miracle mud
 

Hi everyone! im just wondering if anyone has tried using miracle mud before and what were there thoughts on it.

Thanks Daniel

well now i found another thing called mineral mud not sure witch one to get so if anyone has tried either of them or know anything about them it will be very helpful

Thanks Daniel

There has been a fair amount of back and forth on this stuff on the web.

My guess is you are just as well to make a DSB with aragonite sand, I like the oolitic or sugar sized. And dose your water with iron. Iron is the key if you are growing macro-algae.

Here is a link on mud for you, if you scroll down you will see a post with lots of links to deep sand bed info:

http://www.reefsanctuary.com/forums/...send-scam.html

Stay away from any product that has "Miracle" on the lable.:lol:

Thanks for the info and the articles they were very helpful. So I decided on going with a DSB instead, and mixing the sugar sized sand with the size up from that.:biggrin:


Thanks Daniel

Ya i think your right lol. Just going to go with the DSB instead.

Thanks daniel

I was going to do the mircale mud thing in my refuge, but chose the deep sand bed, so I did 6-8 inches in the refuge with 2 different layers of different sized arragonite and this added a bit of live arragonite to the top... Over time I also now have about 50 or so lbs of live rock in there with it and can say I am glad I went that route.

Miracle Mud is very popular in Europe, particularly Germany. Not so much over here. Maybe they know something we don't?

I have read that the iron content in these products seems to get depleted in a year or two, rendering the 'mud' relatively useless. A DSB and iron dosing would seem to be a better, more permanent option (though if you're going to dose with iron, be aware that the test kits are terribly inaccurate, and you'd be best to keep a close eye on your livestock and algaes).

Miracle mud works although there is nothing that is a miracle about it. I actually use the Walt smith Fiji Gold in my refugium simply because it harbors critters that you don't see in a DSB or even a SSB. I notice that I get more pods and better macro growth with it. If I lightly stir the mud I notice huge polyp extension with the SPS in my tank in a matter of minutes.

You couldn't pay me enough to install DSB, I don't recommend ever using one as they are a ticking time bomb, I know this from personal experience and from doing lots of reading. DSB's work great for a few months or years but then become super saturated and or maxed out. If you do use one make sure you set it up as a remote DSB so you can change it out whenever you want or when you notice it isn't working anymore.

Once the bed is super saturated and or clogged it tends to release the built up nutrients back into the water column. The most success I ever had using a sand bed (currently bare bottom) was by employing a Plenum. You can research Plenums by checking out the GARF website or just doing a simple search.

One of the most successful long term reefs I have read about actually uses a revers flow under gravel filter system, the reef has been going strong for 37 years.

I simply use a bare bottom display now with a small remote mud refugium for pods, skim heavy, and use Zeovit, the tank seems very healthy.

Just my 2 cents.....

Ian,
have you got any photos of your "small remote mud refugium"? I don't recall seeing it. It does sound interesting - especially the harbouring of various small critters. Hmmmm

Richard,

You have not seen it yet, I have only had it set up for a couple months. I bought a CPR HOB refugium and loaded it with Fiji Gold and Macroaglae, the pod production is insane. The macro does not grow very well due to the Zeovit and lack of nutrients but it still provides a great home for all of the critters.

When you come over next I will give you another tour! :lol:

Thanks for all the info everyone its been very helpful :thumb:

they are a ticking time bomb
x2 !

If you want to go the route of a DSB look up remote DSB, basically a DSB in a bucket that you can change out when it becomes loaded.

I'll be the one to defend the DSB, mine is going on 9 years and the bomb must have been diffused buy MacGyver when I wasn't looking. I do not have undesirable algae growing in my display. I think proper flow and direction of flow are major contributors to success with a DSB. A good scavenger crew is also a important. I also run DSB in my refugium with fiji mud added. My setup is not a anomaly. Unfortunately the conclusion to many problems people have in this hobby is blamed on DSB, When the real problem is mismanagement and improper setup of DSB

What is walt smith figi gold and how is it used?
I have no refugium..bare bottomed 120 gal with lots of live rock and a very cramped sump (no room for extras in that).

If I were to set up a refugium:
(1)what size
(2)can one use the "plastic" hydroponic containers rather than an aquarium
(3)how does one use the figi gold or other base mterial suggestions
(4)can you purchase a "return system" to hang on he back of your tank so you don't run the risk of flooding the refugium if the pump in it stops..or do you simply run it from a return stack so that the safety margin is built in with the stack
(5) what size return pump is common and what type is least destructive to pods
(6) what type of lighting does one use
(7)what does one grow in it to lower phosphates/nitrates, balance pH and cultive pods

Thanks for any input from those using a refugium.

??can you have a happy tank if you never have a fuge?

I run the same system as "miracle mud" but using the "mineral" mud. I have been doing so for several years without any problems. My nitates and phosphates remain undetectable without a skimmer and coral growth and health seems good. When you run the system you must change out half the mud substrate on a yearly basis. If you go to the miracle mud website, they will send you free info and a DVD expaining the system.