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Sand vs no sand?
I am in the process of setting up a new FOWLR tank. Dims are 72x24x27.
I am curious on everyone's thoughts on sand vs. bare bottom? I have seen lots of bare bottoms recently. Thanks |
My thought is that I have never seen a bare bottom ocean. Or sea for that matter. Or lake even. Or river.
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6line for years with BB but can't keep the shrimp/goby pair
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BB here , loving it :)
If I were to do a fish only though I'd prob go sand but reef and I'm BB:) |
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You have sand if you like the look of sand. What other people think shouldn't matter.
But since you asked. Having a bare bottom is very liberating :mrgreen: There's no way I'd have the flow patterns that I have in my tank with sand. |
I have very little sand in my tank in the front, Lots of flow so it blows around a lot :D. But the back part of my tank is bare bottom and I like that I do not have to get into those hard to reach spots to maintain it. I have a large rainbow wrasse that dug himself in at night in his previous tank, but because of my small sandbed just hides in a rock at night now, happy as can be. :D
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Was thinking about Cori's wrass one of my favorite fish and I know not all sleep in sand just the pretty ones Do lol
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Just got rid of all my sand. Had 2" initially for like 3 years. Moved tank, went almost BB. Maybe 1/2" But was mix with some really fine sand, for another 3 years. Yesterday had tank emergency. Bottom bulkhead leaking. Complete drain. I removed ALL my sand. One corner, and under the rocks was soo full of detritus, it was like over 2" thick in locations. Total dead flow spots I know. But hard to get flow under the rocks. And impossible to siphon. Now I want sand again, I like the looks. Wish Crushed Coral wasn't such a Nitrate grabber and easier to clean too. My CUC had pretty much dissapeared and I never noticed for quite a while. Can't seem to keep Inverts well either lately.
My 150g is moderate stocked, Yellow, Hippo, Naso Tangs, Coral Beauty, Foxface and 2 clowns. Clam seem's Happy, have a RBTA that shriveled up, and seems to not like light. Lights are low tho, and he is slowly expanding more, but moves up and down the rocks daily. My WC intervals are like 6 weeks due to my work schedules etc. Tank is left fully automated while I am in camp for 3 weeks at a time... Thoughts on my getting more sand? What more CUC should I get? Had 2 Brittle stars and 2 Serpent stars, But only 1 Brittle star is left too |
Sand looks good and if healthy is good for the tank.
By healthy I mean, sand is a bit of its own separate world in a tank. It can help with filtration. A healthy sand bed will have a bunch of snails and a few sand stars (depending on tank size). The key to a healthy sand bed is that it is being turned over frequently. A stagnant sand bed is bad news. If your able to maintain it then go for it!!! If you are going to forget all about it and let it become a nitrate / detritus sponge then it's bad news. When your fish die off you notice within a day or so, because you can see it. What's alive in the sand you can't see so you need to be very observant!!! Also remember that when you clean your tank you should vacuum or siphon off/out the sand and take out a bunch each time, wash it and dump it back in..... just helps keep the brown sludge that can accumulate down. |
Thank you everyone for your replies.
Great to hear everyone's views, and thoughts. Maintenance is going to be an issue for me, I was hoping to keep it as simple as possible. I am having it in wall with a fish room and my space is limited being able to syphon some spots due to framing ect. I will take pics and show everyone when I get my build thread going. It concerns me that I will have many dead spots. If I have run refugium that would help with the water quality ? |
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When I 'change out water' 2x / month I am really using the 'exiting' waters force and momentum to pull out some sand and the crap (solids) that collect within it - a means to vacuum the sand. The residual sand and solids in the water drainage bucket get washed a few times with tap water until it is clean and then dumped back into the tank. I lose very little sand down the drain during this process. Usually Once a year I do a 'large clean'. I take a day and remove rock and coral into another tank / rubber-made and remove all the sand and wash it until it is clean and then it goes back in, along with all the rocks and corals. Then if the old water looks clean it can go back in and I fill the rest with new water. Being careful with water temps during this process. Quote:
* Detrius (fish poop) are solids that slowly break down in the tank and as it breaks down releases P04 and N03. Your goal is to remove detrius before it breaks down with weekly water changes. That doesn't happen for a lot of us. So, your sand collects it and slowly releases the P04 and N03 that are held within it. You can vacuum out the thick/semi solid sludge that is detrius, but you will never get all of it. So, there will always be some P04 and N03 that is being released into the water. Hence the refugium/sump. Refugium/Sump is where you will try to keep some:
*sump - is where water processes are handled Since the little critters can live safely in a sump there is terminology overlap. You could have a tank for just the live rock and a tank for just algae - the goal is water purification but it will also act as a refugium. Then have it drain into a sump for the skimming and return pump..... most people I doubt truly run a dedicated refugium and it is really all about the water purification and the pods and slugs just happen to live in there..... Does that make any sense? or did I just ramble? |
^^^ what he said, also tons of flow will keep the detritus suspended in water column to be removed by skimmer, and also to eliminate dead spots
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Or you could just go bare bottom. A sandbed sure sounds like a heck of a lot of work for little to no benefit !
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Remember that bare bottem, 'area' LxW in inches has bacteria growing on it.... and is flat
A single piece of sand, if it were a cube (surface area LxWxH), 1mm on all sides has a total of 6mm of area that bacteria can live on. So, 1mm (of flat) vs 6mm per layer of 1mm sand. By adding sand your good bacteria have 100s if not 1,000s (%) of increased area to live on which is good for the tank (depending on how much sand you add it could be millions or 10x's of millions). You just need to take care of it. * Don't forget we are talking about sand in a display tank so it doesn't need to be crazy deep. Its not a 'Deep Sand Bed', most people choose the wrong size of sand (& depth) for their display tank.... |
Does that make any sense? or did I just ramble?[/quote]
Makes total sense. Thank you, I appreciate everyone's input. |
lots of fine looking bare bottoms here
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Just personal preference here that I hate bare bottom tanks and could never imagine running one. I see a lot of people with discuss tanks do this. It just doesn't look or feel right to me.
I always mention to people that with a sand bed you must include something that will sift it up to prevent the build up of toxic gasses. In my 90Gallon freshwater I have a horseface loach and in my SW setup I have a sleeper goby. (considering a sand sifting star but I know how difficult they are to keep) So really it comes down to you, both ways are fine and BB is much easier and cleaner but it all comes down to you. |
I have a Sand Sifting Star in my 55G and it has been in there for over a year without any issues.... hes moving all over and looks absolutely fine. Now its not a large one... maybe 2" diameter...
Just get the right size for your tank... |
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Depends on your sand???? If you've got OO Lite yes....
And if it's really dirty.... |
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Now I am too scared to put anything else in the tank, so the sand is nasty and needs cleaning every once in a while. |
meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehhhh... I've always thought of sand as an unnecessary evil. Spraypaint the bottom of your tank white. Done.
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no sand and you would never get to see the awesomeness of a jawfish :biggrin:
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That being said, I like sand for the aesthetics. But BB is definitely a ton easier to clean... |
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If you do want sand, keeping one of the larger sand sifting fish (like Valenciennea sp gobies) really helps to keep the sand much cleaner. They can be a pain in the butt in reef tanks because they bury corals in sand, but they are a must-have in FO tanks imo. Also, choose a larger grain sand so you can vacuum it easier - nothing finer than the Caribsea Special Grade, but not so coarse that it traps food like crushed coral will. You can go either direction and have a healthy tank. It's more about how much maintenance do you want to do and what look you prefer. Barebottom tanks, if you position your flow right and lift your rocks off the bottom you can do absolutely no vacuuming/bottom siphoning and can incorporate an easy water change system. With sand, you will be (should be) in there vacuuming it every week or two. |
I think a tank looks incomplete with no sand on the bottom, It personal preference I like a sand bottom.
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I'm a bare bottom guy.
With the right flow and a good sump/skimmer, I think your regular eras of neglect can go longer with less reprocussions! On the same note I believe a sand bed brings some nutrient instabilities if they are disturbed or not taken care of AND there are no scratches on my glass. On the flip side there are some fish I would like to have but wouldn't even consider because I'm bare bottom. |
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