For those not using a dosing pump, but otherwise automated dosing thingamajig...
 

...what are you using? I'm trying to figure out the best option for a low-cost dosing automation. This will be a temporary fix until I can fork out the cash for dosing pumps. My calcium and alkalinity are fluctuating too much.

I've seen everything from Aqualifters to air pumps...whatcha got? :razz:

Maybe "low-cost" automation is too risky. I might just start mixing up my own 2-part (using reef products, not "raw" chemicals) if I can't figure out a decent wannabe dosing thingamajig.

Just trying to get some ideas to go on.

I went for the Aqua-lifter option on my 90g connected to a digital timer from Canadian Tire. I have been lifting the liquid from the container and dosing it through a gate valve over the tank :smile:

Not sure if it's the most reliable method :neutral: but it saved me the chore each day! until the timer failed...

I have ordered the twin doser for the new tank :Banane06:

S.

I run 4 aqualifter pumps so I can dose Ca & Alk into two separate tanks. Two timers set to run for 1 minute intervals on 1.5 hour intervals. Each dripline ends with an irrigation needle valve for drip control. Think I spent $15 each for the aqualifters. Everything else I already had.

The driprate is way more steady than I ever thought it would be. It's working out well, in fact, I pretty much have the needlewheel valves open all the way. I haven't tested yet this week to see where my Ca is at but I was debating switching the 1 minute durations to 2 minutes.

Hey, would you ever allow someone like myself to come see the setup. I too have been thinking about this, but am too scared to screw things up. Would love someone to show me the ropes.

Sure, there's not much to it, but you're totally welcome to check it out. Please promise not to laugh at the state of my basement. :redface: Shoot me a PM sometime, I'm down in Evergreen. I'll try to take a picture of it maybe but I have to find my camera's battery charger first.

I have tried all kinds of dosers including the Aqualifter pump, the best thing I have found is one of these recommissioned hospital IV peristaltic devices.

I found mine on Ebay but they are worth the money new. I use the device to feed my calcium reactor partnered with my reef controller controlling the PH inside the reactor. I do not have to fiddle with bubble rates, drip rates or anything.

If my ALK levels are off I just increase the ML per Hour or decrease depending on my test results. Easy as PIE!! Next to my controller this is the best purchase I made for my system in regards to water quality.

http://www.reefdosingpumps.com/produ...ges/Sentry.jpg

Any idea what brand and roughly how much ? You need to buy one for each solution of course too.

These are available from www.innovativeaquatics.com. You do not have to buy two, you just simply run the two channel tubing that is available, it does equal doses of two separate fluid simultaneously. They are well worth the money.

Ian

Two channel tubing.
http://www.innovativeaquatics.com/images/2-channel.jpg

I thought ca and alk are used in different amounts. Do you compensate for this by altering the concentrations of each solution?

For the most part in a prebalanced tank, you will add both at fairly close the same rate. You could always do a manual adjustment say once a week if there was drift in one of the parameters.

Having said that, I would prefer being able to add both independent of one another.

I know with the Masterflex peristaltic pumps (lab grade, very expensive, although the occasional good deal comes up on ebay .. also LittleSilverMax had at one point, one for sale, if anyone wanted one of these they should send him a PM) can have interchangeable heads to allow for different flowrates which basically involve different sized tubes or different diameters of the rollers). But the speed at which the rollers turn would be the same for each head so it's still not AS independently adjustable from each other that two seperate feed pumps would be.

Yes, as stated above, once the levels are adjusted manually they are supposed be dosed at equal amounts. The Randy Holmes two part mixture for calcium and Alk is calculated to replace the elements at the same levels they are depleted. I would not run two dosing pumps; however, you would want to make sure each tube that drips the elements are in a separate part of the system or sump.

Ian

If you look at the price of this pump (and I'm sure it's good) it's very evident how good a deal that 3 channel Profilux is. Not a low-cost solution. Just sayin'. I also want independent control.

I think my system will be jugs by the sump with the pump nozzles hanging over into the tank lol. Open the door, pump each however many times and DONE. For now anyways.

There's also Doug's system. I think he's patented the 'cup on a platform' technique. You could combine that with my jugs by sump idea. Pump whatever you need into your dosing cups (connected to each jug with tubing from pump nozzles) and it doses slowly in.

:lol: I don't know how serious you are with that but to be honest I quite like that idea!!! We can call it the BrettNDoug (pronounced "brettendug") method. Then, down the road when the calcium demands rise to to the point where more automation is preferred, you hire a student to pump the jugs on an hourly basis.

This must be one of the longest thread titles in Canreef history... :lol:

LMAO! I think the cup looks a touch ghetto but I actually might do something like that haha.

Hi Mindy I use the good old Kalk Reactor to supplment my Demand for CAL and ALK. I have it running with the Topp off too its tee'd from the RO/DI . the dripper runs 24/7 on a drip rate of 1 drip every 2 -3 sec's and it is keeping my levels perfect.

Thanks guys!

I'm trying to stay away from a doser for now - the whole purpose of this thread. :D I want to put a doser on the tank, but there are other upgrades that are required before that. Like an ATO. I need one of those badly.

I have considered a Kalk reactor, but it is not much cheaper than a doser anyway. I think I will probably just stick to manual dosing, but I should get my butt in gear and figure out daily dosing. Sigh...

Well there ya go. 3 head peri-style doser pump, Ca, Alk and topup. First two on timers or the pump controller if you have one like that, and the last one on a float switch. Done and done. Hey, I'm just looking out for you here.

PS. Or a 4 head, Ca, Alk, Mg, and topup.

The drip method is actually not my idea.....lets give credit where credit is due....I borrowed that idea from the sps master hiseff....Greg. He was dosing the 180 like that and the big tank for a while before he got his profilux....

We made a ghetto setup at the store...we used a couple small powerheads timed to come on for 1 minute and the flow rate is dialed in with a small inline ball valve.....we used a 10g tank for a holding tank divided in two by a baffle, Ca on one side DKH on the other....we still manually dose Mg.

I use the Profilux 3 pump doser. I'm only using 2 pumps for CA and Alk. Works really well. Havn;t had an issue at all with it.

J

So, Dosing with a doser is pretty much set and forget? Once you figure out how much your tank needs, set doser at that and periodically check levels???
I've only been adding Ca/Mg with water changes so far, but am starting to get some SPS so I guess I should be monitoring it more closely? I HATE doing them damn tests tho, so does the wife. :( Looking for less labour intesive way??

Ditto

This system is the cheapest, easiest and most stable system I have used in all my years of Reef Keeping.

My Cal is steady at 420 and my Alk is steady 8.00.

I also dose Mag however it only requires a single dosing once a week to keep my tanks at 1350.

Tom R

Alas you can't get away from doing tests. They suck, but prudence dictates you stay on top of your levels because you don't want to find out on the cusp of a tank crash (or just after) that a param has been drifting off for weeks.

So, testing sucks, but I suggest you do it anyhow at least once a week.

Other than that, yes, dosers and reactors are generally set-and-forget once you've dialed them in to your tanks consumption rates.

I still test every 7 to 14 days.

Tom R

ditto ditto.. exact same setup here. 3 pump profilux but only using 2 for alk and calc. Mag done manually once in a blue moon. I think the doser is probably one of my best tank investments I've made. Since dialing it in (Alk 8, Calc 420, Mag 1400), I have not had to touch the doser other than to refill the solution bottles. The stability comes in its ability to dose very little at a time and its precision.

I have no doubt that it's the one of the more stable and easy to use products but isn't it still .. um... several hundred dollars ?! :neutral: I don't see how that qualifies as "cheapest" sorry. MY method is just as stable, maybe not as easy to use, and cost me well under $100. I'm not saying you wasted your money, I just find it hard to accept that this is the "cheapest" solution.

TeeHeeHee

I just picked up a few aqualifters the other day to do something similar to what your doing. I had planned on using a few 1/4" john guest valves to control the drip rate but maybe I will look into the needle valve. Do you think its much different?

So far its cost a fraction of what I paid for a dosing pump earlier this year...which I sold before ever using.

I not sure if Tom meant the Profilux was the cheapest. But the dosing method is the cheapest in comparison to the equipment required when using a CA reactor

J

Yes he said it was the cheapest HE has used.

Ohhh. Ok, that makes sense then. Yes, far less investment heavy than a calcium reactor. And a calcium reactor is a whole new definition of fussy (at least when first dialing in and making steady-state).

PS. When I reread my post now it comes across a bit harsh .. wasn't meant to be and if anyone else feels it's harsh besides me then please accept my apologies. Posted in haste without adequate smileys to convey the appropriate silliness in my voice that would have been there had I been speaking the words not typing them.

Its ok Tony. I edited your post to make it sound not so harsh. :razz:

:lol: Thanks buddy. Er, I mean, giggle giggle thanks!

So, If I were to get a couple Aqualifters, what do I do with them?? LOL Kalc? or? So far Ive just used ChemMaster's crystals for my CA/Mg

You can use them to dose 2 part. Use 1/4" tubing and a 1/4" valve to control the drip rate. Then figure out how much you want to have dosed in a minute (unless you can find a timer that will do seconds). If you find one that does seconds, you probably don't need the valve. Once your dosing enough two part, you wouldn't need the valve anymore either.

Basically what I did today was run it with just water for 1 minute into a small measuring container, adjusting the valve until it puts out the amount I want in that minute. Got it to xx ml per minute and will have it turn on every 2 hours to dose this small amount throughout the day. Alternating alk and ca. So one hour is alk and then the next is ca.

I would be really careful with these pumps though and check them every once in a while. I use one for my ATO and it sometimes doesn't turn on when its suppose to.

They are not designed to do this really but we'll see how it goes.

They are great for a cheap ATO. Just need to get a float, splice the wires into one side of the aqualifter power cord. When the float drops to the bottom, it restores the circuit and turns the pump on, once the float rises, the pump shuts off. Im sure most people here know this but for those who don't (I heard ATO being mentioned before). It cost about $25 to do.

I wouldn't use the aqualifter for Kalk...I think it would clog up pretty fast. Even with two part, I would imagine the pump needs to be cleaned out with vinegar a few times a year to keep it running properly.

Yeah I'm worried about the clogging myself.

Pumping a few jugs is pretty easy. At least you know it gets done each day. You could devise rings to go under the plunger that corresponds to how much fluid you need? They stop the pump from being full stroke if need be.

I thought you'd probably want a couple pump strokes per addition? In which case it's more just counting the times rather than stopping it from full stroke?

With the Aqualifters for me about 6 months in, I find I haven't had any issues with the pump clogging, but my alk drippers in particular are gummed up. So the pump itself seems fine but I need to clean the valves up. The calcium ones seem totally fine.

I imagine that over time though that the pump would lose its ... um .. I don't know what word I'm looking for here. Vitality? They look just like air pumps to me. And air pumps just seem to weaken over time so I'm thinking the same thing will happen sooner or later.

What is this "pumping of jugs" you speak of?

Maybe you're not old enough to understand 2-part dosing Justin =)

OK, Thx, I got timers that can run Miliseconds :D

That's great then. Makes everything even easier and less chance for things to clog or go wrong.

Can I ask where you got them?