Warning! Potential Problem with Kent Salt.
 

Apparently there is a potential problem with Kent Salt.

There has been some reports of problems with 200g bucket salt mix composition.

The problem is an extremly low alkalinity. (below 1 dKH)

Possibly from not adding sodium bicarbonate to the mixture.

Kent apparently switched factories from Instant Ocean to Coralife and this problem has developed. (New buckets have Yellow in the logo/image)

If you are using Kent salt that was purchased recently I would urge you to test your water to avoid any potential catastrophies.

More info: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=760882

***This is not good news for people who were just in on the Group Buy in Edmonton, however I haven't had a chance to test the salt recieved in that specific order. So I am unsure if they have fixed the problem by now or not. If you were in on the order and can test this salt ASAP, that would be good. If not, I should have results in a few days. I'm hoping they fixed the problem a couple weeks ago when it was first noticed.

oh dang, this would explain why my alk has been so ridiculously low. bastages! any idea on if we can get these buckets replaced?

Hmmmm
 

well thats would seem to explain my corals sliming after the first time I did a water change with the yellow logo Kent salt. I also noticed a significant drop of alk after the water change so my second water change, i used 50% IO and 50% Kent and it went well without any sliming.
Is there any plans for this batch of Kent to be rectified?

reading that rc thread it sure doesnt sound like it. im going to email them tonight.

That is a huge problem for Kent. That is one ugly discussion. I have used nothing but Kent salt for 13 years. I guess I got lucky because I've only been using the 50 gallon bags and it didn't hit me. I've been very careless about measuring the freshly mixed SW.

I think the expensive question I'm asking is..."How could an error that significant happen?...and what does that mean for the less significant (but also important) elements of the salt?" It suggests to me that there is very poor quality control going on in their production, and that is enough to scare me away.

There is a huge level of trust that aquarists place in their salt manufacturer. I had assumed that the salt I was using was subject to testing such that something like this just could not happen. I was incorrect.

Things aren't getting any better...

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=766263

Scary thread, BUT I just tested the dregs from my mix from this recent group salt order. dKH is 9. I don't know if that is good enough, but it is within acceptable range, I think.

Again, KENT, 200g pail, Edmonton Group Salt buy, 9dKH

Matt

Whew... that takes alittle off my mind. I plan to do some more testing as well, but perhaps they fixed the problem.

Thanks Matt.

People have different opinions on where dKH should be, but 9 is more than acceptable.

Dang. Like so many other local reefers, we picked up a bucket of Yellow labelled Kent's at the Boxing Day sales. If it is a bad batch, Kent should really step up & replace people's buckets with good ones.

Holy Cow! I was one of the unfortunate ones a few years ago that got in on the bad batch of Instant Ocean that had way too high of ALK. The reason that to this day I will not use Instant Ocean or Kent (because they were made by the same people) although that does not appear to be the case with this batch. There was such an outcry with the IO that they ended up sending out checks to people that had used this salt. I know that I got a check for around $1800 but it still did not compensate the pain and frustration of completely crashing my system. I actually got out of the hobby for over a year because of this.

what brand of salt are you using now ruth?

I use the new Seachem reef salt in my 190g that I am using the zeovit method on and Tropic Marin pro on all my other tanks. I have tested newly mixed batches of both salts and posted the results on other links. So far very happy with both.

do you mind me asking where i can ever buy the seachem reef salt? it looks pretty good.

Let's see I bought 3 boxes from AI in Edmonton as I was desparate for salt - that is one store I try my best not to support. I got my buckets from BlkHawk (Joshua). I know that Island Aquatics in Duncan was talking about carrying it but not sure if they have gotten it in yet. FWIW I am also very happy with the Tropic Marin pro salt and that I have been getting from reef perfections out of Ontario because he just has his sister bring it out to Abbotsford. He charged me $50 to ship 8 buckets at Christmas and I have just ordered another 8 buckets which I will pick up at Easter.

Whew!!!!!

Just mixed up 2g of RO/DI water (heated and aerated since Sunday, Feb 12) with the Kent salt from one pail from our recent Edmonton group order. All of our pails have a yellow Kent logo. Salt in pails is in a sealed bag, which I have never seen before with any salt I've used (IO and Kent) since I started reefkeeping back in the mid-90s.

Results:

dKH - 8.5 (using Aquarium Pharmaceuticals test kit)
Temp - 79 F (using Hagen stick on tank temp gauge)
SG - 1.026 (using refractometer)
pH - 8.26 (using a Pinpoint pH probe and Hanna Instrument pH controller digital readout)

Am not going to worry about the rest of the five pails, though I am certainly going to wait awhile before ordering more salt, just in case.

Dang, I just ordered two pails of Kent salt. I will see when they get here what batch they are by testing the mix. I hope they are ok, if not I'll be contacting Kent for a suppliment or replacement pails. Thanks for the heads up on this issue.

Thanks for the test results Bev.

Do you have anyway of testing Calcium & Magnesium? I'm curious to see what they are at. If not, that's fine. It'll be a few days but I'll be able to test these eventually.

Did the tests shortly after getting out of bed this morning and didn't have time to test Mg or Ca.

Bev was the salt mixing in the water for 24hrs heated and aireated? I know that I have gotten different readings after the salt has been in the water for 24 or 48 hours.

Ruth,

The RO/DI water had been heated and aerated since last Sunday after the water change. The salt was added, fully dissolved, then aerated for about 20-30 minutes before testing.

BTW, we mix the salt into the heated and fully aerated RO/DI water not longer than 24 hours before using. After about 36 hours, we've noticed that something precipitates out of the salted water, which could explain your different readings. Or, if you start out with cool, unaerated RO water when you add the salt, you could also get different readings after it has been aerated and heated with the salt in it.

That doesn't make sense to me. If it is going to percipitate out in a mixing bucket aireated and heated it is certainly going to continue to percipitate out in your tank aireated and heated.

Maybe it's the mixing container (rubbermaid trashcan) that causes the problem, though when we used a glass aquarium years back, there was precipitation after a period of time, too. I think in a tank all kinds of chemical reactions happen with various components of the saltwater, and unless one chemical component is seriously out of whack, there won't be any precipitation.

Really, I don't know. I'm only guessing. But these have been my observations.

If we have leftover saltwater after a water change, we just dilute the leftover water more RO/DI water. Precipitation does not occur then.

Beverly,

Last night, I also tested the Kent from the recent group order and got a dKH of 9. I also used an Aquarium Pharm test kit, and it doesn't have the .5 resolution you mention. 1 drop of reagent = 1dKH. Are you interpolating between two drops, or did you use 2ml of water and halve your input drops?

Matthew

Still doesn't make sense. I know people (myself included at time that keep mixed up salt water, heated and aeriated) in case an emergency water change is needed. I also use a rubbermaid trash can and have never noticed anything percipitating out. I have noticed changed on freshly mixed water in the first 24 hours but not after that. I mean most of the trace elements, calcium and alk. that goes into our tanks comes from our salt water. The only other chemical to cause a reaction are those that we add and I don't think we would want to be adding anything that is going to make calcium, alk/DKH, or mag. percipitate out (those being the most common things we test for and really all I test newly mixed salt water for). What have you noticed that has percipitated out after 24 hours? Just curiious and trying to understand this.

I have Coralife salt bucket and the salt is in 3 sealed bags.

Tropic Marin is in one big bag inside the bucket as well. I haven't opened any of the Seachem buckets yet as I am using the boxes up first and they each contain 3 50g bags.

Matt,

I don't know what "interpolating" means :razz:

What I did was add one drop at a time, then mix as per directions. At drop #8, the colour changed from blue to green. From experience, I know that the next drop will turn it yellow. So I am guesstimating that the real dKH is 8.5 from the intermediate green colour.

Maybe that's "interpolating"?

Ruth,

I have no idea what is precipitating out of the saltwater mix after 36 hours. I don't test my NSW, and am not really that curious to know what precipitates out. I just know to use it within 24 hours after salting it. Sorry I can't be of more help here.

[quote=Beverly]

After about 36 hours, we've noticed that something precipitates out of the salted water, which could explain your different readings. QUOTE]

I have never noticed anything precipitating out of mine and just wondered what you had noticed out of yours. Maybe I am missing something here.

I saw it at King Ed's yesterday, both the pail and the 50 gal bags. Didn't look at the price though, but I did remember when I saw it that Ruth mentioned that it was pretty good. Maybe it's time to give it a try, since the outside packaging even mentions that the calcium and magnesium are sufficient

Three things we have noticed that indicate precipitation...

1. white chalky ring around the rubbermaid container at the water line, which is easy to remove with a sponge

2. white chalky residue around the sides below the water line and at the bottom of the rubbermaid container, which is relatively easy to remove with a sponge

3. white chalky stuff adhering to heaters and powerheads, which require vinegar to remove

This is with both IO and Kent salts. Have never used other salts for comparison.

Aahh now I know what your talking about. I have gotten that as well just never noticed that it only showed up after 24 hours. I have had it after 2 hours or 36 hours and I don't really know what it is either as I have never tried to put it in water and run tests on it.
I guess what I was trying to figure out was how levels of the various things that we test for would change from 24hrs to 36hrs or more (except if there is much evaporation). I wonder though if this may be borine? Don't know. The only time I have observed changes in common tests is during the first 24hrs. after newly mixing. I have tested IO, Seachem, Formula and Tropic Marin.

I've been kind of patiently waiting for the Seachem salt to hit the market around here to give it a go. Sort of lost my faith in the IO and Kent over the last few years. Both have been losing thier quality standards apparently.

You know Kari when this salt first came out I sent Seachem an e-mail about where to purchase it and they referred me to a place in Calgary that does their wholesale ordering. I will have to check back in my e-mails to see if I kept the person's name etc. I did contact her but was not given much help unless I wanted to retail the salt (which I didn't - not much of a market in Fort St. John!)

Just found the information. This is the information that Seachem gave me:
Cichlid Wholesale can be reached at 403 720 8355 or diana@cichlid.ca
It might be worth a try if you are interested.

Thanks Ruth,
Should try purchasing a pallet or two of salt and set a group buy thing for the locals.

king eds in vancouver had a few pails of the seachem reef salt, it was 79 bucks a bucket, thats 30 bucks more a bucket than kent so i need to think about this before i switch.

Seachem Salt
 

Hello all,

For those who are interested, I am working on a pallet price deal with Seachem for their new salt mixes. I should have pricing confirmed this weekend and will post some prices no later than Monday.

Cheers...

Scott
Island Pet Zone

Heads up, I just tested my bucket (what was left of it) and got dKH = 1.
I purchased it from J&L on Dec. 8th.
Does anyone know if J&L is replacing these?

Don't know. Why not contact J&L and let us know what they say.