Taxes - Using your business/aquarium expenses for write-offs?

andsoitgoes · #1 04-25-2007, 10:46 PM

okay - so my intent with getting my tanks going was dto do breeding, and sell a lot of my breeding stock - I made squat and sold next to nothing, but spent a fortune...

I'm trying to be as accurate as possible on my taxes, anyone have any advice on how to do it, and what is claimed where?

Thanks

marcingo · #2 04-26-2007, 12:05 AM

From what I have learned in tax class up to now is that you can only write off expenses off of revenues related to the business. If you sold nothing you cant really write it off of your other unrelated income. But then again this is first level tax so I may be wrong.

BMW Rider · #3 04-26-2007, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcingo

From what I have learned in tax class up to now is that you can only write off expenses off of revenues related to the business. If you sold nothing you cant really write it off of your other unrelated income. But then again this is first level tax so I may be wrong.

I believe that is correct, but you may be able to carry forward the costs for future income. Might be best to talk to an accountant.

zulu_principle · #4 04-26-2007, 01:30 AM

You are probably best to discuss with a tax person, and assuming you are not paying taxes wait until after the tax deadline as you will not get much attention from many accountants.

I assume you are filing as a sole proprietor and wishing to offset income from other sources.

Its a bit of a helium balloon if your intention is just to look for write offs. Helium ballons always drop somewhere, and suffice to say CCRA is not the best balloon to find on any given day.

Best of luck, and for what its worth there are always lots of accountants looking for frags who will give you free advice......

Wendell

andsoitgoes · #5 04-26-2007, 01:42 AM

I've dealt with this before on a sole propietor business I ran, I had minimal sales and the bueiness ended up in the red a fair amount, it seems to be the same with this, where I have made some smaller sales of fish/frags/etc - but it totals to a very small portion - From what I understood speaking to an accountant a few years back, you can be in the red for 2 years from the start of any business, and if this doesn't take off in the next year, then it's kind of gone at that point anyway.

I've got all my receipts from items purchased, and although some were for enjoyment, heck - technically a large portion of it is (as was my previous buiness) - in the end it's there to promote growth and make further income.

But if there are any accountants that want a few frags, PLEASE LET ME KNOW!!

I could use some help!

EmilyB · #6 04-26-2007, 05:22 AM

From an accountant, the object of a business is to make money, not have losses. And yes, you need income before you can write off expenses.

Losses from a "hobby" are not allowable. If you have a business license, you may get away with a loss if you have taxable income the following year. I would refrain from a frivolent claim which could only cause you problems in the future.

andsoitgoes · #7 04-26-2007, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmilyB

From an accountant, the object of a business is to make money, not have losses. And yes, you need income before you can write off expenses.

Losses from a "hobby" are not allowable. If you have a business license, you may get away with a loss if you have taxable income the following year. I would refrain from a frivolent claim which could only cause you problems in the future.

Thanks - that's what I'd been under the impression of. I've already broken through that red barrier, but all of my major purchases of the lights, tanks, etc were within that first year. No major extra expenses will keep me away from actually bringing in some sort of income.

I don't want to just put in losses for the sake of losses, but our goal was to do breeding of f/w fish and do coral propogation - Actually, I guess a question of mine is if you start a business and realize that you're not going to actually MAKE money from it, and that you've expended a ton of cash as outflow, why is that not "acceptable"?

EmilyB · #8 04-26-2007, 08:24 PM

Well, it's not so much business as businesses that could be interpreted as a hobby.

Hobby and Personal Benefits

Quote:

It is important to realize that the reasonable expectation of profit test is not completely dead. In cases where the business has an element of hobby or personal benefit, the Court is saying that Revenue Canada may still apply the test.
Hobby and personal benefits cases include horse farms, Hawaii and Florida condominium rentals, ski chalet rentals, yacht operations, dog kennel operations and similar types of endeavours. These are all cases where the taxpayer has invested money into an activity from which the taxpayer derives personal satisfaction or psycho-logical benefit.

Not that you get any pleasure out of reefkeeping...

I just wanted to point it out so people don't think because they sell a few frags, they can write off their aquariums.

andsoitgoes · #9 04-26-2007, 08:28 PM

good point - thanks for bringing that up, that's acutally a huge help.

But then how does that go for people who are huge fish fanatics but also run pet stores? but I guess that's where the test comes in, and is why I'm going to focus on profit this year, so they'll see the balance. Now, if I can just get people to buy things.

And hey - psychological benefit? GUH - How about psychological STRAIN!! I should write off therapy bills from the heck this has caused me!!! :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmilyB

Well, it's not so much business as businesses that could be interpreted as a hobby.

Hobby and Personal Benefits

Not that you get any pleasure out of reefkeeping...

I just wanted to point it out so people don't think because they sell a few frags, they can write off their aquariums.