Originally Posted by burrows14 (Post 544485)

Any updates??? Im starting to lean towards led's these days. I keep mainly SPS in a 24"deep tank. Thanks in advance:smile:

Originally Posted by TheDogFather (Post 533734)

Below is the non scientific Vertex Illumina SR 1200-200 PAR measurement taken with a Apogee Quantum Meter. My tank is 18" tall and the fixture is 6" above the surface.


White 100% - Blue 100% - Royal Blue 100%

759 about 5mm below the surface

484 On left frag rack

392 At top right coral colony

242 Center of Red Monti

227 Center of Clam

185 Front Elegance Coral

214 Bottom right middel of tank

148 Bottom rear of tank


http://i390.photobucket.com/albums/o...00-200_PAR.jpg

Originally Posted by Ron99 (Post 545041)

Any updates or more then and now photos? Personally, I'm not super impressed with the PAR readings you showed so far. For optimal growth of SPS you want between 400 and 500 PAR. My DIY LED array achieves that in the middle level of the tank (10 inches down my 20 inch deep 75 gallon) at less then full power with the array 6 inches above the water. If I turn it all the way up and lower to 3 to 4 inches above the water I get way more. I get well over 250 PAr at the sand bed 18 or 19 inches below the water surface.

Your clam may do alright but as I understand it clams need 250 to 300 PAR (I may be wrong on that but it's the number I recall).

Originally Posted by TheDogFather (Post 545405)

That's nice Ron99 but this is not a contest and what makes you think you need between 400-500 PAR to grow stony corals well? My SPS and clams say otherwise.

I'm not going to get into a PAR contest with your DIY fixture, I get excellent growth (at 50% power I might add) and my clams are growing very well. The 48" Vertex Illumina LED comes very close in PAR output to my previous fixture, ATI PowerModule with 8x54W T5's and that fixture is no slouch.

I'm guessing your DIY uses optics to achieve higher PAR values but at the cost of spread so you'll have to hang it high to get decent coverage thereby negating all that extra PAR...

-TDF

"Stoney corals appear to photosaturate between 400 and 500 PAR so having 700 or 1000 PAR is probably pointless other than for bragging rights. I doubt it will do the corals much good." -Ron99

Originally Posted by ReefOcean (Post 545444)

Well this is a review and discussion forum, LED comparisons are relevant.

I have to agree with Ron. For that much money, I would expect outrageous par.

Judging by those readings, it is only about 20-25 percent better than my light which is a tenth the cost, a fifth the size and made by communists.

The readings are probably not accurate though. I wager that the vertex must have better output than that.

Originally Posted by Ron99 (Post 545563)

Not trying to make a competition out of it, just trying to give some perspective on relative performance of different configurations. As for light requirements for stony corals, that varies widely. LPS generally are lower light, montis would probably be described as moderate to high light and most acros would need high light for best growth and colour. I didn't say you had to have 400 to 500 PAR to grow them but for "optimal" growth and colour my reading has indicated that 400+ PAR is best and as you noted by quoting me from my build thread there is evidence that they photosaturate by 500 PAR so more than that is not really needed. Hence my conclusion that 400 to 500 PAR is optimal. I have a great example in my own tank with a superman monti. My own colony is in the top third of the tank and the base is a nice deep blue colour. I have some frags down on my sand bed and they are growing just fine but the base is a much more pale blue colour. You have only been running this fixture for a month or so. I will be curious to see how everything is doing in 6 to 12 months.

As for my fixture, yes I used 60 degree optics but spaced my LEDs out evenly over the tank so I do not sacrifice spread. I have 4 rows of LEDs, with 3 inches between the rows and the LEDs in the individual rows are 2.25 inches apart. I actually use fewer emitters then the Vertex unit does. I have 80 Cree XR-Es. Vertex uses 128 Luxeon Rebel emitters (pretty good LEDs for the record, equal to or maybe even very slightly better then the XR-Es I used) for their 4 foot fixture. That is 60% more LED emitters but yet it apparently produces less PAR in the tank. I also do not have to hang my fixture higher because of the overlap in the emitters. I can lower it to about 3.5 inches above my water without any major spotlighting or loss of overlap. I currently have it about 5.5 to 6 inches above the water and it is producing the PAR numbers I mentioned at that height.

Basically it is all down to how you configure the LEDs and optics and I guess I do not really understand Vertex's design choice as they could have achieved higher effective output with fewer emitters. Space them out evenly over the tank to get coverage and then choose the number of emitters and spacing between them appropriate for the optics you want to use to produce X PAR at Y depth. Want more PAR for a deeper tank then use more emitters spaced more closely together with tighter optics. Have a shallower tank or don't need really intense light and you can space the LEDs farther apart and use wider optics or even no optics at all for only low light corals or a fairly shallow tank.




I guess that is my point of contention. I question whether the performance justifies the price. Out here in BC that fixture will be $3248 after tax. That's a good chunk of change and 2.5 times what I spent on my DIY fixture.

As for output, his PAR numbers look to be about what I might expect having all the emitters clustered down the center with no optics. High PAR up top and down the center of the tank with a rapid drop off as you go deeper into the water and also as you move to the front or the back of the tank.

As I mentioned before in other threads, I think LEDs are the future of reef lighting but what I see happening is that people will $h1t on LEDs because they spend huge amounts of money on a fixture then eventually complain that the performance relative to their 250W or 400W MH is poor and that LEDs are no good for reef lighting. It taints LEDs in general when it was really down to the design of the particular fixture.

Originally Posted by gucci17 (Post 553522)

Any updates?

Originally Posted by wayner (Post 556082)

What about SPS colour, any changes there?

Originally Posted by BlueTang<3 (Post 556087)

I got my fixture last friday and its awesome. Cant play with light studio yet as it not available for the mac but the light is great. If any one wants to come over and take a look at the fixture shoot me a pm.

Originally Posted by BlueTang<3 (Post 556091)

Where can i get these programs. Download or purchase. Thanks

Originally Posted by TheDogFather (Post 556092)

Originally Posted by StirCrazy (Post 556103)

I was looking at the original pictures again and noticed it look like they have staggered the angle of the LEDs on the board. so one points towards the back and the next one points towards the front. is that how it realy is or does it just look that way?

Steve

Originally Posted by OscarMeyer (Post 561235)

Besides all these downsides, the light it produces, and the power it has, im extremely impressed, I may have just gotten a friday made unit or something?

Cheers OscarMeyer

Originally Posted by Skimmer King (Post 561239)

paying that much money for a fixture, shouldn't have a problem with guys making them on a Friday. they all should be perfect.

Originally Posted by michika (Post 561240)

Oscar,

What size is the tank that you're running your fixture over?

I'm really curious about this fixture's front to back coverage.

Originally Posted by OscarMeyer (Post 561235)

Just got my Vertex as well, and i have to say im extremely impressed, although im having some major issues, wanted to see if anyone else was having these issues?

1. The screen on the light itself, on first start up loads completely fine, after about 3-4 hours of run time it just goes blank, still lights up but you cannot do anything because you cant see what programs your entering, or exiting. Only fix i have found is to unplug the unit, wait 5 mins and then she works again, for only 3-4 hours and then she back to the blank lit screen.

Is it because of the power saving?

2. Im also having major issues with connectivity of the unit, to get the unit to sync, with the v-stick, i had to change the radio channel from 0 to 1, anyone else have to do this?

Same here. Sometimes I have to move my laptop with the v-stick very close to the fixture, i.e. within one foot!

3. Now because i changed the radio channel to 1, i can no longer update the unit, after finally getting it to connect to the v-stick i went to check if there was updated software for the light unit, but says because its not on radio channel 0, it will not update, but by putting it back into radio channel 0, it wont sync with the v-stick?

Try to move the v-stick closer to the fixture when syncing.

4. having the same issues that, TheDogFather stated, about saving the program to the unit, i upload to the unit, and then save the log and settings and go to close the program only to have it say that i did not save, even tho i did?

Same here, but it doesn't matter as it is already saved.

5. 2 morning back to back now i have come out and found the unit at random values and having random pods of LED's on. ie... this morning i awoke to only find 1 of the 4 pods lit, i figured it was going to run through the system and was still starting up, it stayed this way until i got it synced to the v-stick where i had to program it all over again. the unit seems to lose its memory?

It is because of the sync issue you might had encountered.

The version of software for the computer im using is 1.522, and from there website its also 1.522, the light unit itself version 1447. my LFS said that they were upto version 1.56? is that true? I also wanted to see if the mac version had been released yet?

Mac version has been released. Check thier web site.

Besides all these downsides, the light it produces, and the power it has, im extremely impressed, I may have just gotten a friday made unit or something?

I just wanted to see if anyone else was having these problems with they're units?

Cheers OscarMeyer

Originally Posted by notclear (Post 561268)

See answers above.

Originally Posted by BlueTang<3 (Post 561463)

no help ?? :sad:

Originally Posted by BlueTang<3 (Post 561596)

Yeah nothing happens. My question is when you plugged in ur v stick did anything happen on your computer? Did it recognizes it some how?

Originally Posted by BlueTang<3 (Post 561596)

Yeah nothing happens. My question is when you plugged in ur v stick did anything happen on your computer? Did it recognizes it some how?