I really don't know why those that have never tried LEDs keep posting on the topic. They blurt out all these "facts" that those of us that actually have experience with have to correct. I read or heard this means nothing.

Haha. Yeah. Now I need to spend $2000 on ac to get rid of the chiller ;)

I run a single 250w halide over my tank. While I do have fans. They have yet to turn on. While brad for example still needed his chiller with t5.

I know what your saying with profit margins on led. I recently had comversation with lfs in this. It makes it hard to make money with such small profits.

Reality is. I like halide. I'm sure I will also like led in the future. Other than operating cost. It will take 9 years of bulb replacements to cost the price of a mitras. And after that 9 years I'll buy a 2nd hand mitras for $300. Proven. Look at gen 1 radions

As for operating cost. If we really cared then things like A/C, hot tubs and personal work shops would all half to go. My hottub runs me $70ish a month. Do I use it enough to justify that? Probably not. But I haven't ****ed and moan about that yet

Well when you are paying $1000 for a fixture, you would love to have fancy boxes. One thing that I did notice is that european brands don't pay much attention to boxes while american manufactures put their things in awesome boxes. Tunze pumps vs vortec pumps. Salinity salt box vs H2Ocean salt box; mitra's box vs radion's box. :lol:

Oh don't worry about that...I love debates :smile:

Haha. I was waiting for that

LOL as I said I am tired ;) You win that argument on the heater ;) HOWEVER a chiller can (not always) cost more to run than a heater, so the MH will still cost more based on that.

Bill I haven't posted anything about performance of LED over here. I am talking about cost-benefit and electricity; something that can be judged from the manuals and numbers and doesn't need any sort of experience.

Ditto for me. I was about to buy either the Mitras or the new hybrid t5/led for my new 3ft 50g......but figured for half the price the 2080 will do just fine. Well thats the plan at least. Im fascinated by the 3ft hybrid but not at $1500

Crap I guess My cheap low end radion pros at 915$ times two was the cause I shoulda went high end?

I went back to t5 as well after a long battle with coral long term health switch to t5 was instant results that's hard to ignore Considering the time I spent and the money on different generations

Sps wise I was at my end and constant tweaking of.my system wasn't getting answers

Since the switch back to t5 all is well again ......

Yeah I figured it would be 2000$ minimum for the Mitras or radions. And with a 3 year warranty on the ever grow they must be confident in the product they are putting out.

Also the built in programmer and full spectrum claims really tweaked my interest.

I read a few reviews about the evergrow and all seemed to be happy to downright impressed.

Should also state I'm not going real hard towards sps. A few pieces for sure but mostly lps

I probably should know better than to wade into this debate. But I used to have T5's and now run Radion LEDs, so my experience might be relevant.

I should first mention that I now have two 6' tanks with closed canopies (vented) and covered tanks. Initially I had one tank with T5s. There was a lot of heat produced by these, and the chiller (1/3 HP model, ran for about 8 hours a day, both summer and winter. I am quite sure that even the room was heated up by these during the day. But at night the tank cooled down and the heater would kick in usually about 6 AM and cycle on and off for about 3 hours, until the lights were on for a while.

Then I replaced the T5s with Radions. Shortly after I also added a second 6 foot tank also covered, and with canopies and Radions. I now have two 6 foot tanks running off one sump, so the heater and chiller are for both tanks. What's interesting is that the heater still only runs about 3 hours on and off, same as before when I had one tank with T5s. But my chiller which now has to cool 2 tanks only runs about 3 hours a day, starting just before my LEDs peak for the day.

So, for me, I believe there is a huge power saving. And there is very little heat vented into the room now, from my canopies.