This is what I was getting at earlier.

I think the list is a great idea but maybe there needs to be more categories. There could be a Yellow list that is caution for size, a Yellow list that is caution for specific diets, a Yellow list for...well you get the point.

If you are going to say 'Bamboo sharks' and base the entire family on ONE species adult size of 4' then you would have to maybe start to consider adding tangs to the list since Whitemargin Unicornfish grow to over 3'.

I know I am being a little difficult because we are talking about commonly available species here and fish like Whitemargin Unicornfish generally are not that common (although you do see them from time to time) but I think the danger here is generalizing instead of being quite specific. Its only fair.

What about Achilles Tangs? Not the best survival rate...

I vote Achilles Tang in the red list. Their survival rate in captivity is so dismal I swear I will never get one again. I brought 6 back from Hawaii two years ago and as of about 6 months ago, all six have perished.

Sorry GSP I didn't even see your reply before I posted mine. Agree 100% on your points. :)

No need to be sorry man...we seem to be thinking the same things today. :mrgreen:

this is a GREAT thread for someone like me who is just getting into the hobby

~ Mandarin Gobies (rarely eat packaged foods, most will only eat live copepods, most will die from starvation)~ Gorgonian corals (heavy feeders, high long term mortality)[/quote]

Not Gobies. Mandarin Dragonets

A few more for the list
 

Red list fish

Pinnate Batfish- Juveniles are appealing and ornate but the often refuse food and are vulnerable to parasites. and they get big about 20 inches.

Javanese moray- Can grow up to 10 feet.

Napoleon Wrasse- can grow to 7feet and weight 400lbs.

Yellow list

Leopard Wrasse- Difficult to feed need a healthy population of micro inverts.

Signal Goby- Only add to well established tanks.

Orange spotted (longnose) filefish, and blue spotted stingray should be on the red list.

Sea horses and pipefish, purple queen anthias, flagfin angelfish, batfish, leopard wrasse, parrotfish, and boxfish should be on the yellow list.

Great thread and very good idea!

I think we should take the initiative to be responsible reefkeepers, many of the LFS either are not informed enough or don't care. In my earky days I purchased anthias, leopard wrasse and boxfish without sufficient independant investigation and they all died. I also recently lost 3 captive-bred seahorses to disease despite a well-researched, dedicated tank. On the other hand, I have several other fish that are now more than 6 years old. I take the care of my critters very seriously and hate it when they die.

I am sure that together we can develop a good list that will help new-comers and lessen the trade in livestock that should not be for sale.

I applaud this effort.

I noticed some of the species had more detailed reasoning as to why they should not be kept or be kept by experienced reefers. However some are not. I know when I have done my research on fish, I will find info saying generalized reasoning behind not keeping these certain species of fish. Perhaps if others with experience could expand on reasons why from personal experience it might help others. If a species is susceptible to disease, what kind of disease? If a fish typically won't eat perhaps say what was tried for feeding. If a species of fish does not get along with many other fish, perhaps say what fish it was housed with.

Some of us have screwed up along the way, and we all know I have... however if there is info for people that have already impulse bought a fish or was misinformed, and now has a situation, they can maybe help themselves more easily.