann's are out of reach, have a look at the Hamilton fixtures. I've got a single 150w over my sump that was 6 or $700. (you can probably find it a bit cheaper than I did, too) I know it's available in 250w, but I don't know that price. One feature about the DE's (double ended) bulbs is that they have to be replaced less frequently. If you get one with an electronic ballast, it will use less electricity than a comparable tar ballast set-up. Also, with identical reflectors, I believe that watt for watt, the DE's will out perform the mogul based versions.
Food for thought.

Mitch

Mitch there has been no evadence to suport that DE's last longer than regular bulbs of the same brand (the reason people thought they were was that they were running the German mogual bulbs onthe wrong ballasts and shortinging the life of thoes), and with ideantical reflectors the DE is actulay the same power "watt per watt" as the mogual of the same brand on the same ballst.

in fact the only advantage the DE has over the comparable Mogual is the size.. this give it the ability to be placed in smaller more efficient reflector designs.

if you take the DE AB 250 watt 10000K and the mogual 250 watt 10000K bulbs.. the only difference is Size.. they should both be run off of a ANSI M80 ballast (which is not a standard ballast) and when they are both runn off that ballast the out put if virtualy ideantical the difference comes into play with the design of reflectors.. also if you have a small take like a 20 gal or something like that.. the DE is better suited for clean looking installs.

Josh23, first decide which bulb you would like to run.. then you can look fo rthe proper ballast for them.. if you want bang for your buck go with a iwasaki 250 watt set up.. if you like 10000K it can get trickey.. the 10000K bulbs will run on a normal ballast but not to thee full ability.. and the proper ballast is not cheep. my self I am setting up AB bulbs with the proper M80 ballast.. not the cheepest way to go but the M80 is the proper ballast for the european bulbs.. it is a lot more expensive.. (about 120.00 more over a PFO regular dual ballast set up, but if you are handy with wiring and such you can do it for about the same price.

Steve

MitchM · #6 01-05-2003, 10:54 PM

Steve, I've always read that the DE bulbs had a stronger intensity than the mogul based vs. same wattage.? I'll try to find the info that I saw that mentioned the different recommended replacement times.

Mitch

MitchM · #7 01-05-2003, 11:04 PM

Steve, here's an article that mentions that a 150w DE puts out more light than a 175w mogul...:http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...2/feature2.htm

I'm certainly not a lighting expert, so I usually just read the conclusions....

, so if you see a major point in there that I am missing, please point it out.

Mitch

StirCrazy · #8 01-05-2003, 11:24 PM

it is all in the reflector Mitch.. there was also a article that said a 150 DE put more power out than a 250 watt and was aproching a 400 watt Iwasaki output.. sence then it has been found that this was because the DEs were tested with a extreamly focusing reflector and the moguals were tested with n o reflector.. sence then tests done on bare bulbs have shoewn that there is no difference.. and like I said it is the reflector than can make a big difference.. if you look at that page you showed me again and look closely you have quoted a stacked test also.. the 175 was on a magnetic ballast and the 150de was on a M81 ballast and unshielded.. to bring this in to comparason you have to shield the DE bulb if you are goign to follow manufactures recomendations for everything els.. so with that shirleded the DE 150 puts out 50.8 PAR and the 175 on the M57 ballst puts out 64.4PAR.. so the 175 is higher..

Steve

MitchM · #9 01-05-2003, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StirCrazy

it is all in the reflector Mitch.. there was also a article that said a 150 DE put more power out than a 250 watt and was aproching a 400 watt Iwasaki output.. sence then it has been found that this was because the DEs were tested with a extreamly focusing reflector and the moguals were tested with n o reflector.. sence then tests done on bare bulbs have shoewn that there is no difference..
Steve

I remember that one. So is it your opinion that the only major differences in the DE vs. mogul is that the DE are lower profile and a more expensive set-up?

Mitch

StirCrazy · #10 01-05-2003, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carpentersreef

I remember that one. So is it your opinion that the only major differences in the DE vs. mogul is that the DE are lower profile and a more expensive set-up?

Mitch

well partial.. they are not realy that much more expensive.. a AB 250 watt DE compared to a AB 250 watt SE. they both use the same ballast..

but like you said with the lower profile and the smaller size they become a new choice.. take a 250 watt bulb and try stuff it over a 10 gal nano.. cant do it.. you will have mogual socket spilling out the ends.. but now do it with a DE and you have lots of room.. you can even fit a couple actinics in there.. kinda of a extreem example but you get my point.. this is also the driving force behind the new sleak hanging pendents from AB and giessmen (how every you spell it) wight out double ended bulbs they would be a lot more bulkey and the reflectors would have to be a lot larger.

Steve