Why the hell do my sps keep dying
 

I've been keeping fish and softies for a loooong time so by no means am I new to this. My water parameters are 100% perfect,i've dumped thousands into equipment to rectify this with no luck. What gives? every piece of sps ive ever put in my system has died within 2weeks,the polyps are fully extended and colors are beautiful then the next day im left with no more than a skeleton. Could I have a parasite or bacteria and what can I use to fix it if I do? I've started dosing with coral snow yesterday because I was told it would break down possible harmfull acids,aside from that I just dose the usual suplements. I keep beautiful fish and used to keep beautiful softies in the same system and never had a problem with anything other than sps.....all species of sps. PLEASE IM DESPERATE I have too much into this to walk away now

no disrespect but '100% perfect water' doesnt tell us much. we need to know

CA
mg
po4
no3
alk
salinity
temp
what type of test kits are you using

those stats would be a good start. then we need to know all your equipment
that you are using. what size tank is it? what type and size of softies do you have? if the tank is too small and your softies are large they may be attacking your sps if they are in close proximity. i would quit dosing until you know exactly where your water parameters are. sps are not impossible to keep, they are just picky sometimes.

What is your mag at? And do you still have softies in the tank and if so are you running carbon?

water parameters would help. system info like lighting, filtration, what you dose and if you test for it etc etc. just the fact that they're kicking the bucket isn't enough for us to help in any way.

Ok but im sure you allready know what good parameters are but here we go...
75gal single overflow,35gal sump inlet baffle and outlet baffle stuffed with lr pieces,euroreef 120,phosban,phosban with carbon,2x250mh with 2 96wpc,2 koralia 1's,nano koralia,115lbs lr,deep sand bed....thats my equip

Livestock is naso,ocelaris,green spot dragonet +cuc

Parameters are phos.0,nitrate0,nitrite0,ammonia0,cal450,ph8?it was right,temp82,sal1.022,alk10dkh and I've never tested for mag.

I dose trace elements,cal,phyto and zeo

test kit is professional grade test tube style

I've never had to dose for ka my water changes keep that in check 10% every3 weeks with instant ocean

and no softies anymore

all sps were given 12'' away from any other coral

Im stumped I've tried on and off to keep sps for about 2 years allways the same result but only in this system,could it be parasite or bacteria? and what can I do?
P.s no cyano i system but some hair algae on back wall for tang

Check your REDOX potential

Alk at 10 is way to high with the zeo system. 8 is the highest it should be.

how old is the system? I admit I am not familiar with zeo, so here's me dropping out of the conversation :)

SG of 1.022? How was it measured?

The only things that jump out at me on your parameters is the low salinity (I would recommend 1.025 or 26 and due to the fact you have not tested for Mag. Here is an article that might help.
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-07/rhf/index.php
Kevin

Kevin I disagree with the low salt in the water, I know of some
pepole that have a 1.22 tank and their SPS is awesome, I keep mine at 1.023 and i have no problems keeping SPS. if your MAg is really low then that could be the problem , but if you are doing water changes every 3 weeks then you are probably getting enough Magnesium. unless you are dosing KALK at a high rate which would cause the Magnesuim to drop

Not disagreeing with low salinity tanks, Ive seen them too, but it would explain the short time before the OP's sps all died. I can almost guarantee wherever he gets his corals from, the tanks there are not kept at 1.022; most lfs keep their tanks at the same salinity most reefers target: 1.025 (give or take a bit). the rapid jump to 1.022 is enough to kill a coral imo. I also have to aske how it was measured; hydrometer? refractometer? calibrated or not for either?

+1

The SG of 1.022 jumped out at me. I'd venture to guess that SG was derived using a hydrometer which would make the reported value more spurious. And if the only flow you have in a 75g tank is 2 Koralia 1's and a Koralia Nano then you have really insufficient flow for SPS.

dabandit,

I'd suggest you take some time to be more specific when reporting the details of your tank (i.e. what test kits are you using to come up with your reported parameters) and to post a picture of your tank. A bunch of reported parameters often doesn't provide as much information as a picture can. If you have hair algae growing for your tang then you can guarantee you don't have 0 phosphate and you likely don't have 0 nitrate.

Also, how long has the tank been set up and how long has the DSB been set up?

when you are adding the corals are you starting low in the tank? how about the age of the bulbs?

Actually Justin one of the bigger places in the City I won't name his place, only for and not bashing his store. He keeps his tanks at 1.021 Doug can jump in on this one. I know all the time that I would get home and test the water I keep mine at 1.025 as most of us will ,but he will always say, after 3 of us will test of refractormeter ours are wrong and his is right.:lol: So you think lot s of LFS would do the proper thing but any thing to save a few bucks in salt.. ya Inreference to you stating the big jump in Salinity I always check the bag before addding any water in the bag I trust no one...

I can't seeing the Low ORP if he has a over flow and the water is travelling down any huge water movement the orp is going to be up some what. I can't see that the
alk is that bad lots of Reactors are pumping out 10-11 DKH out for reactors. HOw are the SPS dying in the tank are they dying from the top down or the bottom up.... so you have any nudibranches in your tank that you dont know about that are eating the SPS

The first thing that jumped out at me was the lower specific gravity, but it sounds like this would be something more devastating.

Have you tested for copper?

I can't seeing it being copper Since he has a tank full of Softies or Is it still full of softies. And for the Record I can't see how a low salt of 1.022 would make that much of a difference, Heck I have kepted my tank at 1.022 before with no effectsd its hasd to be somthing.

1. Please define "SPS" - can you keep digis and montis alive at least?

2. Low SG may not be the sole reason, but bumping it up a bit would not hurt.

3. Check your Mg - it's just as important as Ca and Alk

4. Increase your flow - 2x K1 and a K-nano isn't much for SPS in your sized tank.

You're assuming 1.022 is an accurate measurement. How many times have you seen someone report a low SG like that only to find it was measured with either a hydrometer or a poorly calibrated refractometer? If it was measured with a hydrometer it could be closer to 1.019 or it could be considerably elevated. Hence the reason it's important, firstly, to find out how these parameters were tested.

But I still think the flow is way too low and I would be surprised if phosphate and nitrate weren't elevated (despite the 0 values reported from testing) given the report of hair algae growing. I'd still like to see a picture of the tank.

YEs I picture would be alot better to see what the tank is looking like as of now

Could be contaminated salt....

With a Ca of 450, chances Mg is okay (from a observation with low Mg, I'm unable to get my Ca up).

Source water?

Ok where do I start;I dont dose ka,flow also comes from sump return at some astronomical rate,they are dying bottom up,i use 2 decent hydrometers and reference both for acuracy,I cant find a mag test kit at any lfs ive checked so far but i assume its okay because my calc and ka are high?,system is approx 2 years old,i dont keep softies anymore,i have'nt seen any bugs or what not even at night and yes I aclimate properlly but i dont use any products in doing so,no I cant even keep monti ALL sps species have died

So heres what I've got from you guys so far;slowlly raise salinity,bigger koralia......?

oh and source is ro di

I am not sure why everyone thinks that 1.022 is too low for SG reading. Myself and a few of my friends all keep our SG at 1.022 in my SPS reef and I have never had a problem. I know a LFS here that keeps it at close to the same level as I do as well.
Can anyone fill me in?

It's not that 1.022 is low for a system; i don't personally see a problem with that. The problem I see is that if a coral (or anything really) comes from the majority of the stores who keep their water at 1.025 (notice i said "most" this time :)) it has to very quickly adapt to 1.022... essentially its getting the salts sucked out of it by osmosis. Even with proper acclimation for hours, I don't know... but hey, that might not even be *the* problem.

So I couldn't find where you mentioned the Temp of your tank. High and low or if it is constant. Also are your corals bleaching? or do you notice a brown jelly, white paste? black gooey material? ect..
I ask where you place your new coral and bulb age because of burning. If you get your corals from the same place, that happens to have low light and the tranfer to your tank with bright light, now where in the tank may be safe from burning esp if your tank depth is low and your lights are close to the water. Just a thought.

I still say if you go to the Zeovit.com web site and say that your Alk is 10, they will tell you to get it down to NSW readings. It has to do with the way the bacteria work in the zeo system.

I agree that you should look in to lowering your alk if you're using Zeo (but if you haven't been using Zeo since you started trying to keep SPS then this won't explain your problem).

Again, check your SG with a refractometer - not a "calibrated" hydrometer. You can't believe the number of times people have assumed their "calibrated" hydrometer(s) were accurate only to find they either went bad or were never good (Brad can attest to this). The problem may not be that the SG is 1.022 but I would be surprised if it actually was 1.022.

Flow coming from the sump "at some astronomical rate" doesn't tell us the flow rate. What return pump are you using? What is the rated flow for the return pump? How high up does the pump have to pump? How many elbows are plumbed into the return pump plumbing? Those Koralia 1's are inadequate in a 75g.

I would stop assuming your Mg is ok. If you can't get a test kit locally order one from J&L or Ocean Aquatics - they're both close and shipping will be relatively cheap.

When was the last time you measured the TDS of your RO/DI water?

Have you ever added any detrivores to your deep sand bed? I would guess your deep sand bed is a sewer dumping nutrients back into the tank as evidenced by the fact that you continue to have hair algae. You 100% do not have zero phosphate if you have hair algae growing in your tank.

So again, I implore you, if you want help figuring this problem out take a picture of your tank and post it here so we can stop guessing and see what we're dealing with. Trying to "diagnose" your problem without seeing at least a picture of your tank is just going to beget more guessing.

I agree with this theory as we'll. I kept my dkh when i was running Zeo at 7.That could be a issue.

What is the TDS coming out of your R/O?

You say they die from the bottom up. How quickly? Is it RTN or STN? In my experience if corals are dying from the bottom up they are either getting too little flow or too little light or both. I can assure you that in a 75 gallon tank you are not even close to the flow you need for sps with your current power heads. IMO those KH1's are barely enough for a 20 gal nano. As an example I have 2 sieo 820's & a Tunze nano stream (1200 gal hour) in a 40 gal frag tank.
It's a big jump going from a FOWLR or Soft coral reef to sps because the requirements are very different and flow & lighting are key in keeping sps healthy.
Also what brand of salt do you use? Have you tested the new water mix and if so what is it at?

What do you recommend for flow in a 75G for SPS Greg? I am getting about 44X turnover (3300GPH) in my 75...

To put the flow thing into perspective I have a maxijet 1200 with the mod kit on my 65g (same footprint as the 75g but only 18" high) so thats approx. 1600 gph flow on a tank that has my tube anemones, bubble coral, fox coral and mushrooms, all low flow corals.
If I was going to have sps in there I would add at least another modded maxijet.