here in regina we just had this discussion about 2 weeks ago, and concluded it wasn't a good idea to formailze for the same reasons dephinus has layed out.

Another aquarium society requires a LOT of hard work and dedication, and finding that in it's purest is far and few between. and we all know money as the root of evil and things usually goto hell once money is introduced within a friendship.

I'm just trying to throw ideas out, ignore them if you like since i'm not from calgary. :neutral:

I just think a website would be good so more than just Des, Jon, Alan and Tony have a nice looking gallery of their tanks. :wink: But you're right, overall it's a lot of work for not a whole lot.

My idea for the website is to try to attract more local Marine/Reef members that otherwise would not visit a message board such as this one ... by getting the LFS to promote the website we get more exposure and more members ... when the number of members is high enough to support a formalized membership we can take the next step.

We have to start somewhere :wink: and we have alot of Marine/Reef keepers in this city that have no idea who we are and what type of assistance we can provide ... I suspect that alot have started tanks and subsequently quit because of a lack of resources or not knowing where to look.

We can link to Canreef from that site as well.

The LFS can get a banner on the site in exchange for promotion of the site in their stores. A win-win is what I am looking for.

It's a nice idea Steve and I'm not really against the idea. But for a couple of reasons I have a few concerns.

First and foremost, although it may be inexpensive to register a domain, it's not free. Anytime that money is involved, i.e. collected for or paid on behalf of an entity, there has to be accountability -- without accountability, creditability is questionable. This means at minimum there has to be an executive body or committee.

Secondly as an online resource it really would be in the same category as this discussion board. If people aren't going to make it to one, then I think it's unlikely they'll make it to the other. I.e., either you're technologically savvy in which case you can probably find your way here, or you're not technologically savvy in which case neither resource will really fit the bill.

Thirdly, most online associations have generally been unkind in the words regarding the retailers, and this fact has not gone unnoticed amongst them. We probably have still an uphill battle to win them over at this point. And to be honest, I think a club or association should not be too tightly indebted to a retailer because sooner or later a conflict of interest is sure to rise.

I think the better first step is that we define who we are, we draft up a set of minimal bylaws which set out what positions define the executive council (I would suggest at a minimum a president, a vice-president, and a treasurer), how often and when the annual general meetings are held (where the executives are elected), also including the plan for dissolution of the club, then register as a non-profit society within Alberta, then register as a member society of MASNA, then approach CAS to be a sibling or partner society so that we can share the duties in some annual events; then start creating assets such as a website, a bank account, and other resources (books? tools?) and a management plan for those assets, and plans for future projects (e.g. zoo).

Does it sound like a major undertaking yet? Because it should! :razz: Don't get me wrong the whole reason we started this Calgary forum is because we do want to have a club (at least some of us do). But we have to really want to take this next step. Otherwise it is a recipe for burnout, and I'm sure we've all been there. And if we take it too early we risk stumbing.

Anyhow these are just my thoughts. If the time is right to start the ball rolling again then great, let's get the ball rolling. But I think we ought to have a business meeting and go from there first.

I tried to talk to them thru their website long before I was on Canreef and never even got a reply....mind you they probably didn't know what SW was then. :rolleyes:

Hey, I love cichlids, that's probably what led me into the hobby. But every time I think of the CAS I remember the fish show at Pisces...and me freaking over the kids climbing all over the display fish. Then I have a nightmare about Moo... :eek:

Sorry, I don't think I'm going there. :neutral:

A meeting you say Tony?
At my house perhaps? :biggrin:

This is an odd statement because I still think it would be nice to formalize our group, but Tony totally sold me. I guess we're not missing much right now anyways.

How else do you suggest we get the exposure to attract those Marine/Reef keepers so that we have enough members to formalize ? ... it would seem that we are in a neutral position in that there are not enough here to get started and not growing fast enough to do it in the near future ( If anyone is worried about the website domain registration it is a pittance and I would gladly donate to have it registered but I am not up to website desgn or else kindergarten kids would have a better site than us :rolleyes: :razz: )

I understand what is involved with starting a non-profit organization ( I am a founding board member for a non-profit charity ) but what I am suggesting is that we need to get our numbers up first ... those up front costs need to be spread over a membership and not burdened on a few ... any suggestions as to how to attract other Marine/Reef members I am open to hear as well.

To borrow a line from a popular ad " membership has it's privilidges " ... when we have our numbers up we can entice more members because we will have more to offer ... some of the clubs in the states get group buys from retailers ( online or local ) etc ( I actually snuck in on the New Jersey Reef Clubs group buy of Refractometers as well as a RC group buy of Algae free rare earth magnets )


So you are saying that if they wont visit a message board such as this one that most people wont visit a website dedicated to local reefers either ? ... I dont necessarily agree because most people I think are naturally shy and so there may be more lurkers but lets assume for a minute you are correct on this point

A good point to be sure ... that is why I am suggesting a seperate website for the local hobbyist ( not a discussion board as this one ) ... we have had our discussions regarding retailers before but ultimately we do need each other and can collaborate to a common good ... we only really need one on board as I think most of us have visited them all at some point in time ... I would rather see that happen voluntarily by some of those retailers that frequent this board and we already support.



Marine/Reef enthusiasts ... although we share the common denominators of a glass box/heater with our freshwater bretheren ... I think the similarity stops there ... we have completely different challenges and I believe the end results of our efforts although more difficult are far more esthetically pleasing and rewarding.

I just think we need to figure a way to channel Marine/Reef keepers into one location and hold at least quarterly get-togethers.

I have a unfinished basement in this new place that ( if I can sort some of the boxes :rolleyes: ) hold quite a few people and would be willing to volunteer to hold meetings here ... Jonathon also has volunteered his home so a couple more and we can at least have a way to get face to face with the rest of the group on a regular basis

I think a mistake we have made in the past is that we have not set aside a regular meeting ... if everyone knew that every third month the second Saturday night ( only a example ) was a meeting then everyone could plan around that and turnouts would be better. ( when was our last meet anyway ? :lol: )

more wood to the fire of discussion ... I am not saying I am right ... these are just my opinions and I am open to any and all suggestions.

I totally agree that this needs more discussion ... where and when ?

Tony ... why dont you start a thread to get a meet together for at least those that want to be involved from a planning/execution level ?

Just a couple quick points because I have to run ... more detailed discussion maybe later ..

To borrow a phrase, "if you build it they will come." If the group entity exists it will serve as a beacon itself, to some degree.

I think we have had regular meetings in the past. But now the group has grown enough that they have become somewhat daunting, however, and the lineup of volunteer hosts has sort of slightly dwindled.

For a while actually I think we had a rule of thumb? Wasn't it the first Wednesday of every month or something like that? But then what happens is because we're having these in people's houses, we're somewhat at the mercy of spouses and families and scheduling commitments and whatnot and instead of a Monday or Wednesday it becomes a Saturday afternoon or a Sunday or vice-versa. Maybe for now let's figure on either monthly or every couple of months and go from there. Maybe this could be an agenda item for the first business meeting? I.e., planning beyong the "next meet" and actually having targeted other meets as well (without getting too overboard just yet).

Some great points, again my thoughts are just one person's opinion as well, but I think we have a lot of common ground, and a lot of potential momentum/inertia. I'm just trying to challenge us into thinking this through properly. Maybe 2005 can be "our year".

I'd love to go on but unfortunately I think I will get fired if I do. So I'll have to put my diatribe to a rest for a moment.

cheers

What!? That surprises me Qinn, just think of all the latin names you could add to your vocabulary!