I have researched the e-500 as well, looks like a good camera, interesting fourththirds system.

Not that it should be a huge concern, but olympus did drop their film SLR line, so I am someone apprehensive to buy into their digital line because of that, compared to Nikon and Canon.

Reeferadict I will check out those places you mentioned, thanks.

Oh, and the E-500 is out for me because of the lack of image stabilization, and pooper high-ISO performance. Not that it is a bad camera, but I am looking to buy into a system for the long term, and low-light photography will eventually be important to me.

Another place that I have found for used equipment that there appears to be some good buys is "photogon". I have never bought anything off of the site though so cannot recommend one way or another.

Thanks for the link Ruth.

reeferaddict was stating a good point earlier about IS not helping with fast moving objects.

If you're on a budget, you can go for a good non-IS lense, and put that investment into a good tripod and a monopod. You MUST have those handy for lots of shots, and I'd choose a tripod/monopod over an IS lense. I love my monopod. Special ordered the Manfrotto 680B (monopod 16" when compacted), and the #234 rotating head. I take it out with my whenever I go out photographing. No need for an IS system :) I also use the wired remote, so I can just hold the monopod steady, and my pressing of the button doesn't cause any motion blur.

and I don't think ANY is lense would handle touchy macro shots well, especially if you get into adding extension tubes and other stuff. A tripod can't really screw up (unless you have a cheap head. then it sucks)

and the tripod/mono pod are investments you probably will NEVER bother upgrading, but will get LOTS of use from. Stay away from ball heads if you want something long lasting, and just remember to tighten till it's just snug. Overtightening shortens the life of your head.

Once you've been photographing for a while, you can then decide on what to spend your money on for specialty lenses. Just like how reefaddict first bought a rebel, then upgraded to a 20D based on his own experience he got from using the Rebel. (and how I bought a digitel rebel, then a film Elan, and now I'm thinking of going pro-medium format Hasselblad. Film vs. gear *grins*). I think he also said he never had a "real" macro lense. Me neither, as I use extension tubes, and I'm contemplating a bellows system, as I might be able to get one for a great deal.

I myself like straight, non-zoom lenses, but that's my tastes :) Oh, and for low light photography, go film ;) Supplement your digital with a film body. The body won't cost more than $250 new anyways, with today's film body prices. And a profesional film processing center can develop your film, and scan it for you on a great machine, giving you like a 20 megapixel or higher image in most cases. You can get some nice high speed film, and you can even pull it down a bit and get amazing photographs out of it for low light.

And buy a Holga! lmao. you'll love it hehe (can you tell i'm an art student? lmao)

oh and I've started building a 4x5 view camera for macro photography. I can give anyone plans for it once I'm finished if they're interested. It'll be a multi-lense system, not costing me more than $100 to build. Getting the glass from an optical surplus. 200 megapixels of film, baby, yeah!

Do you take your monopod hiking? I am buying this camera partly for my vacation on Vancouver island.

Well DO make sure you look me up so you can see some of this "L" glass in person! :mrgreen:

Where is Mill Bay?

North of Victoria - 30 minutes...

sigma and leica have announced a whole new line of lenses, some with IS. With the 4/3rds system, any lenses designed for panasonic, samsung or kodak will all be compatable for olympus as well. With the 4/3rds your also going to be dealing with samller lighter lenses and a larger CCD. So even if olympus drops the line ( which hopefully won't happen) There will still be lenses out there for it.

tb

Shadowboy, good infor thank.

Reeferadict, the cracked sigma 70-300, is that the APO or not?

Rory - not the APO version... if you're out this way you're welcome to take it for a test drive... FWIW it's actually not a bad lens at all if you have decent light, I found it quite sharp to tell you the truth - it just can't begin to compare to higher end lenses though...

Shadowboy - I looked at 4/3 when I was buying because I actually like the aspect. The problem with DSLR's outside of the big two are technology shifts, and people jumping in and out of the pool leaving camera owners flapping in the breeze. Minolta, (now Sony), Kodak, Sigma, Olympus and others are so clearly the "followers" they are at a disadvantage. I know you will say that Sony's in-camera IS is their own or Minolta's, which it IS... but it is also simply a new twist on Canon technology that has been around for years. I for one, have invested a lot of time and money into my system and sure wouldn't like to see my products just disappear from market because sales weren't high enough to warrant continued development and production. Also look at the lines of accessories and lenses available for each camera... NOBODY compares to Canon in that aspect... just my 2 cents.

Canon is a very good camera make and is the leader in lenses and accessories. I would had loved to buy the rebel and actually went to get it, but it felt like a toy in my hands, cheap cheasy balck or silver plastic. Being 16 i can't afford a step up from the rebel xt, plus the kit lenses are sub-par for preformance...and it only came with one for the same price as the olympus( which came with 2!). For me The olympus will far exceed my capabilites, and should last me a long time. And as for "flapping in the breeze" lol, i don't think panasonic,kodak,sigma,leica and samsung are all going to jump off the bandwagon, and I'm not one the go buy the newest lense to come out< ill probaly end up with 3-5 lenses and that shoudl be more than enough.

tb

Looking back my personal preference was a Hasselblad 500CM with a 120 macro. I wish I still had it. Razor sharp images. Needed to use a diffuser filter to hide facial blemishes. Sold the camera and lens and got a car. Still had some change for Nikon F2. I would still like to get back into the Hasselblads H system.

doug

I have been reading about the "bridging" cameras now, such as the panasonic fz30, and the canon s3

They are good cameras, but the main tradeoff is the smaller sensor means high noise at pretty much 200+ ISO, but you get movie playback which would be really nice.

I was pretty close to buying the fz30, but now they released the fz50 for september-ish, but that means no nice camera for my honeymoon.

And I might really kick myself for not going DSLR and getting better low light performance, I dunno!

GO for an SLR you definetly won't regret it, which might happen if you buy just a megazoom. I was all for the s9000 and s3, but you guys and other places talked me into a SLR, Don't wimp out on me now reef geek! go slr. If you do go just a megazoom go the s9000 699.99 at future shop, or the s3, the e-500 is only 949.99, 250$ for An slr with two lenses, decisions, decisions

tb

Yeah I am a pendulum, keep swinging back and forth!

I will do some more research on the oly 500, might be a decent option for now, but I would rather invest in canon or nikon and get access to the used market maybe?

I am thinking maybe the d70s with the 18-200 vr lense though, and add on a canon 500d lense for macro shots?

Or the rebel xt with 17-80 is, and buy a cheap non-is zoom for now?

Read some more on the sony alpha, the high ISO performance isn't up to the rest of the DSLRs, but the image stabalization sure is tempting.

Ok enough ranting for now! On to oly 500 research...

All that advice and you're still confused? :mrgreen:

Just look at it this way... what are your photographic requirements gonna be? If you plan on expanding, I just wouldn't entertain any other options than Canon or Nikon... other than that you are getting an inferior product, or shelling out your own cash to do R & D... Hell my GF bought an Olympus refurbed camera that is 4 MP takes 30 seconds of video and takes wonderful pics... $100 and it was basically new from Olympus direct... but will it macro and take me to 300mm...? Nope.

It seems most people say to buy the rebel just as a body and spend money on a better lens right away. HAve you been out and tried the rebel?
if so what did u think of it? I still think it feels like a toy.
and even though that with the e-500 doesnt have a status lcd on the top all others you need a flashlight at night tiem to see it, so its not that important in my eyes

tb

The oly is 4:3 and high ISO performance isn't there, and no image stabilization available, so its out.

The Rebel XT is definately more toy-like, but I would add on the battery grip which should make it better.

If Canon made a similar lense to Nikon 18-200 VR then I would definately go Canon, because then I could start with one lense.

I'm thinking D50 (maybe d70s depending on total cost) w/18-200 VR, and a canon 500d
The only drawback for me is that I like Canon's lense selection better for when I do want to add more lenses, but maybe with a goo 1.5x or 2x add on and the 500d, I won't need more lenses for a long time, except maybe the 12-24 DX

Oh and yes I have been to McBain to try out all the above cameras, except for the oly 500.

Try the oly, i shoot in pitch black, extreme low light, just for fun, but all the pic's turn out crisp and clear, IS is a novelty, I think its just a new digital technology that everyone say's they can't live without...what did they do before? they used tripods, something you'll be probaly buying anyways. Oly and the 4:3rds systems are'nt going anywhere. Go try the oly, see how you like it. Also what does everyone have for camera bags? This is gonna be my next purchase, needs to be able to stand some abuse (gonna be traveling for a couple of years) lowepro make some sweet models, what does everyone have?

tb

Shadowboy, I have the Tamrac Trekker 6 ... got it used for $75 on eBay in brand new shape... holds EVERYTHING, including a small laptop. Easy to customize, lots of flaps & pockets for batteries, cables, memory cards, lens cleaning supplies, you name it... I have 5 lenses (2 large lenses), a flash, macro tubes and an extender, and a body, and could fit more, and it's a fairly hefty but packable 40 or so pound backpack. Oh it will carry your tripod too...

Now I don't pack that thing around everywhere, so when I bought my battery grip, I bought a kit that actually comes with a Lowepro shoulder bag for the 20D. It can hold the camera with a lens, an extra lens or two depending on how big they are, and a flash along with compartments for other small accessories. The bonus for this one is it's lightweight and has an ergonomic carrying strap along with a fairly quick holster style space to put your camera.

Rory - listen man... I kinda get an idea of what you want to do, and just based on the amount of time you have considered your purchase and the careful questions you have asked, we can all tell this isn't an "impulse" buy. For that reason, don't go anything less than either Canon or Nikon DSLR's, you won't regret either... again just because I have a Canon doesn't mean I want you to buy a Canon, I've already stated earlier in this thread why I made my own decision so I won't go into that again but I do have some advice on the 18-200 VR in particular...

Go to Fred Miranda or DPReview and read up on the general consensus about "10X" zooms... I would tend to go with a 5x or less zoom combination along with a couple of cheap primes for tack sharp images. Then you have some shooting versatility along with some ability to take high quality images. Remember IS/VR or whatever doesn't do anything for you for moving subjects in less than favourable light... actual shutter speed is the best solution for sharp images, and this lens is pretty slow. At 18mm f3.5 will be fine, but by the time you zoom out to 150 you are at a max aperature of 4.5 - 5, and up to 300 you are at 5.6. You lose image quality at widest and longest, your autofocus will hunt, and you will be challenged to get fast enough shutter speeds to get the image quality you want.

Good advice guys, thanks again for all the help.

I do want to go try out the oly at the camera store to see how it feels.

I am thinking about the 18-200 VR specifically for my ocean kayaking trip to photograph whales and other animals where the boat will be moving, and it would be nice to not have to change lenses at all in the boat, I'm going to be scared enough just bringing the camera in a dry bag let alone changing lenses.

I have read every review of the 18-200 and I know its not going to be fast in the telephoto end, but I think it would make a great walk-about lense.

The alternative is 2 canon IS lenses which cost a fair bit more but I still might go that route, especially because the 18-200 is so hard to find, I might not even find a vendor who can get me one before my trip!

Don't forget you have to shell out an extra 100$ bucks for raw proceesing software with the nikons, so work that into your budget

tb