I am using pre-bottled RO water from a company called Arrowhead that is less than 5 ppm per bottle. I dont think the water is the cause of this. I would try a phosban reactor, but I dont think I have room in my tank for another ugly pump. I have an aquaclear 500 converted into a hang ob back refugium, and I run a bag of rowaphos, a phosphate sponge, and a bag of de-nitrate in there along with my macroalgae and live rock rubble.

I am almost ready to give up on saltwater.

Can't help without more info. Answer the questions I laid out for you in my last post.

Sometimes there ends up being for much waste breaking down in an aquarium that the rocks and sand become loaded with phosphates and nitrates. The only decent way of fixing that problem is to break the tank down, and "cook" the rocks in a dark bin for for several weeks doing waterchanges (using RO and salt obviously) every few days, until phosphates read 0. It may also be neccessary to replace the sandbed with new sand. Since your tank has been like this for a long time, I'm lead to believe this may be your problem.

If your phosphate and nitrate test kits are reading 0 that doesn't mean anything. You have so much hair algae that it is eating all the phos and nitrate out of the water so your test kits won't read it.

Get rid of the hair algae and the cyano will follow.

I do not add any additives to my tank. I do a 15% waterchange every week using instant ocean salt and RO water. Feed hikari mysis shrimp twice a week, presoaked in water. PH: 7.8, ammonia: 0, nitrite: 0, nitrate: 10, phosphate: 0, Salinity: 0.023, temperature: 78 degrees. Photo period is 7 hours actinic, 5.5 hours actinic+daylights. Bulbs are each 36w coralifes, changed in october.

Can you put a T fitting after your return pump ....put a valve on it and then feed your phosban reactor and then back into your sump.....just control your flow with the valve? Do you have room for that?

Without making some changes, it is not going to get better or go away. Try to make the phosban work, it is a cheap fix. My rock was totally covered, I thought no way am I going to get rid of this stuff, and there isnt a "hair" left.

This is almost always a phosphate issue but other things come into play. Ultimately you have a lot of bio load for a small tank and things like this can be difficult to solve. Up the water changes to 2g a week and see what happens.

If you want to use something like Rowaphos you really need a fluidized reactor, you don't get near the effect out of the media in a bag. Is the sponge you are using an HBH cut to fit? If so this is an aluminum based product and not a great idea for tanks with soft corals. The easiest way to deal with phosphate is using a chemical that binds and precipitates it like Blue Life Phosphate Control or Carib Phosbuster.

Making this tricky is the fact that low price phosphate kits are all sucky. You need to use something like a Merc kit to get a good idea what is really going on there as organic phosphate is harder to detect. At minimum make sure that the reagents in the kit you are using are as fresh as possible. I use a cheap one myself but I you need to keep in mind you may not have a good picture from it. Also if the source water the company uses has phosphate in it RO won't remove it. You need a DI resin to get it so don't assume it's good just because it is RO.

Alkalinity also plays a part in this. You said your pH is 7.8 which seems low for a tank with a skimmer. Do you test for this? Try and keep it at the high end of the safe range (200ppm / 7dkh / 4meg/l) hair algae hates that.

Another thing that would help are getting a bit more flow in there. Swap the power sweep for a Korallia 1 or Sieo 620.

I also noticed from your FTS that your open brain isn't showing much polyp extension. If it's usually like this try putting it on the sand, the rock rubbing on the polyp may be bothering it.

A small clownfish and BTA is too much bioload for for a 10g tank? I dont think that is the problem.

The RO water is guaranteed < 5 ppm. It is pre-bottled from the manufacturer, so I'm not too worried about the water supply.

I will try raising my ALK, and see what happens. And I guess I will try to cram a phosban reactor in there.

I dont know if I need to change my flow, the powersweep is rated 160 gph, and the aquaclear 500 on the back produces too much flow that it blows sand around.

Ill put the brain on the sand and see if that helps it as well.

Thanks for the tips.

You have PM.

sorry....I misread something....its a 10 gal tank? I wouldnt worry about the phosban reactor ....I would check your water quality of the water used for your changes...and maybe slightly increase them...maybe not in quantity but in frequency....

As mentioned, RO is good but the resins in DI will eliminate compounds which are suspended in a liquid form. Phosphates were mentioned, silicates are another pottential nutrient for the nucience algae. I've been there and replacing the DI resins made the difference. It's a small system which makes it very unstable! Change your Source water, try a different salt too. Keep it simple and stick to the basics. It's a crappy battle, I think we've all been there.

What brand test kits are you using?

Do you not test for Calcium, alkalinity, and magnesium? These are very important for the health of your corals, and is used by them on a daily basis. Calcium and Alkalinity usually have the be supplemented. Hair algae LOVES low Calcium, Alkalinity, and magnesium. Considering you are using IO salt, and not supplementing, then it is very possible that your Cal/Alk levels are low. Calcium should be 400-425 ppm, and Alkalinity should be 8-10 dkh (err on the high side). Magnesium should be 1350-1400 ppm. Your low pH leads me to believe that your Alk may be low as well (see below).

When you do waterchanges do you siphon off as much detritus from the rocks and sandbed as possible? This can definately help lower the waste in the tank. Hair algae traps detritus in it (which is how it helps itself to grow), and using a turkey baster daily to blow any detritus out of the hair algae may help as well.

When you say you "presoak" your food, do you pour the water off, or do you just soak it in water and dump the whole thing in the tank? I would suggest you feed your fish at least once every second day. Twice a week is pretty tough on a digestive system (smaller fish) that is designed to constantly be eating.

How often do you clean your skimmer? How much skimmate do you get in the cup each week?

That's all I see provided the information you gave.

This is exactly what I was thinking. Low pH is often related (although not necessarily directly) to your Alkalinity level, so your low pH makes me suspect low Alkalinity. 7 dkh is not the high end - that is in fact the low end. Alk should be 6-12 dkh, with 8-10 dkh considered "normal". I keep my Alk as close to 10 dkh as I can. Many people who run ZEOvit keep their Alk in the 12-14 dkh range.

I am using Calgary tap water for my aquariums and here is the water parameters. I have had one bout with hair algae. It seems odd to have a battle with this for so long esp. using RO water. There must be something in your source water...

http://www.calgary.ca/portal/server....Parameters.htm

I believe the kits I am using are salifert. I am not testing for Calcium and Alk right now, I will have to run out and grab those kits. I'll grab some calc/alk additives as well and make sure those are in the correct range.

I do siphon everytime I do a waterchange, and baste the hair a few times daily into my skimmer.

When I presoak my food, I just pinch the frozen mysis in my fingers and run tap water through it to melt it and rinse away gunk from it.

I clean my skimmer every couple weeks, and only get around 1/8 of a cup a week. Seems really low to me.

I did a waterchange last night and ripped out as much hair algae as I could, and when I hooked my skimmer back up it was going crazy. The collection cup would overflow with bubbles in like 30 seconds. I turned it off and tried again this morning and it is still going nuts. Any ideas why it would be doing this?

bump

Clean your skimmer weekly. Make sure you get the neck clean, I find mine skims best about a day or so after a good scrubbing. Being that prolific, I'm thinking your algae may be a bryopsis strain rather than straight hair algae. Could we get some close up shots?

I'll second the boiling RO water suggestion. Just do a small bit at a time.

can you add pump your ro water from one container to another ...and put a UV sterilizer in the flow?

Ya it definately looks like hair algae, but has the bulletproof characteristics of bryopsis. I can try to get some close ups, but my camera really sucks.

What do you mean by boiling RO water a small bit at a time?

The key to basting with boiling water is to get the end of the baster right next to the rock, and squeeze the baster very slowly while doing small circular motions. If it's done right nothing can live through it. Sometimes I push a short piece of 1/2" tubing over the end of the baster to cover a larger area with a slower flow.

I meant baste a small patch of algae at a time. If you try to nuke it all at once you'll run the risk of a mini cycle as I'm willing to bet that at this point the algae is absorbing large amounts of the ammonia produced by the critters.

Awesome! I am interested to hear what your Cal/Alk readings are. Kent Liquid Calcium is very good and easy to use. It is expensive when used on large tanks, but your tank shouldn't go through much, I use it on my 33, and it's cheap. I use SeaChem Reef buffer (not the pH one!!!) for Alk...it's a good product as well. Don't buy any products that directly alter your pH. Even though yours is low the last thing you want is a swinging pH level, and that's exactly what you'll get with pH altering additives.

That is low production of skimmate. You have a Remora Nano right? Does it have an adjustment screw like the regular Remoras and the Remora Pros? If so, play around with it (turned off!! lol it sucks when it's on and you accidentally unscrew it all the way). I find the more I screw mine in the more skimmate it produces. So I have mine screwed in all the way, and then the skimmer cup propped up as high as I can get it. I seem to get the best skimmate this way.

Not sure why it would be going crazy since what you said you did doesn't correlate to it freaking out.

Unfortunately none of the local stores here sell those test kits or additives, so I cannot check until my next trip up to Calgary.

There is an adjustment screw, but it is screwed in as tight as it can go already. I have my collection cup as low as it can go as well. If I put it up any higher it would not collect anything.

On a side note, I tried basting with hot water again, and put the baster right near the root of the hair algae and it did nothing at all. Today the spots I basted are looking alive and healthy as ever.

Also, I have quite a bit of live rock in my fuge and those have never had any algae growth on them. They look perfect. Shouldnt the algae be growing on those rocks mainly? My chaeto doesnt grow very fast either. I have my fuge light on a reverse cycle, so its on around 16 hours a day.

you may just want to run 24hrs on your fuge and dose iron to stimulate your cheato to grow a bit more. then it should out compete some of the hair.

Try adjusting the screw out then...? Make an adjustment and wait a few days to see if does good or bad, then adjust again.

I agree - try 24 hour fuge lighting.

I have been doing 24 fuge lighting and my chaeto is growing like mad, it doubles in size every few days, but the hair algae is not slowing down one bit. I siphoned off a whole bunch after my last water change, but it has all grown back since. I ordered a reef test kit from JL last wednesday and am still waiting for it to arrive so I can test all the other params.

i know how it is, it can over grow everything, when my tank was about 2 months running my hair algae got so bad i couldn't even consider any more corals, so i tried that scalding water in a water bottle procedure, and i did that maybe 3-4 times followed by a couple 20% water changes as albert dao recommended and since then i've been nuisance algae-free for 5 months, no hair,bubble, or plate algae. you might want to try it out- i got it from michikas hair algae thread a couple months ago- :wink: good luck-

If you're getting that kind of growth you are putting way too many nutrients into your system, it's as simple as that. Chaeto won't grow without fertilizer.

I tried boiling water in a pot and then blowing it right into the rock where the hair algae is rooted with a turkey baster and it did nothing at all. Am I doing something wrong?

How am I putting nutrients in? I feed mysis lightly twice a week and use < 2 PPM water for WC's and top ups. I dont understand.

it's the turkey baster likwid, thats what i tried first but with a baster the water is cooled too fast, not too good, then i bought one of those water bottles with a fold down mouth piece and straw, and slowly let it linger over the hair algae, siphoned a bit out, 20% water change, i cut down on meaty feedings like brine shrimp and phytoplankton for about 10 days and thats about it. I wish i could be more help but everyones tanks so different it's hard to say. What really set me off is that my nitrates we're very low at the same time as i had the bloom! mind you i never tested my phosphates and i would not doubt if thy we're high

Hmm, I'm not sure how the water could cool too fast. I boil the water and bring the pot over next to the tank while its still boiling, suck it up with the baster and quickly put it in the tank to baste. Where did you buy that water bottle? Maybe I'll go out and grab one tonight to try that.

just bought it at the dollar store, i just made sure there we're no inverts or corals near by, my hair algae was literally smothering my condy anemone so it was kinda ackward squirting scalding water at the algae, i think if i remember correctly you're supposed to let it linger very slowly over the algae, it was pretty neat as corraline took over the rock right away as soon as i got rid of the GHA

-heres the thread from while back hope it helps
http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/sho...een+hair+algae

Thanks for the link. So you boil the water in a pot, fill up the bottle, and then stick it in your tank and squeeze the water out slowly onto the hair algae?

Yup, that is how it is done.

It didn't work for me unfortunately. In the end it was my urchin that cleaned it up and off the rocks.

What kind of urchin, and will it fit in a 10g tank? I had a Sea Hare for a few days before it got sucked into an intake, but in those 2 days it would just sniff the stuff and not eat any of it. It pooped like crazy though.

ya pretty much, and other obvious things like cutting down on feedings helped me, i think coral feedings were my main contributor

my sailfin tang ate some but definitely not enough to keep the scourge under control

I have a longspine urchin.

Finally got my test kit in. Params are as follows:

Calcium - 300 mg/L
Alk - 11.2 dKH
PH - 8.2
Nitrate - 0
Phostphate - 0
Salinity - 1.021

I picked up a tuxedo urchin on Saturday to help out with my GHA problem. He's about 4" across so they should fit in a 10 gallon. If you get one it may require feeding eventually. Mine leaves a path free of GHA after he passes over. Moves pretty slowly and is going to be a while cleaning up my 24 gal but is doing a great job. As an added bonus I think it's one of the coolest critters in the tank. The urchin has done more cleaning in three days than the rest of my CUC has done in four months.HTH

He seems to be a consumer of coraline also.

Brad

How are my levels? Do I need to increase/decrease any?