Ideas for LED supplementation
 

So I've decided that something needs to be done to bring back some lost color due to switching to LED. I've read threads elsewhere of people reporting the same thing with various brands, so it's more a technology limitation, and so far the only real fix I've found is going back to MH or T5.
But, has anyone come across any added light (UV, Violet, Red, etc) that has helped bring back lost colors? I know it's a limited number of people that have switched from a mature HM/T5 tank to LED, but what are your thoughts and experience with this?

I added red, green, NW, yellow and UV LEDs before I was happy with the color in my tank. I found the biggest issue related to white LEDs washing out many colors, adding the red and green LEDs will create a RGB color effect allowing to cut back on white output. This made the most dramatic effect, the UVs did nothing IMO.

Blue and White (especially cool white) are just not enough to create a good color spectrum for all coral color.

I am in the same boat. I ran 6 t5s and switched to 3 sol units and I still run 4 t5s to supplement the LEDs to get a look I want:cry:

Which bulbs?

sounds all very complicated :)

Fiji purple and some KZ actinic blue?

Anyone have any feedback on these??
http://www.modularled.ca/36-panorama-marine/

What light fixture are you using? Which white LEDs?

It's as complicated as you make it, you can purchase LED tube lights that will be no different than adding T5 lighting except you can strictly add just the colors you're looking for.

http://i00.i.aliimg.com/img/pb/868/4...478868_342.jpg

Adding T5s becomes counterproductive when you've already switched to LEDs, if you're tank is 6ft and you're running a large amount of LEDs you're looking at adding around 6 to 8 36" T5s to make a noticeable difference, that could be as much as another 300W of light plus bulb changes.

That will teach you to switch from the halides you vowed to never leave. :lol:

On a serious note, mine are also lightning up since adding my new led fixture. My SWC led, which is also just white and blue, was giving me good colour. Not sure if its because of more white as you guys say or what.

Even if I add the other led fixture back and run both, its still just white and blue I guess. May look at a strip like Steve mentioned.

Its really a limitation of the fixtures you bought not leds. The radions and Vegas provide full spectrum (at least closer to it) as they have more than blue and white leds. I am currently using all three and I can adjust the colors to be whatever I want.

Do you guys find your LEDS make the tank look dull campared to T5 and MH.:cry:

Nope, just finished reading the same results from Radion and Vertex owners. It's a LED thing, not an AI thing. One guy is going to try the new Mitras, but we'll see. Although even if those do the job, the price puts them out of my reach.

No, not really dull, and I love the color and shimmer, just that some corals, not all, have lost some color.

Yes, I'm starting to regret it. The LED have lots of positives, just not in the SPS color department :) Don't get me wrong, most of my corals are great, just not as great as they have been under Radiums!

I'm not buying that if I can adjust my radions to make my yellow tang red I'm sure I can make the corrals pop

Then you have better light tuning skills than the guy who posted, as well as the radion tanks I've seen in person. One of my "corals of concern" is also in a radion lit tank and has the same issues.
Sorry, while the Radion is a fantastic looking unit, it's not really any better than a Sol. Perhaps a bit different in spread vs. penetration, but that's it. Radion, SOL, Vega, Vertex, all reported to have the same deficiencies in SPS color production. Maybe the Mitras will make up for that, maybe not.
LED have a lot of great features, like I said, but they do not match a 400w Radium MH.

further on this, it isn't about making it look a certain color, it's about it being a certain color. My pink and blue milli was pink with blue, even out of the tank in daylight. Now it's a blue milli, no pink. you can blast all the red at it you want, and maybe make it (and the tang) look red or pink, but it isn't :)

Perhaps that was a bad example, I meant that I'm sure with the right program you could advice the spectrum you desire. Its just very time consuming to do this so most people don't.

I dunno, I see guys selling their LEDs to go back to MH or T5, you'd think they would invest the time to play first, as that's mostly free. But so far, I've yet to see a SPS tank under LED that matches a MH tank (given top end of both :))

But, we digress, this isn't a thread about justifying the extra money spent, just looking for someone that's had luck returning colors lost with LED, regardless of brand.

I apologize for hijacking. I think a time goes by you will see the full sps tanks like yours under the leds

I think the problem is that when you're coming from Radiums and in particular Radiums on SonAgro, you get totally spoiled and develop higher expectations!

I can't add anything useful to this discussion other than I'm disappointed to hear this, I was considering giving up on the halides (3 Radiums) because of the heat and humidity and in this shoulder season where it's not cold enough outside to run the HRV, it's putting my house into an awkward spot of excessive humidity. Now I'm thinking I'm just going to start cutting holes in the walls to the outside to increase the ventilation in the tank room and keep the darn Radiums! :lol:

I would :) BTW, I stopped running the SonAgro ballasts about 8 years ago, just been running e-ballasts. I'm starting to consider how i could vent the tank to get rid of humidity -lol

Oh I thought you were still on SonAgros. I have my middle on SonAgro still but the outside two are regular M137 or whatever they are (I forget now. The proper pulse-start ones that run them around 380ish watts.). To be honest after the first few weeks it's really hard to tell the difference anyhow, so I'm not sure there's any benefit other than to the power company. :)

Oh, absolutely! I think we'll see better LED options within a year or two, but for now, I don't think there is a suitable replacement for MH/T5 in a SPS tank. I think a LPS or softie tank may be fine, as coverage is nice, growth is exceptional and the overall color and tone is really beautiful, they're just missing something that SPS need for full colors.
My tank is still awesome and most of the colors are fine, just a few select pieces that lost some pizazz :)
Pink and blue milli is a gorgeous blue milli, I'd buy it in a heartbeat as such, but knowing what it was vs what it's become just bugs me a bit. If I can enhance it with some add on, great, if not, I'll live with it. Probably :)

I too have experienced the same with my LEDs. I have been trying to supplement my reds and picked up a couple of Ecoxotic RGB. The ones I picked up I cant find on the internet. I picked these up in Phoenix. They help a bit but not as much as i'd like so i'm getting a couple more. If I could I would run a couple of T5s, but I dont have that option as I dont have an inwall tank or run a canopy. It would look to cluttered if I was to go that route. I too agree that I have not seen colors with my LEDs as I have with running MHs or T5s. With a little tinkering with the settings on the Sols if I crank my blues and turn down the whites than the colors seem to pop better but than the tank looks too blue.

I solved my humidity problems by adding glass tops to the tank. My 300g tank now only evaporates 3-4 cups of water a day...... as an added bonus, I no longer need a heater in the tank and can maintain a temp of 78-82f with the metal halide lights and an open window in the fish room

I know I have asked you about these before, but can't find the thread, or maybe it was a pm?
So they are not like the one on modular site?
http://www.modularled.ca/rgb-panorama-pro-led-module/
http://www.modularled.ca/ecoxotic/
Rick

which LEDs are you using?
what colors are you missing?

Its all about knowing what wavelengths are going to bring out which colors. People using a cool white and royal blue combo will loose reds, oranges, pinks but their greens will explode.

check out the thread on full spectrum and OCW (Ocean coral white) LEDs.

If you are looking for color, thats the best place to check. Makes a huge difference.


FYI whoever is telling you its a technology thing is blowing smoke up your @$$. Light is light, it doesnt matter if its T5, MH, or LEDs. Its about the wavelengths. match the wavelength and locus of a MH with LEDs, its going to be the same light and will have the same effect.

But as the thread linked above will show you, MH are cookie cutter and you are stuck with their attributes. With a bit of testing (as the guys in that thread have done) you can take the right LEDs and the right ratios and produce some incredible colors in corals (AND FISH!)

Well I guess they are on there. It would be the RGB Panorama Pro. It does'nt mention the colors all that well or that they come with a remote control. I would assume the RGB stands for red green and blue but theres also a white. The only thing I dont really like about them is there is no built in timer or any means of ramping the intensity up or down automatically. I'm sorry I remember you asking how I was going to mount them. If you want I can PM some pics of how I mounted them or I can post on this thread. I'll wait until the OP chimes in as I dont want to hijack.

I have more 14K white then blue and colors are still very good even compare to 2x250W MH DE . Only one coral browned.
First I just had T5 HO actinics replaced by LED’s link below.
scroll down for pics.
http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...t=87189&page=4
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Now I’ve decided to replace 2x250W DE MH with 14K Whites & 470nm Blue LEDs.
My tank is SPS loaded and all SPS except one Pink bird nest are showing good color. Pink bird nest browned but polyp extention is much better under led.
The whole thing cost me slightly over $320. If people are interested i can let everyone know long tirm coral reaction.
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FTS
LED rig is covered by the black cover.
http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...ps590ae6d6.jpg

From below fixture
http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...ps3f145d63.jpg
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I have a dimmer so i can adjust 14K white LED's to any intensity.
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http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...psb8343769.jpg
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Fan cooled, fan speed is based on dimmer setting.

http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...psbbac15ab.jpg
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http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...psb566357c.jpg

LED rig
http://s381.photobucket.com/albums/o...ps62f9c248.jpg
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http://i381.photobucket.com/albums/o...ps46a875bc.jpg

sounds like right on topic :)

So to mount these I used coat hangers that I cut to put between the Sol modules and used picture frame hangers to hang these little Ecoxotic fixtures. It looks as though there is a red strip that is beeming down in to the tank, but it just looks like that on the mesh screen and not in the tank.

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...coxotic001.jpg

Here they are with the reds on:

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...coxotic003.jpg

And the reds off:

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...coxotic006.jpg

My settings on my Sols are at 15%White 25%Blue 35%Royal Blue in both pics.

There is alot of different color combos that can be used with these, here's a pic of the remote for an example:

http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/ecoxotic.jpg

That is one of the coolest things I have ever seen for fish tanks. It certainly helps to customize the lighting.

On a side note I suddenly want smarties :razz:


Brad, are you telling me you spent how much and you still need MOAR lighting??? :confused:

Brad, nothing wrong with the lights you got except they haven't caught up to the proper colors. so many out there are still using a cool white/royal blue combo which sucks for reds. the good DIY ones are using a combo of different whites, royal blue, regular blue, and true violet. some are adding green and red to thoes also, but in my opinion you only need the green and red if you are only using cool white, if you go to nutral white and warm white you get green and red in there spectrum.

the issue isn't the technology but rather the narrow spectrum of LEDs and not understanding this when you put a system togeather. your radium uses a combanation of all colors of light to make the 20K color, but you can get 20K from a royal blue LED just using the blue part of the spectrum, so no red or green. the lack of the other two colors is what will cause some others not to show up good.

you could probably add a strip to each LED that has two true violets, 1 red and one green to each light. put the green and reds on one dimmer and the TV's on another so you can just add as much as you need, problem is it won't be sync'ed with your lights you have now.

Pick Milad's ear with what you have and how to set it up. he is close to you and has realy been getting into the full spectrum side.

Steve

Brad I don't know if this has any relevance but I have a pink and blue millie that I got from a frag form Wendell (OA) years ago. I've had it under 250w 10k xms, radiums and 150w 10k ushio's. When it was high up in the lights, (xm's and radiums) it stayed pink and blue but when it was at the bottom of the tank and shaded, it went all blue, under the 150w light it was brown with blue tints. Right now it is under radiums and definitely pink and blue......I'm thinking you have a lower light situation, not really something you want to hear after spending money on leds but I can't help but think that 150 watts of light is the same no matter what kind of lights we use

Marie, I would agree only if the other corals around it were acting the same. But this one is right up under the light, maybe 6inches under waterline. I have a pink milli, same height on the other side of the tank, it's doing incredible, holding it's pink very well. I'm not saying lack of light isn't it though, because it was in the same spot under the 400w. And you're right, one SOL unit is not anywhere near a 400w MH bulb in intensity.

Sounds like I need to supplement the LED with MH bulbs :razz:

+1 to adding some supplemental LEDS... Check out the Ocean's White 3-up led and some violets

Aquattro

I have a brilliant idea for you....

How about you send over some frags and ill put them under a LED full spectrum build and in a couple weeks you can see if it makes a substantial difference to you...

That's not altogether a bad idea. Let me figure that out, and we'll see what we can do :)

I would of course purchase them off you. Just give me a good deal and pick the ones that are orange/red/pink that you feel arent giving their true color.