anybody using the jebao wp 40 or 25's
 

been hearing pretty good things about them, give vortec and tunze a good run, i know what your saying you pay for what you get, but there getting great reviews, anywhos just wondering

Haven't tried them, and no plans to do so. The original designs that they ripped off work very well. The Chinese can't make baby food that doesn't leak toxins so there's no way I would trust something of theirs in my tanks if there's an alternative.

They work great. I have 2 of the 40's on my tank, but have them ramped right down. I'm actually going to do 4 of the 25's instead when they arrive.
Anybody who thinks that everything out of china doesn't work as well or is going to malfunction in some way, has got to open their eyes. The majority of components, even in the big brand names comes from where?? I'll give you one guess.....if they tell you any different, well....

I've heard rumors of them exploding....

Post a link....

Bob, is right about the components..most come from China. BUT, that is not the problem. The problem with "made in china" is quality control. Bob, you and I both know first hand about quality control and made in china.

I have a friend who is the VP of a billion $ company and all of their products are made in China. They have 5 quality control firms whom they work with. These firms have multiple employees and every step of the manufacturing line making 100% sure the end product is up to standards. Their QC cost more than the manufacturing! That is how they get quality products our of China.

This is not to say the Jebo's are not good pumps, I'm sure they are for they money. We don't know long they will last but at $100....they can't be to bad.

As a business owner I would not go near those pumps until this whole Tunze ordeal is over. I respect the Tunze brand to much to monetize from an obvious copy.

Ray

True, very true. All I was saying is that like it or not, the vast majority of components come from off shore companies. To say that anything made in said country is junk is just not true. The fact is that it was assembled in another country with those very components. As long as QC is in place, I cannot see why a product wouldnt be as good.
As for tunze, I agree, top quality. Customer service that is no doubt the top of the list. The same could be said about you Ray, Ive always had nothing but good service from you....

Yupp, we need to get used to that fact!

I was renovating one of my apartments last week and we are all amazed that the flooring i bought was "made in germany". 4 guys standing around a box oooh and awing lol. We have become so accustomed with made in china that it becomes a treat when it's not. heh!

Thanks for the kind words!

Ray

When I was a kid, still remember people saying the same thing about Japan, how their stuff was junk. Well, that sure changed with time...

Then more recently about Korea. Certainly don't hear that anymore either, if anything their quality is probably tops right now.

That line has long extinct from this hobby just like watt per gallon theory. It should be more like "you pay what you what". A KZ zeovit reactor is $300+ while a vertex zeovit reactor is $100+. Does that make vertex reactor bad? NO. You get a bubble king skimmer for $1000+ and a bubble magus skimmer for $100+. Does that make BM a bad skimmer? NO. You get a radion for $800+ and a evergrow LED for $200+. Does that make evergrow LED bad? NO (in fact I have heard people having more trouble with radions than evergrow). A vertex RODI costs $200 and a aquasafe costs $100. Does that make aquasafe bad? NO! It is not always the "price" that can judge a product. People just need to get over the fact that everyone in this hobby should buy expensive stuffs or never start it.

Coming back to your main part of the post. I use WP40 and am happy about it. The only thing that would have made it "perfect" is the speed control. And not every Chinese product leach. If that was true, the whole world would be in a pool filled with "leached" stuffs.

I have a wp-40 on my 80g. Works awesome. Buying the voltage controller for the extra $10 is a must. I have it down to 15v from the original 24v so my lps doesn't get blown to bits.
And dead silent.

I would highly recommend them.

Look around bud, guarantee half of the stuff in your house hold is Chinese made....Good luck.

here is a brief review of the wp25 ( older model .. 3 weeks older model...without the variable speed control; ones from Nick are with the speed control so no extra money needed for the variable voltage part ).

http://www.thespryminds.com/reviews/...ble-powerhead/

Agree with this 100%. Assuming that everything coming from a specific country is bad is simply being ignorant.

In economics, one of the reason brands like Vortech or Bubbleking can price their products at such a high price is because they have market power. The price does not necessarily reflect higher quality.

I would guess that it costs about the same to produce a vortech and a jebao wp40.

TO be fair, there's only so many ways a pump can look. In this case I would agree with you that it is a pretty obvious copy, even their branding is an obvious trademark rip off - but that said, Tunze's pumps are a form that follows function, and there's a limited number of forms that can achieve said function, so it's not surprising that a 'knock off' would look similar.

If Behr was the first company to ever release a blue paint, would that somehow give them a universal, life-long right to blue paints?

As someone who wants high caliber products I try to be loyal to companies that make them, but as a consumer with finite resources, I REALLY don't like it when I find someone producing a nearly identical product and selling it at a fraction of the cost while still remaining profitable. It makes me feel like the company that I've been loyal to has been ripping me off.

arguments about quality control and where the components came from aside, a tunze and a jebao both move a certain amount of water, and come with similar features and controllability. If the the only thing that sets Tunze apart from Jebao in the long-run is that it's got a fancy brand name, I think they're going to be in trouble and need to start innovating a little more aggressively as I'm sure Jebao will eventually have every feature one could want from a water pump and still be considerably less expensive. If your product costs several times more than your competitors, I really do feel like there should be a good and tangible justification, and China-phobia isn't one of them.

I have to throw my $0.02 into this.

I have the Evergrow D120 units, 3 them actually and I LOVE them my corals are happy and noticeable growth within only a few months of use. Yes they are made from China but you know what im happy with them. Not to mention all 3 units cost me less (Shipped to my door) then 1 radion unit...

I just purchased a WP40 from www.reefsupplycanada.com from the group buy im sure its going to be exactly what I want. Every review I have ever seen on them gives them praise for being so well built.

My question is why do all the "Old Timers" need to make us newbie reef junkies feel like we need to go bankrupt to have a tank? Just because that was the norm 10 years ago? 20 years ago? Times have changed and the so have the cost to make products for keeping fish. I cant even count on my hands the amount of times I have seen posts or talked to people about which product would be better and someone with 10 years in the hobby has to chime and say "Only use this product because its what I use!" and the price is double or triple of other brands. It really hits a cord with me when people think price is the only thing that matters.

Im going to use the wp40 on my tank and plan to until it stops working if thats a year or two who knows but im still further ahead trying it rather than letting the rumor mill explode with false info.

I have a wp25 and all I can say is WoW!!! very quiet compared to the mp pumps I have heard, and one third of the price.

They seem well built and I don't see anything that could lead me to beleive they are cheaply built.

I have a Tunze 6045 and the darn thing suck big time. First it is very hard to remove the cap and each time I must use a screwdriver or a knife and I dammage it a little bit each time. Now with the Jebao, all you need to do is turn a bit to unscrew! no more hard time to remove the pump cover! PLUS, the wp25 is A LOT MORE powerful than my Tunze and to top it, it is controllable. And last but not least, that darn tunze gadget to adjust the flow keep jamming so the gimmiky finniky gadget that is supposed to lower the flow it totally USELESS. Now I paid 93$ for that Tunze pump, a total waste of money.

I feel the opposite about the Jebao wp25, powerfull, silent, very nice gentle flow, very easy to remove the cover for cleaning, and controllable!!! with its own controller or with the Reef Angel controller. I already have the cable to control it...awesome!

Geeezzzz...tough choice..no more Tunze gimmik for me.

I think it somewhat of a misconception with products made in china. Like i said earlier the problem with most items made in china is quality control. There are a LOT of fantastic products in this industry that are made in china. The reason they are fantastic is because of inovatetive designing and quality control.

Look at the complete line of Octopus, top notch porduct. Innovative marine, bubble magus, speedwave and the list goes on. Not only are they great products they also have a great team behind them that stand behind their products.

With that being said i still stand behind what I said earlier. Not as a buisness owner but as a person who still believes in ethics. Some say the design is not a copy, ok, let's assume its not. What about the upside M in W? IMO they did not have to take that route. If the pump is as good as we have seen so far they would have sold just as many without the need of such similarities in name and design.

Ray

I'm sure it is, that's why I made a point of saying "if there's an alternative". Sometimes there's not, but when there is I'll put the Chinese product back on the shelf.

As mentioned, Chinese firms have big time quality control problems. That's one reason not to buy Chinese. For me at least, another reason is the blatant theft of everybody elses work. The amount of money western firms lose to Chinese reverse engineering every year is staggering. Where possible, I try to reward the businesses that put the time and effort into developing a quality product rather than rewarding businesses that steal other peoples work, assemble it in sweatshops and dump it into our markets.

Yeah, the Japanese and South Koreans built crappy stuff for a while too. But at least their firms respected the work of others and were bound by international intellectual property norms.

Where Chinese firms have made real innovation of their own and the quality seems ok, I don't mind buying. When it's just a cheap rip-off of someone elses hard work, I'll take the original.

Cheers,

On the topic....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPzRPga6uDg

Sorry, couldn't resist.

I see no difference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw-zxJI1YOo

Heh yeah I have seen worst unfortunately

:razz:

Wow on both of those. Amazing that both these guys could be so careless out in the open where they know people are watching

your choice, go pay 3 times the price for something that's not even as good.

As for copy, you should stop bying kleenex, or always buy the kleenex brand because they all look pretty much the same to me, no matter the brand so some companies must have copied the original. Don't buy a refregirator either, or even a car. They all have 4 wheels, a body and en engine, so they were all copied on the first car ever made and invented.

The wp25 does look a bit like the Tunze but the ressemblance stop there...everything else is way better and have a much better design. I see it like this..if the Chineses can make such a good pump for so little, then why these companies did not make their pumps better then this?

Have you ever tried opening a tunze pump cover? Have you ever tried sliding the flow control gadget of the 6045 once it's been in the water for a few hours? VERY bad design! and why are they so weak that you must pay 200$ to have something strong enough for a 75 gallons? I think that many of these so called legit companies have been giving us too little for too much and if they did spent money on design, they could have produce a good design at least. I am talking about the tunze.

The wp25 is not an exact copy of the Tunze, it is way better. So suit yourself and buy the inferior product if you wish. I won't.

They can sell them for cheaper because they use ultra cheap labour, and stole the design so they don't have any research and development costs to recover. If the judge in the lawsuit finds them guilty of patent violation than buying their pumps is no different than buying equipment from someone who stole it from a warehouse. Theft is theft; doesn't matter if you like Tunze or not.

What lawsuit. There is no lawsuit.
There was a letter. Thats all. As far as I know, thats where it sits today.
There is no infringment on patent, or this would have gone to court already.
Big dog barked. Thats it.
Buying from someone who stole it from a warehouse?? Please...

I was under the impression there was a patent proceeding in progress. IF there's a patent infringement and they've stolen the design, it's theft; that doesn't seem complicated to me.

I guess I'm probably an "old timer", although I wouldn't suggest not buying these. While I love my Tunze pumps, I'll probably buy a couple of these.

I think the term should have been "brand lovers". ;) I find "old timers" to be more practical in choosing things that "works" instead of just relying on the imprinted names.

No, there is no infringment. Do you honestly think tunze had the origional design? No, they modified a powerhead themselves, and have tried to stop other companies from using something similar.
Vortech on the other hand, there is a clear new design development.

If Tunze has sent out a letter, they feel there's an infringement. I couldn't find anything other then talk about the letter, and I really should be working... but at a quick glance it does look like just a cease and desist letter right now. Sometimes that's the prelude to legal action, sometimes it ends with the letter.

Regardless, to me it looks like they've ripped off Tunze's innovation and design; as far as I know, it is Tunze's design. Show me where someone had a powerhead designed like that prior to Tunze and I'll happily eat my words.

What about WP-40 VS MP-40, I wonder if Ecotech is cooking something up?

Big brands always send out letters whenever they sense any form of unavoidable competition ;)

There's no "proof" that jebao stole WP-40 from MP-40's naming style (although it' s obvious). A mere twist of naming should never be considered as "steeling". The vocabulary is limited but the imagination is not and that's where "coincidences" occur.

Maybe, just curious to see if they are cooking up something.

I don't think they will do anything. Ecotech's market is much bigger than just their powerhead. Jebao has not put any sort of mark on their product in terms of anything. And I think ecotech have already responded to it to some extend, by reducing their price a bit. A much better move than tunzi issuing a letter :razz:

I am buying a product sold legally by legit and reputable stores. Get your facts right. Not stolen equipment.

Ok maybe Old timer is the wrong choice. Brand Junkie? Im just sick if reading numerous forums (not just canreef) where people who have been in the hobby for a long time, provide information to newbies such as "You should only use Radion LED's because thats what I use and if you cant use those then nothing else will do"

Or even people reading other threads saying this "letter" is now legal action when its all just rumors floating around forums which have been twisted through the power of the internet into this big problem which its really not. But again because these people wont buy a cheaper product because they have to have the brand name. Then they end up projecting there own feelings onto it and twist it even further for the next guy to read even more false information.

Again just my $0.02

mike were would i buy a voltage reg