almost bought my 5.5gal today. this should be alot of fun

I've updated the first post with all the rules/guidelines as of now... I am expecting a flood of questions regarding coral/livestock prices etc etc, which will be covered.

Start date & Entry deadline is Oct 15. Tank thread must be started by then too.

i will need to mail a check to some one for the 20 pm me if your one of these 2 people. also i have not decided wich size i want to go with but leaning towards 10

Can the tank be plumbed into a existing tank to cut down on costs for a sump and filtration(ie skimmer, to create flow from or heating)?

Chris

what about lighting does that fall under the free canopy ?

We will hold off on payment for a week or so until we are sure that there will be enough participants.... :smilecol:

Unless you guys don't care? I figured the more people the better. :mrgreen:

I touched on this on the last page. Contest tanks can not be plumbed to any existing sump. The whole idea of this contest is to have fun and work with a budget and to come up with interesting ideas. Plumbing the contest tank into a sump with a BK skimmer or Deltec CA Reactor kinda defeats the purpose, not to mention any "used" equipment (existing sump tank, skimmers, reactors, pumps etc) has to be deducted from your budget, most of our sumps probably would wipe out the entire budget cost. :lol:

So, No plumbing into existing sumps. Thanks!

Nope.. that comes out of your budget... Manage wisely ;)

One question, If we have a used piece of equipment and J & L sells it new for $34.95, 75% of the price would be $26.21. In checking the buy/sell forum, I can buy this same piece of equipment for $15.00.

Which price do we use?

ok so this time i am going to tank my time on this post and try to post more than one question.

are things such as these free?
heater
replacement bulbs?
Plastic canopy w/ light? stock.
better bulbs? for stock light? (guessing NO)

can i use an exhisting 10G with LR / LS? (guessing has to be dry first?)

do the tanks have to remain dry until the 15th or can we add rock sand and water heater filters now?

You'd have to use the J&L @ 75%. :) If you buy the used piece of gear (whether in your scenario or not) try and get the seller to hand write a reciept for you for proof of price (as mentioned in ADDENDUM A in the first post).

You can use the tank you have, but you are correct, you have to start dry, and it has to remain dry till the start date. (this give everyone an equal playing field) This isn't to say that you HAVE to have water in it on the start date, if you are DIYer, and spend 3 weeks rigging up some crazy overflow or something and add water one week before the first "checkpoint" (1st FTS must be posted by Nov 15th with water) That's fine too... Just remember you have 6 months (Oct 15/08-Apr15/09) for your tank to grow out.

Items considered "Free":

- Contest Tank (Stock AGA 5.5G or 10G) Free (sump tanks come out of budget)
- building supplies (eggcrate, stand/canopy materials, plumbing, scrap acrylic)
- Sand
- Live Rock
- Water and Salt
- Food
- Supplements
- Accessories less than $15 (mag floats, tongs, thermometers, etc)

This $15 rule is to allow folks to buy the equipment that makes reef keeping enjoyable without having to deduct it from the budget-- things like a thermometer, glass cleaners, hydrometer, etc, etc, etc. Its not designed so you can wheel and deal and cut corners to get stuff under $15. (not implying anyone is going to do that... Just stating.)

In my mind I think your lighting, filtration (depending what you use), and livestock will be the bulk of most people's budgets and that is the goal since those three things all directly influence each other more than the kind of heater you have in there. We want people to get creative and demonstrate their ability to build a beautiful reef on a limited budget.

Things that come out of your budget:
- Lighting, Bulbs, reflectors, ballasts.. etc
- Livestock / Corals
- Filters/Skimmers/Powerheads
- Sump tanks (should you choose to incorporate one)

Do try and keep receipts for proof of prices in the event that winners are questioned about their budget. Also, its not required, but would be nice to include a tally in your tank journals of what you have spent.

An example of what I mean

If you have any questions feel free to ask.. Better to ask now and be safe, than to not ask and risk being DQ'd at the end. (I am trying to follow N-Rs model as best as possible and am constantly reffering to their thread).

Rules question
 

One month to get water in the tank doesn't allow much time for diy on the hardware. Would it be permissible to use other equipment (eg. lights) temporarily that won't be part of the final build?

Thanks,
Nevin

I'm not sure I know what you are asking regarding the lights:question:

I think one month is fair for DIY work... there is some exciting DIY work from the NR version, and I am following their guidelines as they have worked out most of the bugs...


EDIT: Anyone who wants to participate and does not yet see their name on the first post of this thread, please PM me, and let me know which category you want to be in.

Since the tank is free is it cool if I just use some left over glass I have kicking around to make my own?

Are people willing to go higher than 10 gallons? maybe 1 5, 10, 20 or something.


Secondly, there are some bias in the rules. Those who have a lot of extra equipment lying around which can be deducted for 75 percent. There really shouldn't be any reduction in equipment. If people choose to go with used, it should still be valued at new pricing.

another, instead of setting medians for cheap livestock, why not just set a median for ALL livestock. Some people have to pay higher prices than others, depending where they live. So if John Doe can get a 3 head hammer for 20, Jane doe has to pay 50, why not just pic a cheap place like www.liveaquaria.com to use as a price guide for ALL livestock. A place like LA has almost every thing we can find here, so it is pretty complete. This way, everybody can add the same livestock for the exact same price deduction from their budget. Some people might have to to spend 600 bucks for their livestock, but it is valued at 300 while others can spend a dollar fiddy (if they can) on the same livestock from their "sources" and it will be valued as the same. SO saving money might benefit your wallet, but it won't give you any sort of advantage. People that have to pay more can go over their limit, so they can stalk an adequate tank and not be on ma disadvantage. regardless, socking costs will be evenly represented.

Another thing to note is the "freedie" items. Some people own this stuff already. Even though it's not included n the budget, it does make it more costly and difficult for people to compete. Saying this, a person with the freebies might have to spend 300, but a person without it will have to spend 500 plus making a larger economic burden on the people that have to buy the extra items which might force them to skimp on their livestock. Wouldn't it be better to include the freebies in the budget. That way, people can be frugal and increase their budget for livestock if they save mney elsewhere. This will add more financial planning into creating the system.

I guess a perfect example would be live rock. If people can make their rock stretch and save 4 pounds, they have enough extra to spend on livestock. This will make aquascaping more difficult and people talents will have to be exercised.

BTW guys.


Count me in


10 gallon

Items considered "Free":

- Contest Tank (Stock AGA 5.5G or 10G) Free (sump tanks come out of budget)
- building supplies (eggcrate, stand/canopy materials, plumbing, scrap acrylic)
- Sand
- Live Rock
- Water and Salt
- Food
- Supplements
- Accessories less than $15 (mag floats, tongs, thermometers, etc)

1. Tank sizes are not changing. It's going to be close enough to get enough ppl for the two categories as it is, let alone to add a 3rd one.

2. Pricing, Used equipment is discounted at 25% off... which is 75% of the new cost. I personally don't have alot of used gear laying around, so there isn't really any bias in the rules on my part. This rule is in place for people buying used equipment and those who already have it. 25% is a fair discount to take off of used equipment IMO.

As for livestock, I will leave open for discussion for now, and speak with michika as well. :)


****Please remember****
I've done the best I can to alter this contest to fit into our forum here on Canreef, but the fact is that not everyone will be happy with the contest rules as they've been established. If you don't think that you can participate under the established guidelines, then your time and $$ is probably best spent on a tank that you truly will enjoy and keep in the long run.

We need to elaborate on what 'supplements' are; food supplements, or dosing supplements, or both.

Both. :x-mas:

if using supps for coral growth than i feel IMO it should count as part of the 300.

what about things like cyclopeese? i use as fish food on occasion good coral food to though. i guess they would fall under food as its not chemicaly produced as a growth enhancement?

Hmm good point... :neutral:

Do we have to wait until the 15th to fill our tank/cycle. I assume yes we do.

Yup.. Tank must stay dry till the 15th.


I have PM'd Christy to get her to setup a Contest sub-section for all the Contest journals, in the Tank Journal section. You must have a thread with a photo of the stock AGA 5.5G or 10G tank with something in it (pop can, cat, wife, etc) on the entry day, Oct 15 (along with the $20 entry fee), however I can't accept entry fees for a few days while I wait for PP to recognize my bank account information.

and as far as biocubes go, how will the tank and lighting/filter be differenciated in free/budget?


EDIT:
Nevermind


"Stock AGA aquarium"

You said it has to stay dry till the 15th.... does that mean we can start construction on DIY work before then?

Michika's pm box is full. Is there anywhere else we can send the pictures of livestock to be priced?

sorry, my bad. I just emptied it a bit. Send away, or email cscully (a)(t) ualberta.ca

I loved the thread on NR and I am following it. I already have my idea for a tank. Count me in for a 5.5g please

Jason

To clarify my question:

I was just wondering whether I can throw an old PC light on it for a while until I finish building the final light system. Or would I have to deduct the temporary light from my budget?

Thanks,
Nevin

Excellent!! Good to have another 5.5G! :mrgreen: :turn-l:

Ohh ok! yea, that is fine.


BTW: Does this mean you are in? Should I add ur name?

I hope I can build something--looks like fun! Closer to the start date I'll figure out if I have time or not.

Thanks,
Nevin

I don't think this has been brought up but many people live in condos here and as they will tell you, it gets randomly hot inside and tank temperatures can fluctuate (even in December). Are we allowed to run chillers in our tanks in temps get out of control? my chiller cost about 400 dollars, so it is way out of the 300 dollar limit.

In regards to livestock, I am looking at just making a basic list for frags & mini colonies.
If we just set some generalized prices it will probably make the contest simpler in terms of accounting, and hopefully it won't detract from the fun of the contest. So what does everyone think of the proposed type of prices?
REMEMBER THIS ISN'T FINAL!
e.g.
-$5 small colony of regular zoas, under 15 heads
-$10 small colony of special rare zoas, or regular zoos that are 15-50 heads.
-$10 small SPS frag, under 2"
-$15 SPS frag from 2"-5"
-$20 SPS from 5"-15"
-$30 small clam, under 3.5"
-$15 small softie, e.g. leather, xenia
-$15 small LPS, e.g. hammer
- ? specialty items, aussie acans, suncorals, dendros, etc.

Fish and clean up crew prices should probably be taken from J&L, and if the item isn't on their website then maybe take a look at what Live Aquaria is posting for a price.

My problem is going to be with live stock, however since it is based over 6 months, I'm sure I'll be able to have a full tank by then.

These prices look very fair to me. Where would mushrooms and rics fall.

do the set-ups need to be a specific theme?
what are the prizes?
what criteria will the judges use to determine the winner--?

I'd be interested in this price too as I have some baby rics, about the size of a pencil eraser and I also have a small individual mushroom.

I might be in for the 10g.