Puffer eating clownfish
 

Well here is another reason not to buy mature fish from you LFS...

In all my research I read that puffers ate inverts, but never saw anything about mouth sized fish. However I know its a no brainer since most fish will eat anything they can fit into their mouths.

My false Percula is gone. I got up this morning and saw the male was missing, and the female is being patiently hunted. My maroon clown is much bigger but Griff is hunting for her all well. I know if he can nab her, he will. I soaked a prawn in garlic, chopped it up like Justin said to do, and he ate. However he is still hunting my clowns. He has great interest in my Damsel and man I wish he would catch that little jerk. I would not be sad.

I feel like I have a bad dog that just ate my shoes... I'm a little mad, but there is nothing I can do about it now. At least with a dog you can scold them...I feel awful for my male clown and keep hoping he shows up alive and in one piece. I see no trace of him anywhere, and expected to see pieces or something. I have seen Griff eat his prawns which are cut into bite sized pieces, and there is all sorts of scraps and carnage. I checked my overflows and sump and nothing indicates the fish was eaten. However his

I want to keep Griff and do not think Wai's would take him back. I did tell him what types of fish I had, and he never said a large puffer would eat them. I asked. So here I am a silly newbie with a rather large puffer that eats my fish. I figured he would back off the clowns when I fed him, but he really enjoys hunting I see. If I can catch the clowns before he does, I will have to rehome them.

He loves the rock wall at the back and does get my snails. He scoops them in his mouth and spins them around. I am not sure if he is sucking them out or not. I was preoccupied with finding my clowns. So this guy will accept prawns but he would much rather eat live fare. It makes sense to me that he would since he was already mature when he was caught.

Any advise on what I can try to do or live fish I can feed would be a great thing now. I really wanted some sand sifting fish for this tank but it may not be an option since this guy is so big.

I sure learned a lot from this one fish already, sigh. Too bad the clowns really do not take him that seriously and he almost gets them every time. I'm sure my male was slow to move and that was it. I have the rest of the week off but I can't stand here and try to scoot him off all the time. He is a slow swimmer but he is very patient, I know he will win. I have no clue how I will catch the clowns myself since I am not that patient or quick.

Sorry to hear about your clowns. I have to disagree though about him being like a bad puppy who ate your shoe and needs to be scolded :lol: Well actually I guess your kind of right but IMO its different. I know you already understand this but he came from the ocean at a decent size and his instincts are going to be much stronger than a baby porc (another reason big fish sould not be taken from the ocean). He grew up as an opportunistic predator who had to eat when he got the chance. If he ever found "tame" clowns in the ocean who did not try hard to swim away, there was no way he was going to leave them alone because he had already eaten a few prawns. They are eating machines! :mrgreen:

I feel really bad for you and really, really hope this doesn't change how you feel about Griff. In your PM to me I got a good feeling about how much you care for this fish and obviously want whats best for him. Being that he was taken from the ocean at such a big size, he deserves a good home in a big tank like yours. If you take him back, he will most likely end up in a smaller tank. You really can't blame him for doing what he knows he has to do to stay alive. He will slowly loose the instincts to a degree and actually get somewhat lazy, only ever waiting for you to feed him. Eventually only you and the prawns you offer him will register as food to him.

I have had the exact same thing happen a few years ago. I had a nice pair of black and white clowns in a 180G and added a 6-7" Mappa Puffer. He hit the water, swam about a foot and came across the female clown. One bite and she was gone infront of my eyes. The male soon followed. Then my goby, damsels (there is hope there) and every other small fish was eaten over the next few weeks. After about 6 months or so though I tried some damsels again and he never killed anymore. They were my clean up crew. I think mine was another case of a decent sized fish being taken from the ocean and the problems it can lead to. I have had several puffers since then but bought all of them around 2-3" and not one has ever killed another fish.

Please give him a chance. He really isn't bad, just doing what he knows. He will make a great PET, unlike most fish. I know your an avid dog lover and this is as close as it gets with fish! There is a reason they are called Aquatic Puppies.

Can I recommend you add a trigger fish or two? Ideal tankmates for puffers and just as much personality as puffers. I would go with a pair of Blue throats in your tank or a Niger. Stay away from the overly aggressive ones like Clowns, Queens or Titans. Pink Tail is another great choice. If you want to get really expensive a single or pair of Crosshatches would be ok in your tank. A 260G is just enough for Crosshatches I think.

Also look into a bigger species of tang (not too big of course) and maybe a grouper to finish the tank off. Be careful with the grouper though because you don't want to end up with one that gets too big for the tank!

Good luck!

Both large puffers were probably hungry as well, since an LFS is less likely to feed them well compared to what you or I would do at home. Yes, they were also used to eating anything that they can catch in their mouths.

I was lucky that the bigger puffer was only 3.5-4" when I bought it for Irene & so it adapted to eating frozen and freeze dried foods fairly easily, with only a couple of casualties (2 slow clowns as well). However, since then, the two puffers have been model citizens, leaving all my other fish alone.

Clowns are slow swimmers so if you have a net ready when you feed some floating foods, you might be able to scoop it out when the last clown comes up to eat.

Anthony

Yup another great point...LFS don't feed puffers well enough usually.

I remember J&L (who I think do feed them well actually) had a Starry puffer that started eating all the dwarf lionfish. I think they said he ate like 3-4 in a few days.

Don't worry Justin, he is staying. It's my fault that I brought him home and I learned a big first hand lesson. I know its not his fault, but why can't he catch the stupid damsel fish. I hate that guy, and Griff would be off my poop list. I will have to figure out how to catch the remaining clowns and rehome them. I just hope he doesn't get my Mandarin goby, I would be beyond ****ed. Skipper is my little elusive buddy. The purple dartfish has no worries since he can vanish in a split second. My anemone died so the clowns can't even hide right now. Mind you, I see pufferes housed with lionfish getting strung constantly. I am sure he would eat the anemone too... He would probably laugh at its sting.

The two remaining clownfish seem to be more savvy to Griff now. It is like a National Geographic show in my tank. Griff LOVES to hunt, and I am sure he will settle down eventually. At least he has a hobby now, instead of gazing out the window all day.:smile:

What can you do... he is a wild animal and it is to be expected. I am glad I didn't see the clown get eaten, that must have been awful to watch knowing how they eat. I think I would rehome every other fish before bringing Griff back to the store. I just hope I can find fish from fellow members so I know they care about the fish and not selling it.

He is leaving Cash the purple tang alone so my husband is fine. I might get what I wanted in the end... a tank FULL of puffers.:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

He is so darned cute with that perma smile, how could I bring him back. He looks so happy hunting the rock wall, and the clowns are brightly coloured like krill.

BTW... You should move to the forest in Bragg Creek, you can get 2-4 acres and a nice big house for about what you were going to pay for a condo pout in Vancover... bring my dogfaced puffer with you. He already has a name.:wink:

Gryphon is about 8-9" long. I am not sure how much bigger he will get from here. I find my clowns can shoot off like a bullet when they needc to. They are brutal to catch and with all the rocks and rescaping I did last night, I will never catch them. They seem to know better now though.

I have to say watching Gryphon hunt is amazing. He pretends to be doing something else entirely and then scoots over to the clowns. The damsel keeps messing with him, and Gryphon is focusing on him for now. I would pay him to get the little jerk.

Yeap puffers definitely eat fish, I use to feed mine goldfish :mrgreen:

Do they die when you put them in salt water? I would guess that would be "yes". He really loves to hunt but most fish would be hard to catch. The clowns and dartfish are fine now, but they probably won't sleep at night for a LONG time. Gryphon really has it out for the damsel fish but that won't be happening anytime soon. The damsel is way bigger then the clowns so I shudder at how he will eat it if he gets a lucky shot.

How do you feed them goldfish? I better not be getting any orange fish after that as well.

Well he almost got the maroon clown he is much faster then I gave him credit for... I love having my desk beside the tank I don't miss much.

Please do not feed freshwater fish to saltwater predators. It is one of the worst things you could feed a puffer. The only time I would ever feel the need to try this is with something like a angler fish who will absolutely only eat live foods. Guppies would be the choice though, not goldfish. Puffers will eat frozen foods. They do not need to hunt. Yours is already eating prawn, so you are lucky. Keep him on a good diet. Try as much different fresh but frozen sea foods as you can. You can buy them fresh but make sure you freeze them. You never know what nasty parasites are on fresh foods. Then thaw them in vitamins and feed.

Don't get you puffer in the habit of eating freshwater fish for no reason. It will lead to a shortened life. Freshwater feeders lack HUFA's(highly unsaturated fatty acids) which are vital to marine fishes diet. Live freshwater feeder fish can also have a variety of diseases and infections that can lead to infections in your puffer. Very bad idea. Try to stick to their natural diet if possible. I highly doubt if a wild puffer has ever eaten a goldfish ;)

Remember your trying to keep things are natural as possible for your puffer. Try to get some mussels, clams and maybe some squid.

I gave 2 three striped damsels to my friend who has puffers, triggers and lion fish. I warned her they were elusive evil little buggers, she warned me they would probably be lunch. I believe (and her puffers had eaten other small fish before) after 4-5 months all that happened with the damsels is that they would pester her trigger! She ended up rehomeing them, I don't know what'll happen with your damsel but it might live for awhile yet!

Thanks again Justin. I wondered about feeding freshwater fish to a puffer. Once I get the clowns into my refugium he will just have to eat what I give him. Its just too bad it got broken when the hole was being drilled. I have to wait a couple of days for the silicone to dry. I may not even be able to catch them, but Gryphon probably will. I am sure that damsel fish will outlive me the little jerk. He was a good fish until he got moved into the 260g. He keeps Gryphon busy though.

I've been trying the prawns with garlic (wish I had some of them for dinner myself), but he laughs at me. Clownfish must be pretty tasty.

What did he eat though? I thought he was eating prawns?

They'll live for about 30min in saltwater. The puffer I had was quick and persistent when he wanted to be, it really was surprising and pretty cool.
I just put the gold fish directly in the tank, about 2 min later they were gone and the tank would be full of gold flakes :biggrin:

It was just for fun, not regular diet. He never gave up eating regular food either. If I didn't sell the tank I would still have him.

By your reasoning you shouldn't even keep puffers or any fish, which is crueler? I mean the worst thing you can really do to a puffer is take it out of the ocean not feed it freshwater fish.

He did eazt the first night I had him, some prawns and krill. Yesterday he was not too interested in anything I gave him. Today he had a clownfish and he did eat half a garlic prawn, but refused anymore. He is hunting and is really enjoying himself. I will try again in awhile to give him his prawn. I did what you said with the feeding stick and after ten minutes we both got tired of my antics. He went to his tunnel and I had to change my shirt. A tank that is 30" deep sucks to do anything with.

Give me a break...you know exactly what I mean. :rolleyes:

Why would you take it from the ocean AND feed it a horrible diet?

You said you used to feed your puffer goldfish, not that you used to give him goldfish treats. Either way its wrong and when someone is relatively new to the hobby don't give them advice like that unless your clear about it.

ahah ahah I was really curious to see this thread "Puffer eating clownfish"

I thought that somehow your clownfish liked eating puffers... ahah so needless to say I'm a little disappointed

I for 1 dont blame you at all.....I blame the person who sold you the fish. Wouldnt have happened in our shop. You would have been asked what other fish you had and what you planed to keep it with. Then you would have been informed of most everything you are being told here. If you were intent on buying the fish at least your decision to do so would have been an informed one.

Never really thought about Puffers eating fish until I read this post today and was a little surprised. Now out of nowhere the wife just calls and asks if I want a Puffer for my tank (which has damsels, clowns and chromis) as her co-work is thinking about getting rid of one. Talk about timing.

It really depends on the size and where it came from. Most puffers will not seek out fish to eat from your tank. I think its just more common with larger specimens that have just come from the ocean.

I have kept many puffers over the years (12 years of puffers including freshwater and brackish) and only had that one mappa ever eat live fish form the tank.

For example I would be extremely shocked to hear of a dogface eating tankmates. They are one of the most gentle puffers you will come across. They do eat most inverts and some coral though.

My puffer is a very large fish whom spent his life in the wild until recently. He hunted on the reefs and now that he is in my 260g, he feels he is on a reef again. I was a little upset, but I have no regrets in buying him. He came form a reef, was stuffed in a small empty store display tank, and then came to my husband's work of art. I am happy he feels so comfortable that he wants to hunt like in the old days. If I can catch the clowns before he does, I will be rehoming them. He is the mostawesome fish and it is great to watch him behave like a wild fish. He constantly changes hunting methods and is always thinking. I read they are very inactive fish, but he used every single inch of this tank and checks out every nook and cranny for food. He made this tank build worth while.

I will never go to that store again. I usually don't but hubby had to pick up pipe fittings and that was the only place that had them that he knew of. He saw Gryphon, and knew I would love him. I asked many questions and asked if my other fish were safe. I was going to go with a smaller puffer, but this guy seemed so special, not only due to his size. His colouring, eye brightness and general health far surpassed any of the others.

Shoot me a PM and let me know what store you are from...

From the sounds of it, he is acting quite natural in your tank and that is a great thing. Porcs do tend to be inactive in general but it depends on the individual. They are usually nocturnal but not always. When diving in Trinidad last year we encountered many porcs and they were all awake in the daytime exploring. They would actually come right up to you and check out what you were doing. They would not quite get within arms length but pretty close. I wasn't too thrilled when our guide grabbed one but it never inflated and didn't seem to mind everyone petting it. It must have been about 13" and much wider/thicker than any I have ever seen in a tank.

LOL...they are so easy to catch. They are slow but its not even that. They seem to be very curious about people and not too fearful. I think the ones we saw see people quite often though. There was a grouper who knew people will feed him...he was a pain following us around begging for food :)

Well this guy was up probably most of last night, the entire day, and now his hunting strategy is to sleep right besdie the clownfish's coral that she is hosting. I put argonite in the water before lights out so he looks like a ghost with a mask in the murky water. His tail is hardly an inch away from the clown and he appears to be napping. NO fish has ever entertained me like this guy. Ed my older foxface was a smart guy due to his age, and this guy is no different. People whom think fish are stupid don't know what they are talking about. I wish I knew how old he was, the store said 18 months (how do they know honestly?), I already worry about his lifespan.

I would like to get a few small crabs to keep him busy perhaps. I will be really surprised if this clown makes it through the night. I wish I could catch her darned it.

For live crabs, let your LFS know that you want them so that when they get in a shipment of live rock, they can save you the hitchhikers in the cooler box. The LFS around here usually get 5-10 at least every shipment, if not more.

Being on the coast, my wife & I like to drive out to the shore & pick up some live shore crabs under the rocks at low tide.

Anthony

IMO that's a bit of an over reaction. Puffers and triggers have more individual differences than other fish and that makes it difficult to give advice in this situation. They also have moods.

I've kept many different types of puffers over the years and the only thing I know for sure is that you never know what they are going to do. My Green Spotted puffer killed 6 blue damsels overnight once but never touched another fish in the 12 years I had him. Porcupine puffers are even more moody, I used to maintain a tank that had a 12" one who was a model citizen until he decided to tear a fire clown in half one day. He never did it again.

I wouldn't be surprised if you porc never killed another fish, they aren't naturally Piscivores. I wouldn't be surprised if it did though.

my2rotties;
I have just read this thread through and am sorry to hear about your unfortunate circumstances.
On another note puffers are so much fun to watch and feed and they have SO much personality, congrats on your purchase.
As far as the "I will never go to that store again." the responsibility is ultimately on you to research your purchase. LFS's should give you responsible advise but in the end it is your decision.
We have a Spiny Puffer that a customer had purchased in town when it was very small but as it grew; fish in his tank started to disappear. So if you are interested in a tank of puffers we have an excellent one that can be hand fed ( but will eat anything that will fit in it's mouth) for a very good deal.
Kevin

I think you should maybe go back to the lfs and talk to Danny. I have taken creatures back to him before that did not work out in my system and was given straight-across store credit for them. Just FYI I am sure he would be willing to do something for you.

I've also exchanged something at lfs and they generally seem pretty good about it "as long as it doesn't happen all the time"

Take it back??? So he can tell someone else to put it in with their clownfish??? Customers of LFSs unite. Dont deal with stores that give crappy advice....period.

For entertainment my friend, the same reason I setup and anyone else sets up a saltwater tank, not because its the humane thing to do. And like I said it wasn't the diet.

I never told anyone to feed their puffer anything, I simply made the point that puffers will most certainly eat other fish which seems to be related to the topic. So I'm not sure why you would say what I said was wrong?

Hopefully the next person will be smart enough to do there research (not that I always do)

Yeah I guess the point was that they eat goldfish... not that Goldfish are healthy.

I also see how this could be misinterpreted to make it seem like Goldfish are a good diet but I don't think that was the point.

At the end of the day I think you both make good points that aren't conflicting.

sphelps: It's cool to see a puffer eat a fish from time to time and gold fish are cheap.

greenspottedpuffer: Goldfish are not a quality food source for a puffer.

haha, peacekeeper. Well done.

I did my research on puffers, but until you have a problem you don't really know what to look for. It is my fault for buying the fish BUT I asked many questions. Danny is a businessman he has bills to pay and told me what he could. He has hundreds of fish but he said he had this guy for at least two months. Having a fish that long I would think you would know a bit about him. I know a lot about this puffer and I have only had him three days...

My big deal with shopping there is just the ethics of bringing in mature reef fish from the wild. He has gorgous corals and beautiful fish... I just think when you are in the best interest of the animals you sell for a living, you would care for their well being. The 16" tang can hardly turn around in his tank. I was told the other one like him went to a 180g tank and that was enough for him... I look at my seven foot wide 260 and think that fish would suffer in what I have. If people, special order these fish that is one thing. For a fish to be stuffed in a little display until some person buys them is another...

If I had the $300 for that fish that night I would have bought him because I feel sorry for him. I would have brought him home and felt sorry for that fish for all the days he managed to eek out a life in my little tank. When we build our tanks, we want joy out of them not sadness. I am glad I posted about it and I am glad others feel as I do. I do not blame Danny but he does have bills to pay... You open a store to make money, support your hobby and make a living out of doing what you love to do. There are other store I have been to where the people honestly care about the fish. They have nothing to lose because if that fish dies they are not out any money at all.

My puffer will always be here, I know I could exchange him for other fish, but he is so happy here. To have a wild fish hunting and doing what he was doing on the reef, means I have succeeded in making him comfortable. He is not a big fish in my tank although he looked gigantic at Danny's. He fits right in, and now I know I need to buy mature tank raised fish that outgrew their owners smaller tanks. I would feel much better about that since the owners care for the fish, and they will be so happy to see them in my tank. I am a newbie BUT I do whatever needs to be done for my fish.

The two clownfish made it through the night, so perhaps others are right... he won't eat another one. He is a very patient hunter though and he might still get his way. He is very fun to watch and I have been neglecting other things in my house gawking at him. I know I made the right choice even though I paid way too much for him. I know if I bought any other I would always think of him.

Talking about ethics and bringing in large fish, you would be surprised how often retailers receive fish they didn't order. Retailers usually have to order direct rather than through wholesalers to compete with competitors and get a better variety of stock. The problems associated are usually related to poor communication capabilities. For example, sometimes you order a "large" tang and you'll get a 6" tang, another time you'll get a 16" tang. And sometime you'll get something you didn't even order and probably never would. There simply just isn't as much control as some might think or hope for.

Unfortunately it's more complicated than just blaming retailers, in the end we the hobbyists are to blame.

I still think you're in the wrong hobby based on a lot of your threads and posts

Well he said he paid way more for the bigger fish because only one fish would fit in the styrofoam crates they ship in. So I figured he had ordered the larger fish since he had to pay more to ship them. That is according to what he said.

I got into the hobby since my foxface and his tank were left in the house by the previous owners.

I feel that I am in the right hobby and any fish that lives in my tank (unless you are clownfish), will have the very best of everything.

Just because I chose to pursue this hobby further does not mean I condone suffering and depletion of the reefs due to poor ethics. Large fish should not be allowed to be caught as they are future generations that will breed and provide more fish for reefs and hobbists alike. Large fish have lived long enough to be fit and healthy, they deserve a chance. If we take these fish away from reefs the weaker fish will breed and weaken the future genrations. Have you not seen what has happened to the Cheetah in Africa?

I have hiked the Bow and Elbow river a million times and seen fish and wildlife monitering fishermen to make sure the small fish are not being kept so they could contribute to a new generation of fish... why is there no laws for reef fish? The larger fish have reproduced and finished the circle of life already. Yes I am contradicting what I am saying by that statement, but mature river fish will not be put into tanks for the rest of their lives. If stores had ethics and I am not saying most do not, they would not want to buy large mature fish. If the demand for these fish was not there, nobody would be catching them, would they? The way they get caught is deporable and at least I am now aware of it, and want to see changes. It does not mean that I hate the hobby. It means that if people are aware and care, maybe we can make a difference in how things are done. Look at the shark fin industry? It makes me sick and something needs to be done. If governments did something about it, maybe change would happen. If enough people speak out maybe it would happen. If we comply no better comes of it...

Because I am a newbie I make a point to ask questions to to others with knowledge and experience. Even if those questions are contraversal in nature. I believe we must speak for those that cannot speak for themselves.

Just because my feelings may be different to others opinions, does not mean I would push my views onto them. However I will always ask the questions since they need to be asked.

I love this hobby and love the people I have met on these forums. I am a newbie but that does not mean I am not entitled to have my own views and opinions. I have no hard feeling for being called out on this matter since rebuttal teaches all parties different views and ways of thinking.

I have a friend who is a retailer and I agree with Steve on this one. It seems that at least one fish per shipment is wrong. Anything from the wrong species to the wrong size or even one he didn't order at all. Thankfully he hasn't received any 16" fish yet. :smile:

:lol: That made me chuckle.

Hope your new puffer makes the trip from BC safely and enjoys his new home.