another rtn? :(

Yes, and two more frags are no longer displaying polyps, they just look like empty, but colored, shells. I'll post photos in a bit, I'm in the middle of a water change.

hmmm doesnt sound to good...something gotta be wrong in your tank

Some more photos;

My imperator cleaning off some algae, sweet little guy;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0027-2.jpg

My algae-eating tang (I love this guy, he eats everything but clams and coral. Couldn't ask for a better fish! My yellow damsel is also in this shot, it was one of my first 3 fish!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0038-1.jpg

RTN;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0056-1.jpg

Frags with no polyp extension;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0058-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0059-1.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0060-1.jpg

Clams are still happen and open;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0049.jpg

I'm still not sure why I'm experiencing RTN, its very quick and usually happens later in the evening or overnight. I am curious as to if I should just shut down this system and move everything back to my 24g cube, save for the tang and imperator angel. The GHA also doesn't seem to be coming back, any small left overs are very quickly being eaten by the tang.

I agree with Adidas, something is wrong, I just don't know what. Its like I can keep everything else, but SPS right now. Anyone else have any ideas?

why dont u bring some of the sps frags over, ill keep em in my tank for u and see if they recover? my sps is doing amazing. i can keep it until u are ready?

Thank you for the offer! I'm posting in the reef forum for suggestions right now. I'll send you a PM shortly.

no prob. also it looks like a bit of cyano in there, have you ever used Chemi-clean?

Nope, no Chemi-clean, I'm afraid of it actually!

oh man, its great i used it once and it killed cyano and all other nuisance algae.

I think I've terrified myself by reading too many bad accounts of its usage. Its not actually that bad, I just looked at it seems to just be on the tips of that frag and any dead frags that you can see on the background. I should probably take those out now I guess.

Quick update;

I now only have two SPS frags that are still alive. Both still show no polyp extension.

I've decided that I won't buy anymore SPS until at least April. I still don't have any clue as to why I can no longer keep SPS. I can't figure out why things were going so well with my frags/colony until a few weeks ago. In the mean time I'm just going to let the tank chug along and see where it goes.

The fish all still seem happy and healthy, same goes for the clams and the few softies/LPS I have. Its a good sign and its something to focus on for the time being.

I'm seeing some more subtle transformations and changes within my system. Algae growth on the glass seems to come more frequently, and in a larger quantity. My clams can't seem to get "comfortable", my small crocea, and my large derasa are regularly changing their positions. One day they orient with the MH bulb, and the next they are perpendicular.

I still want to try SPS again, but I am wary. This is the first time in probably 8 or more months in which I've actually had to put out my own money for tank supplies and livestock. My previous cube was self sustaining and I was more then able to buy all my own supplies and livestock. My funds are running out, so I guess I have to start putting my own money into the system if I want to try SPS again.

I figured out why my levels were a bit out on my last reading and I've corrected it. I use Ultra Mag reactor media in my Ca. reactor along with ARM media. The Ultra Mag needed to be replaced, along with my kalk powder in my kalk. reactor. I fixed those at the end of last week, after turning my reactors back online. So a few minor adjustments and now my chemistry is back inline.

I never thought I could go through that much media so quickly, but the last time I dialed in my Ca. reactor was after I had removed all my dead SPS, and sent my clams to a friends for care.

The thicker and more frequent algae growth on the glass was something that happened with my 28g cube. I'm seeing more and more familiar signs and correlations between my previous cube and this tank, its making me hopeful about keeping SPS again.

This tank is not making me a happy reef keeper.

So yesterday the Snapper pump started making these squeeking noises. So yesterday evening all the pumps on the system were cleaned and then system went back online. I saw increased flow from the pump, but nothing else happened.

This morning I woke up to a quiet tank, the pump failed. It seized, but since there was no power outtage the back up battery system didn't kick on and the tank was without power and heat for who knows how long. Thankfully there were no deaths, and the temperature drop was minimal, and everything was still within acceptable levels when I noticed it.

I love my battery back up!
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0005-4.jpg

So then I had to rush off to pick up a new pump. By the time I'd come home more problems had cropped up. In an attempt to remove the Snapper pump, the sump got cracked.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0004-3.jpg

I came home with a new pump, a Reeflo Dart this time instead of a Snapper. This was not a cost that I really wanted to put out for. The timing of this pump failure is bad. I've sent off an email to Reeflo to see what may be done about the pump, I've heard that their customer service is usually quite good. I hope something of benefit comes out of this.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0008-1.jpg

Pumps side by side, top is the Dart, and lower is the Snapper
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0002-2.jpg

Left is the Snapper and right is the Dart
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0003-2.jpg

Pump pictured is the Dart, and the grey portion is the Snapper's to illustrate the difference between the two.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...ka/DSC_2-1.jpg

So now I'm spending my day supervising the replacement of a my main pump, and I'm hoping very much that nothing else breaks or stops working before I can really afford to make changes or repairs on the system.

So I am going to tear down this tank temporarily. I have settled on the fact that my SPS deaths are related to the tank itself or the sump in some way. I've tested my water endlessly and looked at what I think are the most likely possiblities. I haven't yet set a date for this, however it will be soon.

I have also recently noticed that one side of my tank is sinking into the floor. I'll also be relocating the tank at the same time.

I've tested my Ca reactor effluent after changing out all my Ca related media and chaining up all my reactors. The water runs through my Ca reactor in this order; Ca Reactor with ARM media, Phosban reactor, Magnesium reactor then into the tank.

pH 7.6
Ca 430ppm
dKH 12
P04 0.01

The tank is still producing filamentous algae on the glass, and everything seems happy. I've fed the tank my homemade fish food for the second time today, and the fish seem to really like it. I on the otherhand can only taste and smelll garlic after having made it.

Here is the process for making the food. It contains the following; Mysis, Nori (All colors), Oyster Eggs, Garlic (crushed), Scallops, Vitamins (selcon and zoe), Squid, Krill, Spirulina flakes, Rotifers, Brine Shrimp, Cyclop-eeze, Silversides, Cuddlefish, Shrimp.

First I defrosted the frozen goods in RO/DI. I spent two hours thawing and rinsing them until the water ran semi-clear.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0033-2.jpg

Next up I peeled garlic, and lots of it. FYI this much garlic was required to make 35 cups of product.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0036-1.jpg

I added these;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0038-2.jpg

Then nori in all three colors
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0040-2.jpg

All together now
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0042-1.jpg

After the puree button
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0044.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0046-1.jpg

Now with some of the frozen goods added;
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0048.jpg

All mixed together, it was very thick, and hard on the arms
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0049-1.jpg

Final product
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0050-3.jpg

My favorite tool of the day, yay for the ugly 1970s relic which has kept most of the smell from clinging into my house.
http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0047.jpg

That stuff looks positively vile. Yum yum!

Sorry to hear about the continued SPS deaths. It's a frustration I know well though, so I empathize. :neutral:

Apologies if this is in an earlier page, but you do have a picture of your Ca reactor to phosban reactor to magnesium reactor setup?

I'll find a few photos of the new Ca reactor set up and post them later.

This SPS death thing has to be the tank, I can't see what else it could be. The temporary tear down is going to involve breaking down the actual tank. I may even replace it, I don't fully know yet. What I do know though is that a part of my plumbing has just sprung a slow leak, urg!

Thanks for making the seafood melody Catherine. If I had done it my kitchen would not look as neat as yours.

No problem, it was pretty fun actually.

The tank is officially coming done, and soon.

The pump disaster from March 1st, still isn't resolved. My emails to Reeflo Plumps go unanswered, and their phone number is constantly busy. I have since reached out to a local vendor to see if they have any way of getting in touch with Reeflo. I just find this absolutely uacceptable, and this is impacting my future odds of buying Reeflo negatively.

The tank will receive some new livestock today. I am sharing in a livegoods order from Ocean Aquatics today. I will be adding in more clams to this tank. I also ordered some fish, but they are for another system, my non-nano tang & larger fish friendly tank.

FYI the information Reeflo includes with their pumps, e.g their toll free phone number is only for US residents, the correct number for Canadian residents is 719 231 2761

No progress on the pump, I finally spoke with someone and said person is telling me that their pumps don't fail, thus it must be my fault something happened. I, of course disagree and will persue the matter further, although should I see no resolution by April 15th, I will just cut my losses and move on.

That's silly. Everything fails. The Titanic went down. I bet it used Reeflo bilge pumps.

;)

Gold! :D

Some positive developments have been happening lately. Reeflo finally got back to me, they are sending me a new Snapper pump. I'm pleased that there has finally been resolution, but I am still unhappy that it took almost a month of constantly chasing after them via phone and email to get someone on the phone. The pump hasn't arrived yet, but I suspect it will take a few weeks to cross from the US into Canada.

I participated in a recent order from Ocean Aquatics. I ordered 3 clams, and a fish. Here are my three clams, two baby maximas, and a larger crocea.

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0154.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0155.jpg

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...DSC_0145-1.jpg

You can use it in a closed loop on your big tank :)
They were cutesy little clams.

That may be the plan! I'm not sure, I will make plans once the replacement pump actually arrives to me. I will be annoyed if I have to pay duty or something on this pump.

Wow, those clams are tiny. How big, exactly?

I believe they fall into the xxs category. I wanted 2" or bigger, and I got 1" or possibly smaller. They are doing well though, mantles are extended and they are being target fed. They are pretty though, but I do have some reservations about if they are going to make it or not. I guess I just have to keep with the target feeding.

This tank and I are not getting along. The overflow is making a horrible sucking sound. Its a pain, its loud, and I can't seem to fix it without taking the canopy off. I'm not strong enough or tall enough to take the canopy off by myself. The noise is driving me insane, and you can't escape it.

I have officially had enough of this tank. I think it may go up for sale after I complete my 180. I don't have any more patience for it.

I'm looking at improving my photography skills, and bettering my knowledge with my camera. Mount Royal College is offering a few photography courses, while they aren't geared to underwater or through glass photography I'm sure there is lots to be learned. I think I will sign up for Photography 1 and Adobe Photoshop Elements 1.

This arrived to me today, and Reeflo kept their word, no duties!

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b2...a/DSC_0189.jpg

Yay..now you need another one too make the close loop and one more for return...

I have some unhappy news to report my tank is still killing SPS, so I am harboring thoughts of killing it after my 180g is up and running.

I added some SPS, and I'm starting to see the beginning of the death pattern. The polyps no longer come out on my new SPS, and I'm seeing bleaching in the tips.

I was also away this past week, and came home to dead clams. Those two tiny clams posted above died. I came home and they were buried in my new sandbed and weren't seen. I dug them out and one was gone, and the other looked like it may make it. Both are now dead.

I feel like a failure because I can't make this tank work for me, only against me. I posted up a request for help thread here. I closed my one on RC because I kept getting suggestions that were not only out to lunch, but showed that the responders hadn't even attempted to look at my tank journal thread.

On the bright side all my fish are doing well, my remaining clams are growing and sucking back the Ca like nobody's business. I've had to bump up the output on my reactors lately. I'm also liking the sandbed I added back in. It brightens up the tank, and it gives the system a whole new look.

I'm really sorry to hear this.

For what it's worth, I saw the same patterns on my 75g for the last 2 years. Everytime I thought I was in the clear, I'd try some new frags, and they'd never make it. Same thing. Start off with less polyp extension, then tip bleaching, then eventual RTN.

For what it's worth, I never really solved it either. I just basically embraced zeovit and hoped for the best, thinking that if I can't solve what ails them, perhaps I can make them so strong that they grow faster than they can die. Does it work? Well, .. maybe. I have still lost frags in the last couple months, same pattern. But at least it doesn't appear to be 100% losses (so far ... touch wood :neutral:), so there may be an improvement.

But embracing zeovit shouldn't be the solution. I just did it to grasp at a final straw and see how it would go.

So I hate to say it but I think whatever it is, may indeed not really be solvable. It's not the usual suspects of parameters, it's not nutrient buildup, it's not red bugs and it's not flatworms. (I think.) .. I believe it to be pathological in nature (ie., bacterial, protozoan or perhaps fungal). Whatever it is, it can remain latent in an otherwise SPS-fallow tank for long periods of time.

If this is the case, then I'm afraid I can only offer the suggestion that I think your idea of throwing in the towel (on the tank at least, not overall in the hobby) is really the only magic bullet solution. Start a new tank, new glass, new sand, new rock, new everything. Sell the rock to someone who wants it for a FOWLR (since clearly fish are not at risk, at least mine don't seem to be).

It is basically my plan. I'm planning on all new rock for my 280g, which is one of the reasons the tank is so delayed in startup. I didn't quite realize when I was planning a 280g that I'd be looking to buy all new rock when the time came to put water in it ... :eek: Oh well, that's neither here nor there. I'm sorry to hear of your continued frustrations. I know what it's like, because I've been there.. The worst part is I'm not really sure that I'm not still there or not, I'm just hoping for the best.

I think you are right, the 180 will have all new rock and sand. I'll get seeder sand rock from trusted sources and go from there. Not really I cost I want to pay, but in the end its probably the best way to go about doing it. Maybe a huge order from Marco rocks or something similar is in order.

I just wonder how to transfer over the livestock without moving over whatever is causing the SPS deaths. Do I QT everything between this tank and the 180? I worry that something will carry it over.

I don't know the call on that one. My intention is to keep my fish so I'm going to hope that they don't bring it over. I'll just try to swap as little water as possible when the time comes and hope for the best. It's probably not the best idea but what else can a person do?

What's Marco rock? I was thinking of ordering some Eco-Rox as it's basically Fiji rock but dry. Stuff looks wicked, and at $2.50ish per pound I'll happily take it dried...

I just read on another reef forum of people getting tainted silicone and it doing something similar. I will try and find the thread. But basically it said the silicone was treated with a fungicide even though it wasn't supposed to have been. Same thing fish lived corals, clams, most inverts did not. I wonder if there is a way to clip some silicone and do a test? Maybe the levels are low that only effects sps...as they are proably one of the most sensitive in the tank?

Marco is about the same as Eco-Rox. Dry will mean its cheaper both in shipping and cost.

I'll probably do the same. Fill the 180g, get everything in line and just transfer everything over with very little water from the 28g. I'll probably devise something so I can acclimate my clams, and over time dilute the water from the 28g.

Post the link if you find it, its worth a look or two.

Catherine, there has been a proliferation recently of people unhappy with marco rocks on RC. Just a heads up, as he has many happy people in the past. Good thing about base rock 100 pounds usually is equiv to 200 pounds...well maybe not quite when wet :)

I saw that about Marco Rocks. Although lately he seems to have been sorting out the problem. From what I understand some of it was growing pains, and some of it was late shipments. I'm not even sure if they can be shipped to Canada. I'm looking up Eco-Rox details now actually.