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-   -   400 gallon project (http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=28436)

untamed 11-01-2007 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delphinus (Post 279290)
LOL, this is fun. Can you see the camera move if someone clicks on the directional buttons? I like how you can get into arguments with some unseen person over what to look at. "I'm moving the camera here!" "No! I'm watching something over .. HERE!" "No you're not! We're looking THIS WAY now!" :lol:

Yes, I can see the camera looking around. Sometimes when I've got my arm in there doing something, I can tell that someone has aimed the camera my way.

saltynuts 11-01-2007 02:18 AM

cam
 
i think that would be creepy. some one else watching the house.
happy halloween.



i am watching you!
he he he he he he he he he he he !

Joe Reefer 11-02-2007 01:23 AM

I kinda felt creepy watching you clean your tank.

untamed 11-02-2007 01:35 AM

It's funny..it creeps out the people watching more than me.

untamed 11-18-2007 11:09 PM

Kalk Reactor brought online
 
I've been running this Kalk reactor for a few weeks now. I modified it by adding two ball valves, which enables me to service that pump without draining the whole thing first.
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...n/000_0186.jpg

The pump that is attached to the Kalk reactor is programmed to mix the Kalk for 7 seconds every 2nd day.

Like my Ca Reactor, the Kalk reactor is controlled by the Aquatronica and an Omega peristaltic pump. This pump is smaller than the Ca Reactor pump, because I knew that I can never drive this pump MORE than my evaporation rate. Evaporation will continue to be replaced by the sump float switch and is completely independent of the Kalk reactor.
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...n/000_0187.jpg

I'm bringing the Kalk reactor on-line very slowly. Right now, it runs from 11PM to Noon, but it is only pumping a very small amount of Kalk. As my Ca/Alk demand starts to increase (coral growth), I will increase the amount of Kalk rather than increase the Ca Reactor output. The reason is that I'm trying to use the Kalk to minimize the daily pH swing that the tank goes through.

Each evening, as soon as the lights go out, the tank pH begins to fall. As Kalk has a very high pH, I hope that it will stabilize this fall as I add increase the Kalk output. Here's what the daily pH cycle looks like right now.
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...n/000_0188.jpg

Delphinus 11-18-2007 11:24 PM

7 seconds every 2 days? Just curious but did you read anything to suggest that it should be so infrequent or short? I mix mine for 1/2 hour a couple times a day. :eek: What a profound difference. I use a diaphram metering pump set a rate which is slightly less than evaporation (and just use a float valve for the remaining topup). I found my evaporation rate using trial and error. Kept slowly increasing it every couple of days until I noticed the sump volume increase slightly over a 24 hour period and then backed it off to the last setting before that.

michika 11-18-2007 11:31 PM

I run my stirrer runs every 2 hours for 10 minutes! 7 seconds sounds too little. How do you plan to increase it?

untamed 11-18-2007 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by michika (Post 282170)
I run my stirrer runs every 2 hours for 10 minutes! 7 seconds sounds too little. How do you plan to increase it?

It would be easy to increase the mix time or frequency if I wanted to (via the Aquatronica). 10 minutes every 2 hours seems like way too often to me. As I watched the stir action, 7 seconds was about as long as it took to make milk up to about 2/3 height in the cylinder.

I figure that by keeping it at 7 seconds, a few good things happen:
1) I avoid running Kalk powder through the pump
2) The pump doesn't have time to heat up.
3) The remaining undissolved solids settle to the bottom more quickly, ensuring that I only deliver clear Kalk to the tank.

I figure these will help avoid calcification inside the pump, and possible precipitation at the delivery point in the sump.

The un-answered question is whether the quality of my saturated liquid Kalk diminishes between mixing. I'll watch that. It could be possible that I may need to mix more often as I pump more water through the reactor. Even then, I'll be mixing more often, but not longer each time.

Myka 11-19-2007 01:10 AM

There's 37 pages...where's the link to spy on your tank? :D

Tom R 11-19-2007 03:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myka (Post 282191)
There's 37 pages...where's the link to spy on your tank? :D

Try
http://brads-aquarium.viewnetcam.com:50000/

Tom R

michika 11-19-2007 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by untamed (Post 282174)
I figure that by keeping it at 7 seconds, a few good things happen:
1) I avoid running Kalk powder through the pump
2) The pump doesn't have time to heat up.
3) The remaining undissolved solids settle to the bottom more quickly, ensuring that I only deliver clear Kalk to the tank.

I figure these will help avoid calcification inside the pump, and possible precipitation at the delivery point in the sump.

Sounds like a good basis. Would you post your results? I would love to see if it works out for you, and if if it does I will probably change my settings on my reactor.

Delphinus 11-19-2007 03:57 AM

No kidding! Should be a matter of just testing the pH probably .. if the pH never dips below 11 it's probably just hunky-dory to do it that way.

I've never really noticed calcification inside the pump though on my reactor. But what I do notice is a buildup at the effluent line where it reacts a little with air. Having said that though, I've always felt that the kalk powder is hard on the pump. In my case I just use a MJ600 so I'm not out a lot of capital to replace it every couple of years but still, your reasoning makes me want to rethink my setup a little nonetheless.

7 seconds is awesome. It's hard to find a timer that lets you do less than 1 minute intervals. Chaulk up another advantage to using an aquarium controller...

michika 11-19-2007 04:00 AM

I have a MJ1200, and while I have yet to see any wear on the tank, its an easy, albeit wasteful replacement.

My control will do seconds, but only in 10 second intervals. Still might be worth the change if I can save a pump, and still get the same results.

I also get build up in my top-off line, and sometimes if I stop the top off it takes a bit longer to get the flow going again.

Myka 11-19-2007 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom R (Post 282232)

Thanks! :D Now, time to spy!

Wait a sec...it's not working. Is it turned off sometimes? Do I have to "Login"? All I see is a blue page that says "Panasonic Network Camera", but no screen.

untamed 11-19-2007 07:09 PM

Kalk reactor test..
 
Here are the results of my Kalk reactor testing:

I tested the pH of the fluid in the top of the reactor. For this first reading, it has been almost 48 hours since the last 7 second mix cycle. The entire column is clear liquid except for 1cm of undissolved Kalk on the bottom. pH = 11.59

I then allowed the reactor to mix for 7 seconds. This caused the column to "milk" to a level of about 1/2 way up the reactor. I measured the clear liquid at the top of the column again. pH = 11.63

I then allowed the reactor to mix for about 2 minutes. Interestingly, the column of "milk" only reached a height slightly above the pump intake...maybe 2/3 of the total height of the reactor. It seems that no matter how long you run the pump, the topmost part of the reactor will never get cloudy. Again, I measured the liquid at the top of the column. pH = 11.64

My conclusion is that the pH of the liquid being delivered to the tank has not significantly changed even 48 hours after even a 7 second mix. Nor does it significantly change immediately after mixing for several minutes. This actually has made me consider that even 7 seconds every 2 days is more than adequate.

However, the amount of FW that I am pushing through the reactor per day is still very small. It may be possible that pushing MORE FW through the reactor could dilute the clear Kalk between mixing cycles. As I increase the flow through the reactor, I will repeat the experiment.

Delphinus 11-19-2007 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Myka (Post 282289)
Thanks! :D Now, time to spy!

Wait a sec...it's not working. Is it turned off sometimes? Do I have to "Login"? All I see is a blue page that says "Panasonic Network Camera", but no screen.

I forget what page it was exactly, but I think untamed did mention somewhere that there were only so many hours where the camera is online. For starters it's probably not online during nighttime. :)


Quote:

Originally Posted by untamed (Post 282326)
Here are the results of my Kalk reactor testing:

Interesting results. Thanks for checking into it and posting. I think I will be making some adjustments to my kalk reactor setup as a result. I agree that it's possible you may need to adjust the frequency of mixes as the flowrate increases but it certainly seems as if there's no reason to expect to need to increase the mix duration.

The only thing I'm a little uncertain about is when you occasionally need to clean the vessel and put in new kalk for mixing. It seems to me as if at least that first mix may need to be a little longer, but in those cases, you'd be manually turning the pump on and off anyhow so it doesn't actually change anything "procedurally".

Anyhow, very nifty. Cheers!

mark 11-19-2007 07:24 PM

Realize that you are running the Kalk reactor for it's effects on pH in addition to Ca, but since there is a Ca component, have you measured the Ca with the different stirring strategies (or is there a direct collation between ph and Ca).

untamed 11-19-2007 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mark (Post 282329)
Realize that you are running the Kalk reactor for it's effects on pH in addition to Ca, but since there is a Ca component, have you measured the Ca with the different stirring strategies (or is there a direct collation between ph and Ca).

The clear liquid at the top of the reactor is Calcium Hydroxide. An over-simplified way of thinking about this is that the Calcium represents the Calcium part, and the Hydroxide represents the Alkalinity part. So...yes, a measurement of the liquid's pH is representative of Ca and Alkalinity potential of the liquid, in this case.

untamed 11-25-2007 12:21 AM

My skimmer filled up again last night. For some reason, every now and then the skimmer goes nuts and fills the collection cup. Once the cup is full, the skimmer burps and spits, spattering everywhere...including on my touch screen. (one time, it actually told the controller to lock the CO2 supply on. It drove my Ca reactor down to pH of 5.8 before I noticed!)

So, I've had enough. I rigged up a float switch, and connected one of the three skimmer pumps to the Aquatronica contoller. The float switch sits in the skimmer colletion cup, if the fluid in the collection cup rises, it shuts down the skimmer. Should have done that months ago!
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...s/000_0198.jpg

Here's a screen shot of the controller screen. On the right hand side you can see the various inputs including "skimmer level - OK". The skimmer is now assigned to plug "H". The "L" on that plug indicates that this plug is contolled by a level sensor. The blue outline means that the plug is currently "on".
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r...s/000_0199.jpg
That's your Aquatronica lesson for today...

skylord 11-25-2007 12:56 AM

Two questions...is your float valve just floating in the cup and where did you get the float valve?

justinl 11-25-2007 02:05 AM

wow a skimmer that can use a touch screen. that thing is evil :twised:

Skimmerking 11-25-2007 02:32 AM

I know why your skimmer is over flow like that ...........................

ITS A ASM skimmer

BUY A ATI BM 250 GUY:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

untamed 11-25-2007 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skylord (Post 283446)
Two questions...is your float valve just floating in the cup and where did you get the float valve?

It is pretty much just hanging in there. I haven't tested it by filling the skimmer cup yet, but I'm pretty sure it will work. The float is standard Aquatronica equipment. The AQT comes with a float switch in the standard package. I had not been using it until now.

untamed 11-25-2007 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asmodeus (Post 283467)
I know why your skimmer is over flow like that ...........................

ITS A ASM skimmer

BUY A ATI BM 250 GUY:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

It is easy to poke fun at ASM, because they really are built poorly....but this G6 works very well and I would continue to recommend it as high value for the buck. I don't think the boil-overs are related to skimmer design or construction quality, in this case.

Ha..ha..new skimmer...Yes, but I don't think an ATI MB 250 is large enough...plus it won't keep itself clean. I have my eyes on a larger prize...(now, lets hope the CDN $ stays high a bit longer...)

Sebae again 11-25-2007 08:36 PM

I wonder why Asmodeus would buy a prehistoric BM 250 from the 20th century when he could have bought a BM Supermarine. Maybe he saw one on the Antiques Roadshow and is a collector of antiquities. JK.

untamed 11-25-2007 08:44 PM

As soon as there is any info on the Supermarine version, I'll have a look...but I'm pretty sure that neither of those skimmers is for me.

Joe Reefer 11-25-2007 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by untamed (Post 283506)
It is easy to poke fun at ASM, because they really are built poorly....but this G6 works very well and I would continue to recommend it as high value for the buck. I don't think the boil-overs are related to skimmer design or construction quality, in this case.

Ha..ha..new skimmer...Yes, but I don't think an ATI MB 250 is large enough...plus it won't keep itself clean. I have my eyes on a larger prize...(now, lets hope the CDN $ stays high a bit longer...)

Do I smell Deltec?

Skimmerking 11-25-2007 10:14 PM

Prehistoric OMG shame on you.. for saying that. now if you look at my madness on skimmers. I have owned
Turo flotor T 1000
Euro Reef
Beckett
Down Draft
AIR stone
Beckett again
Euro reef again

ATI BM 250 and now IF I have my ways I will have a BUBBLE KING EXTERNAL. once I can duct tape up the wife...

Untamed I'm just bugging ya about your skimmer obvious your skimmer is working for you. imagine having Super fuge's skimmer on your tank.........................

IMO its not the tube its the pump that works in the skimmer and that is why the ASM G5 and 6 are good since they have the Sedras pumps attached to them.........

untamed 11-26-2007 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Reefer (Post 283613)
Do I smell Deltec?

Nope. That's all I'm going to say until I actually have it. It's going to be quite a project to find a way to install this thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by asmodeus (Post 283625)

Untamed I'm just bugging ya about your skimmer obvious your skimmer is working for you. imagine having Super fuge's skimmer on your tank.........................

IMO its not the tube its the pump that works in the skimmer and that is why the ASM G5 and 6 are good since they have the Sedras pumps attached to them.........

I took your comments as you intended. The G6 is doing all I could expect of it, but it is overwhelmed. I have had a few conversations with "Fudge" about his skimmer. I like his philosophy...big pump, big chamber, tall...self cleaning...pretty much describes what I'm thinking about.

Myka 11-26-2007 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by untamed (Post 283659)
I like his philosophy...big pump, big chamber, tall...self cleaning...pretty much describes what I'm thinking about.

Self-cleaning? Say what? This I'd like to hear more about! :)

Delphinus 11-26-2007 04:04 AM

Here Myka, check out these pages: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-11/totm/index.php
http://www.canreef.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=30974
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...hreadid=686757

*Somewhere* in there is some details about his self-squeegee'ing skimmer head, and some videos too IIRC. :)

Also, there are some skimmers which employ a spray head which spray down the skimmer neck in an effort to keep it clean. And, I think there are a couple commercial versions of self-cleaning skimmers (Deltec, I think), although they tend to be pretty high-end things.

untamed 11-30-2007 06:36 AM

Powder Blue died
 
I lost my Powder Blue Tang the other night. I only had him for 1 month. No explanation, but he was reduced to a clean skull less than 24 hours since last seeing him alive. I suppose this means that my clean up crew is very good at what they do!

I liked this fish a lot and expect that I'll try again.

michika 11-30-2007 02:07 PM

I'm really sorry to hear that.

justinl 11-30-2007 03:07 PM

sorry to hear that. it really was a great fish.

untamed 12-02-2007 12:13 AM

Nitrates...
 
While my battle with hair algae is under control, it is very much still there. My one remaining sea hare continues to do a decent job. It could be that this is just where my tank ends up.

In an effort to figure out what is going on, I've purchased a Pinpoint nitrate monitor. $250 later, the official low-range reading on my tank is.... zero ppm

Yes, absolute zero. I then verified the test by diluting the 10ppm calibration fluid 50/50 with aquarium water and got a reading of 5 ppm.

So...what does this mean? I suppose it means that any available nitrate is being used by algae faster than I can detect it. I'm going to theorize that algae needs light to make use of the nitrate. That would suggest that I might be able to detect nitrates in the morning, before the lights come on.

More on this as experimenting continues.

justinl 12-02-2007 01:59 AM

the one remaining sea hare? what happened to the others?

Does photosynthesis actually require the intake of nitrogen? I ask because i dont really know, but i dont think it does... i think. I had always been under the impression that the raw materials for photosynthesis was CO2 and good old H2O. But for all i know nitrogen could be used up in an intermediate step somewhere... regardless, i would definitely be interested in whatever findings you come up with.

untamed 12-02-2007 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by justinl (Post 284992)
the one remaining sea hare? what happened to the others?

Does photosynthesis actually require the intake of nitrogen? I ask because i dont really know, but i dont think it does... i think. I had always been under the impression that the raw materials for photosynthesis was CO2 and good old H2O. But for all i know nitrogen could be used up in an intermediate step somewhere... regardless, i would definitely be interested in whatever findings you come up with.

The hair algae made such a dramatic reduction that I returned one of my two sea hares to the LFS because I was worried it would starve.

As I understand it, photosynthesis reaction does not use Nitrogen directly, but Nitrogen might be involved. The product of the photosynthesis is glucose + Oxygen. My guess is that it is the conversion of that glucose into algae body where the algae absorbs Nitrate and Phosphate.

Nitrogen is a key component of chlorophyll...so the algae has to absorb N in order to make more chlorphyll.

...but what do I know...I just keep fish in a tank!

untamed 12-02-2007 06:09 PM

Nitrate update
 
After a 12 hour darkness period, (Just a normal night, except that I also turned off the refugium lighting) I still test absolute Zero ppm nitrate.

It is interesting...I refuse to believe that my heavily-fed tank, with it's large fish and hair algae...has no measurable nitrate.

Jason McK 12-02-2007 06:57 PM

So are you having increasing hair algea problem? or is it a constant onging issue that stays at about the same level?

What do you currently have in your Fuge for nutrient export?

J

untamed 12-02-2007 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason McK (Post 285071)
So are you having increasing hair algea problem? or is it a constant onging issue that stays at about the same level?

What do you currently have in your Fuge for nutrient export?

J

It is difficult to say for sure if my hair algae is getting better or if it is just stable. It does seem to be manageable now, which it was NOT before the refugium and the sea hares got involved.

The refugium is filled with Chaeto, and has a 3" fine sand bed. It also had some sort of red algae, but that has begun to die back and the chaeto is taking over. The chaeto is growing such that I have to harvest once in about a month. For the size of my system, the refugium is not very large.


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